Which one?

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J

John_S

Über Member
Hi Glasgow44,

I hope that you test ride of the Sonder in the Lake District went well this weekend and buy now you may have already made up your mind and be getting a new bike ordered. :bicycle:^_^

If you’ve not yet made up your mind I thought that I’d mention Shand Cycles because they make some lovely bikes, the Stoater is very nice, and I am guessing will be closer to you but potentially they could be out of budget.

https://www.shandcycles.com

Re: getting to try bikes out that is obviously the ideal and easier with some brands such as the really big brands which will have bikes available in shops all over the country.

However as another option there are now a few smaller brands such as Sonder (I’m guessing this applies to them as well), Fairlight and Temple Cycles who are direct to consumer brands who don’t use the traditional bike shop retailer model but sell direct to the customer so I guess when you buy one it turns up at your house with a couple of final assembly/build bits to finish off such as putting your pedals on.

With Fairlight what I like about them is that they offer two different frame geometry versions of each frame size with both a regular and tall version offered so it’s more likely that you’ll be able to get a frame which fits you per their Fit Form Function proportional geometry if you watch the film on this link.

https://fairlightcycles.com/inside-fairlight/films/?v=79cba1185463

And to help you choose the right size they have a fit calculator on their website (towards the bottom of this page so if you put in your measurements it suggests a frame size to suit you).

https://fairlightcycles.com/faran/faran-tiagra/?v=79cba1185463

However if you wanted a Faran unfortunately you might struggle to get one at the moment because I think that they’re due to launch a version 2 this year and their other bikes the Strael and the Secan are more expensive.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/road.cc/content/review/240016-fairlight-cycles-strael-20?amp

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/road.cc/content/review/248008-fairlight-cycles-secan?amp

This weekend I saw that Off Road cc have got their hands on a Temple Adventure Disc so they might have a review soon.

https://off.road.cc/content/news/te...ries-classic-looks-with-huge-versatility-3200

If you’ve bought a Sonder Camino this weekend I hope that you enjoy it!

John
 
OP
OP
G

Glasgow44

Veteran
John_S said:
Hi Glasgow44,

I hope that you test ride of the Sonder in the Lake District went well this weekend and buy now you may have already made up your mind and be getting a new bike ordered. :bicycle:^_^

If you’ve not yet made up your mind I thought that I’d mention Shand Cycles because they make some lovely bikes, the Stoater is very nice, and I am guessing will be closer to you but potentially they could be out of budget.

https://www.shandcycles.com

Re: getting to try bikes out that is obviously the ideal and easier with some brands such as the really big brands which will have bikes available in shops all over the country.

However as another option there are now a few smaller brands such as Sonder (I’m guessing this applies to them as well), Fairlight and Temple Cycles who are direct to consumer brands who don’t use the traditional bike shop retailer model but sell direct to the customer so I guess when you buy one it turns up at your house with a couple of final assembly/build bits to finish off such as putting your pedals on.

With Fairlight what I like about them is that they offer two different frame geometry versions of each frame size with both a regular and tall version offered so it’s more likely that you’ll be able to get a frame which fits you per their Fit Form Function proportional geometry if you watch the film on this link.

https://fairlightcycles.com/inside-fairlight/films/?v=79cba1185463

And to help you choose the right size they have a fit calculator on their website (towards the bottom of this page so if you put in your measurements it suggests a frame size to suit you).

https://fairlightcycles.com/faran/faran-tiagra/?v=79cba1185463

However if you wanted a Faran unfortunately you might struggle to get one at the moment because I think that they’re due to launch a version 2 this year and their other bikes the Strael and the Secan are more expensive.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/road.cc/content/review/240016-fairlight-cycles-strael-20?amp

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/road.cc/content/review/248008-fairlight-cycles-secan?amp

This weekend I saw that Off Road cc have got their hands on a Temple Adventure Disc so they might have a review soon.

https://off.road.cc/content/news/te...ries-classic-looks-with-huge-versatility-3200

If you’ve bought a Sonder Camino this weekend I hope that you enjoy it!

John
Click to expand...

Hi John

Thanks for your nice words. I didn't get a chance to go to the Lake District and test ride a Sonder Camino. I'm going to count that one out; I just feel its so far away if I have to take back for anything reason (fault, etc). I've had a look at the Shand Cycles website - they are based in Livingston which is much much closer. I'm away this weekend but I'm going to pop in and see them next week.

Will let you know how I get on.

Jason
 
J

John_S

Über Member
Hi Glasgow44,

If I was to give an opinion from the head I would say ride both bikes and see which one you like the most which is probably the best thing to do anyway. I know that you've said you have already given the CdF 30 a test ride and liked it and so if you can also get a test ride on a Stoater then that would be great as a comparison.

However if expressing an opinion just from the heart then I'd have to say that for me the Stoater would win everyday of the week!

The Stoater is a hand-built bike in Scotland from a small independent company which I think is fantastic and it would be great to support them. Apart from that (and not to take anything away from the CdF which is also a nice looking bike in a decent colour) but for me the Stoater is a lovely looking bike in Columbus/Dedacciai steel tubing and it will come in a colour of your choice with more opportunity to customise it if you want/need when compared to the off the peg CdF. Also the opportunity to personalise it with your name or a Saltire, etc. sounds fantastic and a nice little finishing touch to make the bike truly yours and just a little bit special.

In respect of one item on the spec sheet of the Genesis CdF I'll hold my hands up and admit to not knowing much about Jalco rims and so for all I know they might me absolutely fantastic but I just don't know much about them. I think that the Stoater comes with either Hope or Hunt wheels which I'm more familiar with and so I'd be happier with them.

Also when it comes to tyre options and clearance as far as I'm aware from reading the respective websites you're going to have more clearance and options with the Stoater when compared to the CdF. According the the Genesis website it states that the maximum tyre size that the frame will accommodate is 700 x 38c and bear in mind that will reduce if you fit mudguards to the bike. However the Stoater on the other hand (according to the Shand website) has clearance for 700 x 48 tyres plus it will also take 650B wheel/rim/tyre options with the website stating "(650B Road Plus and/or 2” 700c)" so it's got more clearance and therefore much more flexibility and options available to you in terms of wheel and tyre combinations.

You've mentioned that you might be doing some touring with the bike including in Wales and for me there are some good features on the Stoater when it comes to touring. For starters it's got three bottle cage mounts could come in handy. Although for me personally this isn't the be all and end all but if you want to factor in weight the published wight for the CdF 11.48kg whereas the Stoater is lighter at 10.5kg.

If you're touring with the bike (and this might be of no interest to you if you're a much stronger rider than me) especially in places that aren't flat then the gearing on the Stoater also appeals to me versus the CdF. The CdF has a 50-34T chain ring and an 11-32T cassette whereas the Stoater (as standard I think) has a super compact 48-32 chain ring and an 11-32T cassette which is probably a much better choice for most people especially when using the bike loaded as a tourer and going up and down hills. Although if you'd prefer to have a 50-34T chain ring then the fact that the Staoter has customisable build options means that you could spec that if you wanted to.

Added to the above the fact that with the Stoater you'd be buying directly from a bike company, which is hopefully not a million miles away from where you live, would hopefully be handy in the future should you (and hopefully you won't) have any issues with the bike which could be better dealing directly with the manufacturer rather than a retailer as would be the case with buying the Genesis from a bike shop. Also with Shand I'm pretty sure that they would be the type of company that should you a few years down the line you decide that you want to do a rebuild on the bike and make some upgrades you could probably talk to them to take the bike back to them and see if they could help. Although my apologies because I've not based this on fact or knowledge but just a feeling from reading about their company but if it's something potentially of interest during your decision making process then you could always ask them about that. If that is the case then you'd be helping to by a bike which hopefully has a degree of support directly from the manufacturer in the future and so you're helping to an extent to extend the life of this bike as it hopefully gives you many years of happy riding ahead.

My apologies if this comes over as a bit of an unbalanced one sided point of view but for me the Stoater wins hands down in the contest between these two bikes.

That's not to say that the CdF is a bad option by any means and there might be somebody else to follow up with a post with an equally convincing argument as to why to go for the CdF.

Whichever bike you go for I hope that it serves you well and you enjoy it for many years to come on future touring adventures. But at the same time I'm really hoping that you go for the Stoater because to get a bike hand built in Scotland would in my opinion be a bit special!

Good luck making your choice.

John
 
CXRAndy

CXRAndy

Guru
Location
Lincs
Glasgow44 said:
Hi there

I've narrowed down these two steel frame bikes. The first one I can customise for colour and personalise it with my name or a Saltire, etc.

https://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater/

https://www.edinburghbicycle.com/genesis-croix-de-fer-30-2019

What are your thoughts?
Click to expand...

If I was looking at a choice between the two, I would go for the Stoater. Not taking anything from the Genesis bike, both are excellent. The one thing both lack for touring is a triple, but thats just getting picky

I would ask if the Stoater could be equipped with a FSA Aventure crank, you can get 46/30, 48/32 cranks(90mm BCD) and you can swap chainrings. Also ask if the bike will take 11-34 cassette
 
Last edited:
J

John_S

Über Member
Yes as CSRAndy says if using the bike for touring I'd definitely consider the chainset that you spec and whilst the only option on the Genesis CdF unless you ask shop to make a change or do it yourself post purchase is the 50-34T chainring.

Whereas I think that as standard the Stoater comes with a Praxis Alba 48-32T chainring and their website points to the touring credentials stating this:-

"The Praxis super compact chainset option means you can ditch the triple chainrings when in the mountains – and dynamo, lighting and USB charging options keep you visible and connected when off-grid or on the daily commute."​

Also if using for touring, whichever bike I went for, I'd also consider a dynamo hub which can help with charging things when traveling a bit off the beaten track and also just to have the peace of mind of dynamo lighting so it's always there when you need it and if for example a days riding over ran for any reason and it got dark before you reached your destination.

Good luck making up your mind.

John
 
themosquitoking

themosquitoking

Guru
Location
Spain
Personally, after narrowing down a shortlist of bikes that fulfill my requirements i list them in order of sexiness and then test ride them. Last time i bought one i accidently test rode a bike and loved it then found out the latest frame paint job was rather nice so looked no further.
 
OP
OP
G

Glasgow44

Veteran
Hi there

Just an update – I’ve not decided which of the steel bikes to buy if that is indeed one of the bikes I buy. I’ve also still to consider aluminium frame and carbon forks adventure road bikes too but this is a bit easier to decide on. I’m going to the Scottish Cycling, Running and Outdoor Pursuits show this weekend in Glasgow and will have a look there too.

One thing I wanted to ask was: I’m very impressed with the steel frames, albeit they are that bit heavier but more robust I think and a nicer ride. One thing that concerns me though – are they prone to rust?

Thanks in advance for your help.


J
 
vickster

vickster

Legendary Member
Glasgow44 said:
Hi there

Just an update – I’ve not decided which of the steel bikes to buy if that is indeed one of the bikes I buy. I’ve also still to consider aluminium frame and carbon forks adventure road bikes too but this is a bit easier to decide on. I’m going to the Scottish Cycling, Running and Outdoor Pursuits show this weekend in Glasgow and will have a look there too.

One thing I wanted to ask was: I’m very impressed with the steel frames, albeit they are that bit heavier but more robust I think and a nicer ride. One thing that concerns me though – are they prone to rust?

Thanks in advance for your help.


J
Click to expand...
Rust no, unless you plan on keeping it outdoors and doing no maintenance
My Genesis is 5 years old, gets ridden in rain, done 5.5k Miles, no rust
 
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