2017 Ashes - Spoilers only

[nickyboy]

Now we're on with proper cricket rather than that 5 day pantomime, I'm back in the thread

Serious question....how has the management of the ODI squad managed to engender a winning mentality whereas the management of the Test squad has only managed to engender a "try not to lose" mentality? I feel that's at the heart of the differing performances

 

[psmiffy]

Serious question....how has the management of the ODI squad managed to engender a winning mentality whereas the management of the Test squad has only managed to engender a "try not to lose" mentality? I feel that's at the heart of the differing performances

Rubbish question - This is the same test team that won back to back series at home over the summer - The Aussies at home on their own pitches using their own ball were just too good

Im waiting to see the outcome of the tests against the Kiwis - no push overs at home at the moment

 

[psmiffy]

As an aside - in the final match of SA v India - India have taken one against the head making it a final score of 2-1 - it sounds tho that it was a brutal pitch to bat on and might have gone either way

 

[psmiffy]

Too much circumspection and we'll be back in the bad old days.

yup I agree - but the success of ODI teams is measured on winning major tournaments - England got major crap for being favorites then not winning the last one - what im saying is that sometimes you have to recognise the odds for what they are - maybe do all the swinging against lesser bowlers

 

[nickyboy]

Rubbish question - This is the same test team that won back to back series at home over the summer - The Aussies at home on their own pitches using their own ball were just too good

Im waiting to see the outcome of the tests against the Kiwis - no push overs at home at the moment

Not a rubbish question .... ODI squad are playing away from home, on Australian pitches with Kookaburra ball, and they're winning. Test team doing the same are losing (and losing badly). Are the respective Test and ODI squads so different or is it down to a mental approach? I'm willing to countenance the possibility that the mental state of the Test team away from home v that of the ODI team has something to do with it

 

[philk56]

Nice to come away from an Aussie ground with a win for once . I thought the dropped catches were going to cost us but superb bowling by Tom Curran saw us through. Now to sort out the test team...

 

[tallliman]

I think home conditions play a bigger role as the form of the games gets longer. We mustn't overlook the fact that all white balls are made by kookaburra and don't move much. Red balls are made by 3 manufacturers and each have different characteristics.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

I think home conditions play a bigger role as the form of the games gets longer. We mustn't overlook the fact that all white balls are made by kookaburra and don't move much. Red balls are made by 3 manufacturers and each have different characteristics.

Pure ignorance on my part. I know the Duke and the Kookaburra, is the 3rd an Indian make?

(I really thought England were going to lose this one until the very death. Overall, there was a good balance of bat and ball.)

 

[psmiffy]

Not a rubbish question .... ODI squad are playing away from home, on Australian pitches with Kookaburra ball, and they're winning.

yup - England have won this series well - but to my mind the Aussies haven't taken it very seriously - their selectors have been juggling players - Notwithstanding this the difference between an ODI and a test match is vast - the pressure on batsmen totally different - and the Aussies trio of quicks were able to exploit that pressure - just enough extra pace to make the short stuff effective - personally I think England could have been smarter - "not losing" would have been biggish wins in the early stages

 

[tallliman]

@deptfordmarmoset, the third is readers if memory serves....not used much though.

 

[AndyRM]

Hales has followed Rashid in committing to white ball cricket.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/43127012

Shame really, but it seems that Test cricket is becoming increasingly marginalised.

 

[psmiffy]

it seems that Test cricket is becoming increasingly marginalised.

Is that true tho - Ashes series in Aussie had second highest attendances of all time - tho there is the fact that some players can make a very good living just playing white ball cricket - to my mind fair enough - there will be opportunities for up and coming players but I cannot see the logic in eg Hales just becoming a white ball player - and there must be something I cannot see in Rashid just playing white ball "to develop his game"

In other news England win a T20 - Morgan (80) with a bit of form - Malan another 50 - not enough to get in the final tho

 

[AndyRM]

Is that true tho - Ashes series in Aussie had second highest attendances of all time - tho there is the fact that some players can make a very good living just playing white ball cricket - to my mind fair enough - there will be opportunities for up and coming players but I cannot see the logic in eg Hales just becoming a white ball player - and there must be something I cannot see in Rashid just playing white ball "to develop his game"

In other news England win a T20 - Morgan (80) with a bit of form - Malan another 50 - not enough to get in the final tho

To be honest, I can't really decide. There does seem to be a battle between the long and short forms of the game and decisions like these make me think the short form is winning.

 

[nickyboy]

I wonder if cricket will finally follow rugby union where there are effectively two different forms of the game (15 a side and 7 a side) with no movement between the squads at international level. It does seem to be moving in that direction Test Cricket v T20 with the 50 over game sort of a buffer between the two

 

[Beebo]

Good to see England start where they left off.
All out for 58 with the last man out scoring 33 runs to save them from total humiliation.