Advice about how I pedal please?

[Katherine]

Quoted from Podantics. com.au

• Cycling. "Hot foot" is the term given by a cyclists to describe a number of conditions of the foot - the most common condition being Mortons Neuroma. The heat created from the friction and pressure on the ball of the foot during cycling creates a number of conditions such as neuromas, calluses, metatarsal-phalangeal joint capsulitis, plantar plate irritations and stress reactions or stress fractures in the metatarsal shafts. These conditions together with the increased blood flow during exercise, compressive pressure from tights cleated shoes, and constant pivoting pressures can all add together to create what we know as "hot foot,"Cycling. "Hot foot" is the term given by cyclists to describe a number of conditions of the foot - the most common condition being Mortons Neuroma. The heat created from the friction and pressure on the ball of the foot during cycling creates a number of conditions such as neuromas, calluses, metatarsal-phalangeal joint capsulitis, plantar plate irritations and stress reactions or stress fractures in the metatarsal shafts. These conditions together with the increased blood flow during exercise, compressive pressure from tights cleated shoes, and constant pivoting pressures can all add together to create what we know as "hot foot,"

 

[fossyant]

Tried them on instore and didnt like them for the same reason i dont like M065s , and my boat width feet means the toe box is tight on me in shimano`s

I am tempted by these ....https://www.decathlon.co.uk/xc-500-mtb-shoes-black-id_8500162.html
View attachment 413399

Ive found the M089 is fine as I also bought the MW7 winter boots as they were similar. Always best trying shoes on as all out feet are very different.

 

[Milkfloat]

Before you adjust anything, how about trying the winter boots for a couple of rides to see if it the shoes or not?

 

[Aravis]

@Katherine the pain you're describing does sound very reminiscent of Morton's Neuroma, which I suffer from in my right foot. However, I would find it surprising if you've developed that condition simultaneously in both feet.

In my case I believe it arose from riding too many hours with tightened toestraps in the 1980s. My understanding is that it's a chronic thickening of a nerve between the third and fourth toes. The fact it's in the right foot only is significant - the left foot was much more frequently released from the pressure of the strap. I was an early adopter of the original Look pedals and as far as I can remember they helped at the time.

So the details of my experience are very different to yours, though the symptom is similar.

When I began riding long distances again at the end of 2015, the condition soon reared it's head again. After discussion with a podiatrist, and quite a bit of experimentation, I've found effective ways of managing it and I no longer fear it.

 

[Katherine]

Before you adjust anything, how about trying the winter boots for a couple of rides to see if it the shoes or not?

They're fleece lined! However I did do at least 1 metric century quite happily in them before the weather got too hot and I started wearing the shoes.

 

[Katherine]

@Katherine the pain you're describing does sound very reminiscent of Morton's Neuroma, which I suffer from in my right foot. However, I would find it surprising if you've developed that condition simultaneously in both feet.

In my case I believe it arose from riding too many hours with tightened toestraps in the 1980s. My understanding is that it's a chronic thickening of a nerve between the third and fourth toes. The fact it's in the right foot only is significant - the left foot was much more frequently released from the pressure of the strap. I was an early adopter of the original Look pedals and as far as I can remember they helped at the time.

So the details of my experience are very different to yours, though the symptom is similar.

When I began riding long distances again at the end of 2015, the condition soon reared it's head again. After discussion with a podiatrist, and quite a bit of experimentation, I've found effective ways of managing it and I no longer fear it.

Yes, as soon as I started googling cycling and hot foot I recognised the pain!

It is worse in my right foot, which is the one that not only used to stay in the toe clips and now stays clipped in, but it's also the foot that stays in the downward position when I'm descending fast.
I have been trying to freewheel with the pedals half and half but that's not as efficient for tucking in, head down etc.

 

[Katherine]

Right, I have moved the cleats as far back as they could go and had a quick pootle round the block. The saddle doesn't feel too high and I'm not sure about moving anything else.
I'm leading the club ride to Jodrell Bank tomorrow - 62 miles, so it will be a good test. I'm taking the allen key with me in case.

 

[mangid]

Should post a correction, I went for MX237's which is the mountain bike version, I think it's the same stiff sole and upper, and then has tread attached.

BOA's are a revelation, does push the price of the shoe up I guess, but I seem to get the right fit every time.

 

[Racing roadkill]

Lift your toes inside the shoes every now and again, you’ll be Supinating ( rolling your foot outwards as you lift the heel ) this will be putting pressure on the pinky joint of your foot. Actively try to roll the foot inwards when you can. Every now and again, spend more time pulling your feet up, than pushing them down, to turn the cranks. If you do these bits and bobs, you’ll avoid the ‘super cramps’ you’re experiencing.

 

[Katherine]

I found pedalling more comfortable today, with the cleats moved back but the heat and burning sensation under my toes was very uncomfortable. I took off my shoes and socks at the cafe which was wonderful. I couldn't wait to remove them when I got home. I hung them up in a tree and it's now raining and I don't care!
Next step is to try the insoles.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

What about riding in "normal" non-cycling specific footwear on flat pedals and forgetting about using cleats? I mostly ride bikes in work type boots with strong soles and I never experience any foot pain whatsoever - although admittedly I don't tend to ride much more than 25 miles in one go. I'm also on my feet all day at work in the same sort of footwear which can be for 12 hours or more, and although I might feel tired at the end of the day that's all - no pain. My belief is that using clips/cleats when cycling forces your feet into unnatural positions, whereas when you pedal "free", your feet will naturally gravitate to the most comfortable/efficient position. I won't use them, partly for this reason and partly because I consider riding whilst mechanically clipped to a bike to be dangerous.

 

[pawl]

Are you riding with cleats without any float that keeps your foot in a fixed position.I had problems using fixed cleats both with Shimano and Look.Changed them for cleats with float.

I am referring to road cleats.

 

[Racing roadkill]

I find it makes little difference where I position the cleats, on a long ride, I often have exactly what you describe happen. A partial cure is to use a shoe with a softer upper. I find if I concentrate on what I’m doing with my feet a bit more than usual, I can alleviate the issues. Lift the toes ( you’ll be bunching them up, without realising it ) try to consciously lift your feet on the up stroke, and after a few miles, the cramp / burning will subside.

 

[Crankarm]

Could also be your fueling or lack of and cramping. Also massage your feet with a tennis ball or similar hard ball under your foot. Also massage lower leg muscles calf and soleus and Achilles tendon to increase blood flow and stop scar tissue forming. Don't set cleats too tight. Also keep cadence high and don't push heavy gears which may all contribute to the symptoms you describe. Pedal all around the stroke in an easy motion keeping your knees in close the top tube. Also your saddle maybe too far back or forward so might need to be adjusted. But change one thing at a time.

 

[Milkfloat]

I found pedalling more comfortable today, with the cleats moved back but the heat and burning sensation under my toes was very uncomfortable. I took off my shoes and socks at the cafe which was wonderful. I couldn't wait to remove them when I got home. I hung them up in a tree and it's now raining and I don't care!
Next step is to try the insoles.

Try the winter boots again, just to work out if it is you or the shoes. I know you have done century’s before in them, but if it is your body that has changed then it would be good to work it out.