Another cyclist jailed

Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.

Slick

Guru
Another horrible tale of drug/drink driver killing a cyclist in Manchester, he was sentenced this week..

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...ster-news/gosh-cars-going-fast-young-13856843
Wow, that's disgusting, 8 years is nothing for killing someone.
 

Pale Rider

Legendary Member
Try 112 days
"An 18-year-old student has been jailed after he admitted killing a man during a confrontation in Oxford city centre."

(pushed him off his bicycle and kicked him in retaliation of an earlier incident)

The sentence is four years, reduced by 112 days because he's been curfewed electronically - tagged - on bail.
 

Slick

Guru
Try 4 years.
"An 18-year-old student has been jailed after he admitted killing a man during a confrontation in Oxford city centre."

(pushed him off his bicycle and kicked him in retaliation of an earlier incident)
Yeah, your right, that is worse. Just what do you have to do to get a life sentence for murder now? When did a sorry mate, I didn't mean to kill you become a defence? Crazy.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

smutchin

Cat 6 Racer
Location
The Red Enclave
[QUOTE 5027696, member: 9609"]nor yours[/QUOTE]

If you’re imagining that I’m inclined towards leniency because he’s a cyclist, let me make it clear that I’m not. I just don’t think that a custodial sentence is appropriate in this type of case, where a person has caused injury (serious but not life-threatening) through recklessness and idiocy rather than with malice aforethought.

The guilty verdict is correct, the sentence isn’t. I suppose it comes down to what you think is the purpose of prison. For me, it should never be used as a purely retributive measure. Hence the feelings of the parents are irrelevant.

Why I’m concerned with the comparison between this and cases like the earlier mentioned van driver is not that the van driver escaped prison, but that he wasn’t found guilty of what is blatantly a crime - that of driving in a place where the law expressly forbids it (on the pavement) and killing someone as a result.

How is it possible that the cyclist can be found guilty of a crime and the van driver not? Well, it partly depends on what charges are brought... After the Alliston case, we were told that the law relating to cycling needed to be reviewed but clearly the law was able to find Alliston guilty of the crime he had committed, and again the cyclist was found guilty in this case. That the van driver was found not guilty shows that it’s the law relating to motoring offences that’s in serious need of review.

Also bear in mind why the police have released this footage: to highlight exactly why cycling in pedestrian areas is not a good idea. Which is fine. A good idea, in fact. Education is a good thing. Unfortunately, that’s not the effect the video has created. Instead it has become yet another stick with which to beat cyclists as part of the prevailing anti-cyclist narrative. And yet it remains the case that it is not cyclists, as a category of road user, who are the major problem in society, as the road death stats so readily reveal.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
P

PK99

Legendary Member
Location
SW19
If you’re imagining that I’m inclined towards leniency because he’s a cyclist, let me make it clear that I’m not. I just don’t think that a custodial sentence is appropriate in this type of case, where a person has caused injury (serious but not life-threatening) through recklessness and idiocy rather than with malice aforethought.

T.


He had been stopped and warned the day before that cycling in that area was expressly forbidden as it was a pedestrian only zone.

Is the ignoring of that warning not indicative of an element of malice aforethought.?

 

swee'pea99

Legendary Member
Is the ignoring of that warning not indicative of an element of malice aforethought.?
In what sense? Malice aforethought is, as the words would suggest, "the intention to kill or harm". I don't think anyone's suggesting he deliberately set out to injure anyone.
 

smutchin

Cat 6 Racer
Location
The Red Enclave
It does raise an interesting question though: why did he continue to cycle through the pedestrianised area when he’d been warned not to?

I don’t know Windsor but I’ve cycled through the pedestrianised bit of Bromley High St a number of times because the alternatives are: 1) getting off and walking, 2) mixing with traffic on the dual carriageway bypass, 3) taking a much longer way round. I’m not trying to justify or excuse lawbreaking, but it’s worth looking at the bigger picture and considering if it’s possible to design public spaces to prevent situations like this arising in the first place. It’s part of the reason there are pedestrianised areas in town centres - creating safe spaces - but it’s a shame that cycling provision often falls by the wayside when these pedestrian facilities are installed (bikes are just coralled off with the motor traffic onto roads that are now even busier than before). Even with proper cycling facilities you can’t stop someone riding like a dick if they’re intent on riding like a dick, but improved cycling provision could potentially mitigate the dangers to others. (Of course, if you are going to cycle in pedestrianised areas then at the very least you should slow the fark down.)
 
Last edited:

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
It’s part of the reason there are pedestrianised areas in town centres - creating safe spaces - but it’s a shame that cycling provision often falls by the wayside when these pedestrian facilities are installed (bikes are just coralled off with the motor traffic onto roads that are now even busier than before).
It's not a shame - it's a scandal. The guidance on creating pedestrian areas issued in 1987 said "Exemptions for cyclists should be considered if satisfactory routes for them around a proposed pedestrian zone do not exist and cannot be created. As it is generally impracticable to require cyclists to dismount, it is essential that the route or routes used by cyclists should be clearly defined." That was strengthened in 1993 to "Observation revealed no real factors to justify excluding cyclists from pedestrianised areas" (TAL 9/93).

Thinking has moved on about some aspects (such as the merits of defining a cycle track where there's no residual carriageway for delivery vehicles) but basically it's been 30 bloody years and still most councils and police are wasting resources and inciting hatred instead of following the guidance to provide safe conditions for both cycling and walking. They are partly to blame for the general disregard of cycling bans because they've overused them.

(Of course, if you are going to cycle in pedestrianised areas then at the very least you should slow the fark down.)
Of course. Even if cycling is permitted somewhere, riding faster than is safe or skimming walkers is not. We might free up some police to deal with that sort of thing by revoking the distracting irrational cycling bans. I salute Norwich City Council and Norfolk Police for having the guts to do that in Norwich at the moment.
 
Top Bottom