Why is my average speed so low?

[Dogtrousers]

Also, you could reappraise what the point is of measuring average speed. You could divide your cycling by time (today I cycled for X hours) or distance (today I did Y miles or km). Personally, I'm more concerned with distance. Average speed is only an issue for me personally if I can't fit the distance I want to ride into the time available. When that happens, I just have to allot more time and get up earlier, or not ride as far, or choose a flatter route, or some combination of these. The only other reason (for me) to worry about average speed is the cut-off times of events that I may want to enter. Audaxes tend to be quite generous in this respect, and more welcoming to the dallying rider. Sportives, less so (which is why we had problems when Velothon Wales upped the published minimum speed requirements last year).

 

[Ajax Bay]

The high levels of activity on this thread are impressive: well done the OP, even if many focused on your weight, weight of your Dawes, the philosphy of cycling, your fitness (or path thereto), the hilliness of Pembrokeshire. The OP has reiterated:

To reiterate; this isn't a question about how I can improve my average speeds, but to ask if other people find their averages knocked back by hills as much as I do. The answer seems to be pretty much in the affirmative, so thank you all for confirming and reassuring. I thought losing perhaps 6 mph to the terrain was unusual, but obviously not.

This is a derivative of the OP's enquiry. Taking a lateral step, for tour planning then, what allowance is it sensible to make for the amount of climbing/descent on a day's ride? I have wanted to do this to inform where to end each day on a mult-day tour.

For example if a LEJOG route is 1600km and the height gain/loss is circa 16000m and you want to break it into 'equal days. Doing it in 10 days divided purely on distance gives you 160km a day. But Day 1 has 2000m of climb. Stripping out the many other aspects (eg road type, quality of surface, conurbation concentration, expected prevailing wind) Is 150km + 2000m of climb going to be 'harder' than 180km and 1000m (eg Day 4)?

Or more simply, when deciding whether to go over or round a group of hills or spur, what is 100m of climb worth, in terms of the length of detour required? Walking has Naismith's Rule but I have been unable to find a persuasive equivalent for cycling planning. @Globalti asked something similar 30 months ago with no decent answer: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/sort-of-equivalent-to-naismiths-rule-for-bikes.137044/
In another thread at: http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/hills-how-bad.62439/ @hubbike suggested a x8 rule but @andym doubted that (and I think it's too low too).

As a guestimate I have used a x25 rule before: for me 7.5km with 100m climb will take about the same time as 10km on the flat ((5km@30kph + 2.5km@15kph) v (10km@30kph)). But does this weight hills/climbing/descending too much? The fitter, faster and/or 'supported' cyclist will be less affected by the 'hilliness' of a ride and the laden tourer, but what is the range (of climb multiplyer) for planning purposes?

 

[totallyfixed]

When planning a tour our daily distances are nearly always of a similar length, I allow for anything up to 8hrs of riding, this would include hilly /getting lost / puncture, headwinds etc. It is really just common sense and subjective according to your capabilities, hills slow some more than others as you have intimated. Looking back at our diaries for similar distances over flat v hilly [in this case 80 miles], it took us about the same time, the reason for this is we just pushed a bit harder knowing the terrain that lay ahead.
I think [like a lot of cyclists do] you can over complicate things, the way to plan is to think of all the worst things that could happen in a days ride, throw in a few hills and a head wind then work out how far you could ride in those conditions, everything else is then a bonus.
Why does the text have a line through it?

Mod edit: lines through text removed for you.

 

[Dogtrousers]

As a guestimate I have used a x25 rule before: for me 7.5km with 100m climb will take about the same time as 10km on the flat ((5km@30kph + 2.5km@15kph) v (10km@30kph)). But does this weight hills/climbing/descending too much? The fitter, faster and/or 'supported' cyclist will be less affected by the 'hilliness' of a ride and the laden tourer, but what is the range (of climb multiplyer) for planning purposes?

I once tried to do something like this using my own ride data. I gave up. The external factors were too great and the effect of hills was just one factor in amongst a load of other noise.

 

[RichardB]

Why does the text have a line through it?

Have you put a lower-case 's' in square brackets anywhere? That would activate strikethrough in HTML.

 

[RichardB]

there are plenty of lumps and drags (mind you if your route includes New Gale to Penycwm )

To be blunt, I haven't tried Penycwm on a bicycle, ever. I used to love it on the motorbike, better going up than down.

Also, you could reappraise what the point is of measuring average speed.

That's a good point. Partly I am a bit of a maths geek, and while away long car journeys calculating mpg, ETA etc in my head, and averages interest me, especially if they move. So the average speed function on the little computer interests me more than the max speed, for example. Partly I am using average speed as a measure of general fitness, and now I think about it, it's not really appropriate. My average hasn't changed much in six months, but the length of time and distance I can ride at that speed have increased, and the level of knackeration less at the end of it. It's not a 'fitness programme', though - just riding more and getting better at it.

 

[Smokin Joe]

To be blunt, I haven't tried Penycwm on a bicycle, ever. I used to love it on the motorbike, better going up than down.

If you want a real leg breaker try the climb from Llanychaer up to the A487 just north of Fishguard. 25% with a couple of hairpins to make it interesting. Going up is tough, descending is terrifying as you approach the corners with the brakes full on and the bike refusing to slow.

 

[Citius]

If you want a real leg breaker try the climb from Llanychaer up to the A487 just north of Fishguard. 25% with a couple of hairpins to make it interesting. Going up is tough, descending is terrifying as you approach the corners with the brakes full on and the bike refusing to slow.

Is that the Bessie's climb, Joe?

 

[RichardB]

If you want a real leg breaker try the climb from Llanychaer up to the A487 just north of Fishguard. 25% with a couple of hairpins to make it interesting. Going up is tough, descending is terrifying as you approach the corners with the brakes full on and the bike refusing to slow.

Llanychaer to Lower Fishguard isn't too bad. But the climb out of Fishguard on the A487 is bad enough in a car - a really tough hill and one I will leave until I am very much fitter. Mind you, there is a little layby at the top where someone was serving fabulous ice-cream a couple of years ago.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Is that the Bessie's climb, Joe?

No, that runs off the Gwuan Valley. I've been along the Gwuan many a time but never plucked up the nerve to try that one.

 

[RichardB]

No, that runs off the Gwuan Valley. I've been along the Gwuan many a time but never plucked up the nerve to try that one.

Post the grid ref, and I'll go and check it out.

In the car.

 

[Citius]

Post the grid ref, and I'll go and check it out.

Look for Pontfaen and Cwm Gwaun off the B4313 - the climb is up Ffordd Bedd Morris - on the map just look for a road with two zig-zag hairpins at the bottom...

 

[RichardB]

Look for Pontfaen and Cwm Gwaun off the B4313 - the climb is up Ffordd Bedd Morris - on the map just look for a road with two zig-zag hairpins at the bottom...

That's a serious bit of road. I've walked a lot round there, but ...

 

[Citius]

That's a serious bit of road. I've walked a lot round there, but ...

I've been up the hill once, or maybe twice - it's not pleasant. Nice views at the top though...

 

[RichardB]

I've been up the hill once, or maybe twice - it's not pleasant. Nice views at the top though...

It's a lovely area, very lonely and wild. One of my proudest moments was walking on Carn Ingli one November when the fog came down, a real pea-souper. I navigated back to the car (parked close to the Bedd Morris stone) by compass and dead reckoning, and when I reached the road the car was 20 ft away.