Disc brakes to be allowed for pro teams - test period

[smutchin]

So if the UCI did away with a minimum weight limit - do you think teams would drops discs in order to create a superlightweight bike?

Given that the main driver for the adoption of new bike technology is nearly always the industry rather than the racers... what do you think?

 

[Milkfloat]

Well we already have bikes lighter than UCI limits, so I guess at some point theses limits will be reduced to match reality. If it is lowered by say 500g then I see discs here to stay, but if there is no lower limit then personally I could see teams forgoing discs to get the lightest bike they can with none of the problems that wheel changes during a race bring.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

i dont see why people think discs are heavier - trp spyres are 159grammes - 105 calipers are 162 grammes so a few gramme savings

yes there are discs to add to that weight but its around 80 grammes.......lighter wheels would negate that easily

+ small changes to the hub 6bolt/CL and minus weight of brake tracks. Even with a disc the savings aren't small

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

none of the problems that wheel changes during a race bring.

What problems?

 

[Milkfloat]

As mentioned already I think - neutral compatibility and disc rub/alignment.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

As mentioned already I think - neutral compatibility and disc rub/alignment.

Disc brakes self adjust, I change wheels often enough without any further adjustment.

Neutral compatibility is only an issue while no set standard exists - it will come before 2017 rollout. I would be very surprised if it wasn't a through axle standard over QR across the board.

 

[Milkfloat]

Disc brakes self adjust, I change wheels often enough without any further adjustment.

Neutral compatibility is only an issue while no set standard exists - it will come before 2017 rollout

I only have discs on my MTB but I have to reset caliper positions with a wheel change. OK, a sample of one and not a road bike, but you think there really is no issue?

You are very optimistic on a single standard, I would be very surprised - they cannot even agree on axles at the moment and it's only a few months away before 2017 bikes are finalized.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

I only have discs on my MTB but I have to reset caliper positions with a wheel change. OK, a sample of one and not a road bike, but you think there really is no issue?

You are very optimistic on a single standard, I would be very surprised - they cannot even agree on axles at the moment and it's only a few months away before 2017 bikes are finalized.

I do think there is no issue with disc brakes themselves. The problem as rightly pointed out is neutral servicing which simply cannot support wheels for 3 4 5 6 however many designs of wheel fixing that exist for races of 200 riders. If my mental maths is correct there are 4 current axle standards**** (QR 12mm 15mm and FOCUS R.A.T system which is technically 15mm)

****Which for many wheels is just a matter of swapping a cap on the hub, mostly a tool-free job but no guarantee..

 

[smutchin]

Well we already have bikes lighter than UCI limits, so I guess at some point theses limits will be reduced to match reality. If it is lowered by say 500g then I see discs here to stay, but if there is no lower limit then personally I could see teams forgoing discs to get the lightest bike they can with none of the problems that wheel changes during a race bring.

Dave Brailsford: Yo, Barry Pinarello, send us a load of Dogmas for the team, would ya?
Barry Pinarello: Sure Dave, we'll ship out a bunch of the ace new disc brake version right away.
Dave Brailsford: Hmmm, thanks, Baz, but the lads reckon them newfangled contraptions are a bit OTT for racing - and heavy too.
Barry Pinarello: Point taken, Dave, but we're really keen to start selling more of the disc version so this is the model we're supplying.
Dave Brailsford: Come on, Barry, I have to put the needs of my boys first. Help a brother out.
Barry Pinarello: Out of my hands, Dave - our marketing guys would kill me. It's bad enough having the fellas from accounts constantly bending my ear about marginal gains...

 

[Milkfloat]

Add to that different rotor sizes and it gets very complicated indeed.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

Add to that different rotor sizes and it gets very complicated indeed.

A race lost due to shimano/mavic/zipp service only having 180mm fronts with R.A.T and you're on 160mm with QR's

Just won't work

 

[oldroadman]

Anything that slows wheel changes, one standard or not, will be a massive downside for a team. With a rear change allowing for slowing and restarting about 40-50 seconds is lost. Start messing about with other systems, a change takes longer, longer chase back, more tailgating, more people off the back riding back on, lets hope that it all settles down. For me, the whole thing is simple, like many "improvements", it's simply a matter of someone deciding they need to sell stuff. Not a good sporting reason to change anything. As for the weight limit, it could drop to 6.5kg easily without loss of durability, I guess. Then I have seen some of these sub 5kg bikes and there are some quite frail looking components, so I think a slow and steady approach is best. the biggest weight saver being carbon frames and accessories.

 

[Citius]

Anything that slows wheel changes, one standard or not, will be a massive downside for a team

Not if the same issue applies to every team though - then it becomes the same for everyone. If everyone is on disks with a standard rotor size and a standard axle size, then everyone is in the same boat. So what if wheel changes become slower? - the important thing from a competition aspect is that they become slower for everyone, so nobody has an advantage.

 

[lyn1]

Not if the same issue applies to every team though - then it becomes the same for everyone. If everyone is on disks with a standard rotor size and a standard axle size, then everyone is in the same boat. So what if wheel changes become slower? - the important thing from a competition aspect is that they become slower for everyone, so nobody has an advantage.

Depends how much slower. If they get too long they change the race dynamic. Depending on the point in the race and Comms attitudes to the use of team cars, it can be difficult to get back to where you were after a puncture. Longer changes would just make it more likely that a puncture would effectively take someone out of the race.

 

[Citius]

Depends how much slower. If they get too long they change the race dynamic. Depending on the point in the race and Comms attitudes to the use of team cars, it can be difficult to get back to where you were after a puncture. Longer changes would just make it more likely that a puncture would effectively take someone out of the race.

We're talking seconds here - not minutes. The race dynamic would not change any more than it would if the mechanic had fcked up a wheel change on calipers. Just ask CadelEvans in the 2009 Vuelta....