Zwift Chat

[alex_cycles]

I prefer Sauce draft number.

Zwift's draft indicates when you're in the draft thats it.

His analysis of draft I think is incorrect. The faster you're travelling the greater the draft benefit hence a higher number .

This tells me (correct me if wrong) the Watts Im saving compared to me riding on the front trying to maintain the same speed

Correct, but it shows the additional Watts you would need to push to go at current speed alone on the flat.
Which is why the numbers look so silly on downhills. I've seen situations where I'm pushing 150 on a downhill and seeing 300-400 in the draft indicator. If I was to push those extra 400 I'd be way off the front of the pack.

 

[alex_cycles]

What I suspect the new indicator bar is telling you is effectively where you are in that cone - i.e if you are well positioned in the red you will have a full bar, but if off to the side for example it will show less draft. As you can see from the images, you would still get a red section of draft behind just one rider if you're well positioned, so you'd still potentially get a full blue bar on screen. This is what appears to be happening in the video.

Yep - that's my take on it. It shows you if you are getting all the available draft at this point in time.
I also prefer to see a number, but I guess I'm gonna get both now, wanted or not

 

[bridgy]

Yep - that's my take on it. It shows you if you are getting all the available draft at this point in time.
I also prefer to see a number, but I guess I'm gonna get both now, wanted or not

Yeah I think I'll have to live with it a bit and see how useful I find the Zwift graphic and whether that's all I need/want. I currently use the Pedal Games draft indicator which also show watt savings (I'm assuming they're using the same numbers picked up by Sauce)

There does seem to be some use for showing a watt saving number (even if it's not 100% accurate) because it clearly shows when you go uphill and slow down that your watt savings also go down (even if you're in maximum available draft) and that you therefore have to more closely match the rider(s) in front of you to stay with them

 

[alex_cycles]

Yeah I think I'll have to live with it a bit and see how useful I find the Zwift graphic and whether that's all I need/want. I currently use the Pedal Games draft indicator which also show watt savings (I'm assuming they're using the same numbers picked up by Sauce)

There does seem to be some use for showing a watt saving number (even if it's not 100% accurate) because it clearly shows when you go uphill and slow down that your watt savings also go down (even if you're in maximum available draft) and that you therefore have to more closely match the rider(s) in front of you to stay with them

I never really look at it while racing anyway. I know I need to be 2-3 rows back from the front (or more) and directly behind people where possible.
Being on the front in the final 10-20 metres is ideal though
The main problem with Sauce numbers is that sometimes they are bang up-to-date and sometimes they lag up to a couple of seconds. It depends on the feed. Sauce gets its data stream by pretending to be Companion App and "fan viewing" you. So if there is a lag there, your data will be "behind". I don't know how pedal games does it but it must be similar.

I really mainly display draft on screen for the video feed and post mortem afterwards. There isn't a lot of tactical data processing going on in my head when racing

 

[N0bodyOfTheGoat]

Thanks.

Hmmm, Cadex TT or Aethos?

Optimum bike choice for Zwift KOM will depend on upgrade levels for your frames, plus for you lighter/stronger riders, your average speed.

For me, stage 4 Dogma F '24 is predicted to be 0.12secs quicker than my stage 2 Aethos, both with 353NSW wheels (I don't have the Enve 4.5 Pros).
Plus my speed will be slower at 92Kg, I'm predicted ~3mins15secs for the KOM segment.
In Sept '22, when I was 80Kg, I did this KOM in 2mins24secs, which I expect some of you will smash on Friday.

https://zwifterbikes.web.app/route/zwift-kom

I think the no draft race isn't just looking at the KOM segment on Friday, so that flat section from pens to the KOM start could be significant to finish positions for some of you.

 

[alex_cycles]

Optimum bike choice for Zwift KOM will depend on upgrade levels for your frames, plus for you lighter/stronger riders, your average speed.

For me, stage 4 Dogma F '24 is predicted to be 0.12secs quicker than my stage 2 Aethos, both with 353NSW wheels (I don't have the Enve 4.5 Pros).
Plus my speed will be slower at 92Kg, I'm predicted ~3mins15secs for the KOM segment.
In Sept '22, when I was 80Kg, I did this KOM in 2mins24secs, which I expect some of you will smash on Friday.

https://zwifterbikes.web.app/route/zwift-kom

I think the no draft race isn't just looking at the KOM segment on Friday, so that flat section from pens to the KOM start could be significant to finish positions for some of you.

Yep it starts at the pier so it really should be about 2 minutes to the climb then about 2 minutes on the climb. Then it finishes about 100m after the KoM banner at exactly 2.0km

My PR on the KoM is 1:53 but that was in an all cats drafting race not quite keeping up with the As to try and get away from the Cs. I think it's going to be a shade over 2 minutes on a TT bike at current fitness level.

 

[Whorty]

I prefer Sauce draft number.

Zwift's draft indicates when you're in the draft thats it.

His analysis of draft I think is incorrect. The faster you're travelling the greater the draft benefit hence a higher number .

This tells me (correct me if wrong) the Watts Im saving compared to me riding on the front trying to maintain the same speed

Edit: just seen that Alex and Paul have basically said the same as below, so may not want to waste your time reading lol

From what (excuse the pun) I saw on Eric's video I think the watt savings number is very flawed. What (sorry again!) it seems to show is the watt 'savings' for that given speed 'if' you were on the flat.

You can see on the downhill when he's hitting 70kph it's suggesting he's saving 700+watts which clearly isn't correct ... but if he were going at 70kph on the flat then yes it's quite feasible he'd need an extra 700+ watts

Personally I prefer the new Zwift indicator because (referring back to Paul's cone image) it's showing me if I'm in the draft and the relative effect of the draft (i.e. am I in the red zone, or out to the side).

It really helped me in the race last night to see when I was outside of the draft and I could adjust my own power accordingly (I don't have steering to steer back into the draft).

It's a thumbs up from me

 

[bridgy]

Edit: just seen that Alex and Paul have basically said the same as below, so may not want to waste your time reading lol

From what (excuse the pun) I saw on Eric's video I think the watt savings number is very flawed. What (sorry again!) it seems to show is the watt 'savings' for that given speed 'if' you were on the flat.

You can see on the downhill when he's hitting 70kph it's suggesting he's saving 700+watts which clearly isn't correct ... but if he were going at 70kph on the flat then yes it's quite feasible he'd need an extra 700+ watts

Personally I prefer the new Zwift indicator because (referring back to Paul's cone image) it's showing me if I'm in the draft and the relative effect of the draft (i.e. am I in the red zone, or out to the side).

It really helped me in the race last night to see when I was outside of the draft and I could adjust my own power accordingly (I don't have steering to steer back into the draft).

It's a thumbs up from me

It's definitely better than no draft indicator at all!

 

[Norry1]

I think I might go Cadex with the enve wheels rather than the discs. The climb part is going to be ~2 minutes, so half the race.
It's a difficult one to call, but climbing bikes aren't usually recommended for short climbs. Then again, no draft AND 50% of the race.
My gut says Cadex + ENVE.

ENVE 4.5?

 

[alex_cycles]

ENVE 4.5?

Yep. I think those are the best Climby Aero wheels around. There is a DT Swiss set with similar stats.