Zwift Chat

[Joffey]

Thing is, I'm not holding back in any race and you can see that from my heart rate that is over 190. I can sprint at over 10 w/kg early in a race but not at the final sprint. Climbs are different though as it's holding that tempo power that seems easier .... most races though are flat/rolling where I can't get into B numbers hence why I'm still C.

When I get promoted, I'll go to B. But I'm not doing it just because some people think I should or accuse me of holding back when I'm not. Now can we drop this as I'm doing feck all wrong.

I concur with Carl here having been in the similar position earlier this year. I was a top end C and was finishing in the Top 5 of the ZRL races. The problem is the courses and them being races. We all give our all in the races and don't hold back but the natural ebb and flow of the race makes it hard to make that final step up. It's not for want of trying.

What is hard though is the thought that it's somehow cheating - it's just how the system works. I've been on Discord with Carl after the races and can tell you he's trying his hardest - we hear the asthma attacks after the race and how he can't breathe after climbs.

Carl is an honest bloke - he's busting a gut in his races. Eventually the system will bump him up if he improves ever so slightly or if the courses (like a critical or TT) mean that his 20 min power is an all out effort but it's for the system to do that.

Anyway, not looking for an argument or anything, just adding my thoughts having been in the same situation myself.

Cheers all.

(Edit - no one on here is accusing him of cheating, I just mean other teams might think it is, but I don't think it isn't - and this isn't a reaction to anyones comments to Carl - I was just expressing my thoughts having been in the same position myself. Anyway, ramble over and no more on it from me!)

 

[Joffey]

Set it up like a bike that fits you and is comfortable.

1) Mark a point 120mm from the back of the saddle, on each bike
2) From that point measure down to the centre of the cranks on the "Old" bike and transfer that to the "new" bike (saddle height)
3) From the 120mm point measure to the centre of the handlebars, and transfer that to the "new" bike (Reach)
4) Place a spirit level horizontally from the saddle and measure down at 90 degrees to the top of the handlebars at the stem. Transfer to the new bike (Drop)

Now assuming that the set back of the new bike, the Q-Factor and Crank Lengths are the same or pretty similar, you new bike should have a pretty comfortable feel ... it's often a case of adjusting within + or - 5mm from those transferred markers for me.

I will have another go this weekend. I keep trying but I just can't get it right

 

[mjd1988]

Sounds perfect

One lap sounds like enough for me as well. Doubt I'll reel in a TT specialist but sure!

Are we all setting off beside each other from the gun then?

 

[<Tommy>]

To be fair I think Lee was just trying to give some advice. we are on a public forum after all no? It’s fairly obvious when someone is on the boundary of two cats. It’s obviously up to Carl what he wants to do at that point. And he makes some very compelling points in his reasoning. It’s all fair enough really isn’t it.

And the beauty of our races is no cat boundaries. And the last few weeks have been a great exhibition really haven’t they!

(I think I just broke my own record for number of typos in a single post!)

 

[<Tommy>]

Anyone racing on Saturday?

 

[IrishAl]

Different opinions on the TT stage and all valid... How about we find some kind of middle ground?

How about we set up a ~20 min. stage as @Legs suggests BUT for the purposes of the GC we extrapolate the results by multiplying the time by three?

I think we are trying to solve the same problem they have at the TdF where it’s only ever going to be a rider who can climb winning the GC. With the big spread of abilities on here and the relatively small numbers it means a lot of the races will end up with riders in ones and twos. For the next series I would be in favour of a points based system in tandem with the GC time based system, and I would throw in a hare and hounds style stage with an arbitrary head start for the lower cat rider. By arbitrary I mean not getting too scientific about trying to time the gap to perfection - just enough of a head start to make it worth fighting to stay away.

 

[<Tommy>]

I think we are trying to solve the same problem they have at the TdF where it’s only ever going to be a rider who can climb winning the GC. With the big spread of abilities on here and the relatively small numbers it means a lot of the races will end up with riders in ones and twos. For the next series I would be in favour of a points based system in tandem with the GC time based system, and I would throw in a hare and hounds style stage with an arbitrary head start for the lower cat rider. By arbitrary I mean not getting too scientific about trying to time the gap to perfection - just enough of a head start to make it worth fighting to stay away.

I think you’re right, you’ll never please everyone completely. It’s kind of why I always recommend people focusing on the people around them. We could try and incorporate a points system though. Might find the points end up going to the same people as the gc placings though 🤷‍♂️

That last bit though… I don’t think I can stomach another hare and hounds mate. It got silly last time with the arguments and I just don’t think it’s worth it. Personally it left a bit of sour bad taste in my mouth. I genuinely think it’s better to avoid using a cat system. It’s such a flawed system.

 

[<Tommy>]

I have a suggestion regarding the course choices

@bridgy picks them all at the start of the league and that’s job done. So long as you don’t mind of course mate.

In my experience you always pick a good variety, often to your own detriment too. Maybe set out parameters as to how many of each type of course in each league.

 

[berty bassett]

we are all different abilities and if we all stay different abilities then it will always be a fight with the nearest person to you
only way round that is either time or weight handicaps both seem a lot of work for someone
all for keeping it simple and fun - i have my own nemesis's and everyone has theirs
maybe if people try a rgt race ? all cats start together on a smaller scale
the calculations are different on there somehow , i dont have quite as much advantage going up and the larger people dont have as much going down , there is breaking going round corners both down and on flat so more realistic feel that you have to power out of corners to keep up
its not perfect by a long shot but worth looking at as getting better all the time

 

[Joffey]

I think we are trying to solve the same problem they have at the TdF where it’s only ever going to be a rider who can climb winning the GC. With the big spread of abilities on here and the relatively small numbers it means a lot of the races will end up with riders in ones and twos. For the next series I would be in favour of a points based system in tandem with the GC time based system, and I would throw in a hare and hounds style stage with an arbitrary head start for the lower cat rider. By arbitrary I mean not getting too scientific about trying to time the gap to perfection - just enough of a head start to make it worth fighting to stay away.

Might an easy way to sort the hair and hounds time gap is to have a prologue as Stage 1? Maybe a 10 mile TT and then use any time gaps there for a H&H time gap?

I agree with what's been said though. I don't know what's up with us, we are being far too sensible recently


Oh, maybe we could have a stage on each Zwift world?

 

[<Tommy>]

Might an easy way to sort the hair and hounds time gap is…

It seems some people around here have short memories! 😄

 

[bridgy]

One lap sounds like enough for me as well. Doubt I'll reel in a TT specialist but sure!

Are we all setting off beside each other from the gun then?

Yeah I think that makes sense for the TT because the issues with start/finish points that cause problems in Meetup races won't matter for a TT. So just everyon on TT bikes and all go from the gun (no lead in)

 

[bridgy]

Invites for next Wednesday's ITT have gone. Remember, TT BIKES ONLY.

(It'll be obvious if anyone's drafting on a non TT bike. If they are, send a message and they'll have to stop and change bike or obviously their result won't count. If they're not on a TT bike and aren't drafting they're at a disadvantage anyway so that's their problem! BUT we're all intelligent grown-ups - no one's going to forget are they.... )

 

[Joffey]

Invites for next Wednesday's ITT have gone. Remember, TT BIKES ONLY.

(It'll be obvious if anyone's drafting on a non TT bike. If they are, send a message and they'll have to stop and change bike or obviously their result won't count. If they're not on a TT bike and aren't drafting they're at a disadvantage anyway so that's their problem! BUT we're all intelligent grown-ups - no one's going to forget are they.... )

The titty (or is that TT) police will be out 🚓👮‍♂️🚔👮‍♀️🚨

 

[bridgy]

Stage 4 ITT route details (Neokyo All-Nighter) - https://zwiftinsider.com/route/neokyo-all-nighter/