Are we being forced to go electric?

[CXRAndy]

But while that was the original point of the thread, it has been much more about whether we should be going electric than whether we are.

And one of the arguments against is the increased weight of Electric vehicles over ICE vehicles.

It's a moot point, the electric revolution is here. Nothing is going to stop it now .

The naysayers re range, weight, looks acceleration and all the plethora of other dislikes aren't going to interfere with this change.

I wish everyone a happy Monday

 

[vickster]

That's only 99.9%🙂

Rounding?

 

[cougie uk]

No. I'm just big boned.

#Rude

 

[lazybloke]

But while that was the original point of the thread, it has been much more about whether we should be going electric than whether we are.

I'd say there's no doubt that we should go electric. The advantages and benefits to society are clear.

Most of the discussion is actually just to establish what is impeding this transition.

To put it another way, all car sales (new & used) would be electric overnight, if EVs met all the same requirements that ICE cars do. Clearly they do not, yet. It's as simple as that.

 

[Sallar55]

I'd say there's no doubt that we should go electric. The advantages and benefits to society are clear.

Most of the discussion is actually just to establish what is impeding this transition.

To put it another way, all car sales (new & used) would be electric overnight, if EVs met all the same requirements that ICE cars do. Clearly they do not, yet. It's as simple as that.

Which society are we talking about.?
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/lithium-batteries-environment-impact

 

[Alex321]

I'd say there's no doubt that we should go electric. The advantages and benefits to society are clear.

Most of the discussion is actually just to establish what is impeding this transition.

To put it another way, all car sales (new & used) would be electric overnight, if EVs met all the same requirements that ICE cars do. Clearly they do not, yet. It's as simple as that.

A lot of the people in the discussion think we should NOT go electric, because they think we should be moving away from private car ownership altogether, and that going electric is no better than putting a sticking plaster on a broken leg.

I mainly agree with you that we definitely should go electric. But from the viewpoints put forward here, I can't say there is "no doubt" about that.

 

[All uphill]

A lot of the people in the discussion think we should NOT go electric, because they think we should be moving away from private car ownership altogether, and that going electric is no better than putting a sticking plaster on a broken leg.

I mainly agree with you that we definitely should go electric. But from the viewpoints put forward here, I can't say there is "no doubt" about that.

As one of "those" people I'd like to clarify that I would encourage (but not force) everyone to look for ways to live with reduced or eliminated car ownership. I'd also love it if more people actively campaigned for walking, cycling and public transport options being prioritised over private vehicles.

For those situations where a car is needed, either temporarily or permanently, I'd much prefer that car to be an EV, especially if they could be lighter and have fewer negatives in their manufacture.

 

[lazybloke]

Which society are we talking about.?
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/lithium-batteries-environment-impact

Oh I wasn't trying to pull the wool over eyes.
The reduction of tailpipe emissions in our towns and cities by going electric is a very hollow and unacceptable victory if they are simply replaced by a proliferation of dirty mines and tailings elsewhere.

The current crop of EV technologies could simply be much better; that was the theme of my previous post.



However, I do see electrification as an "enabler". It not only achieves the removal off internal combustion with all the associated pollution of oil/liquid fuels/exhaust fumes/smells, but it also allows future cleaner battery technologies, that won't have such an environmental impact.
Note I said cleaner, and not clean.

It is strange how EV owners are strangely reluctant to acknolwedge any downsides to their cars.
Issues that have been discussed ad nauseum on here. Don't the owners want to see improvements?

 

[CXRAndy]

It is strange how EV owners are strangely reluctant to acknolwedge any downsides to their cars.

Let me know what you think are downsides in your opinion and I will let you know what I think 😉

 

[All uphill]

Let me know what you think are downsides in your opinion and I will let you know what I think 😉

I see many positives compared with ICE.

Downsides I see, compared with what I think is needed.

Purchase cost.
Weight.
Most are just another bloated car perpetuating traffic congestion. Kudos to those manufacturers seeing the potential for something smaller.

 

[vickster]

I see many positives compared with ICE.

Downsides I see, compared with what I think is needed.

Purchase cost.
Weight.
Most are just another bloated car perpetuating traffic congestion. Kudos to those manufacturers seeing the potential for something smaller.

I’ll add time to charge / challenges for those who don’t have OSP, access to a personal charge point.

I was discussing with a friend yesterday, lives in a rented upstairs maisonette with no OSP. In her street, there’s just one lamp post charge point and nothing else remotely close-by so simply not practical currently.

 

[CXRAndy]

Agree on cost, they're more pricey.

Weight, fact they weigh more, but actually don't feel it due to very low COG.

Agree cars are necessary evil for many including our family.

Yes agree those trying to bring true city EVs to the market. Convincing folk might be an issue compared to owning an ICE vehicle

 

[geocycle]

I’ll add time to charge / challenges for those who don’t have OSP, access to a personal charge point.

I was discussing with a friend yesterday, lives in a rented upstairs maisonette with no OSP. In her street, there’s just one lamp post charge point and nothing else remotely close-by so simply not practical currently.

Not completely true, it depends on individual circumstances. The son has a prepayment meter so it is not really feasible to charge his EV even though he has a small drive. He only uses public charge points and does quite a lot of rural miles. He has a charge point 10 mins walk away and he also uses those available in public car parks etc. I agree it my not be practical for everyone in your friend’s situation and there is an increased cost per KW which favours those with bigger properties ( although cheaper than petrol), but it’s not always impossible.

 

[vickster]

Not completely true, it depends on individual circumstances. The son has a prepayment meter so it is not really feasible to charge his EV even though he has a small drive. He only uses public charge points and does quite a lot of rural miles. He has a charge point 10 mins walk away and he also uses those available in public car parks etc. I agree it my not be practical for everyone in your friend’s situation and there is an increased cost per KW which favours those with bigger properties ( although cheaper than petrol), but it’s not always impossible.

I never said it's impossible, but it's not convenient for all which seems to get forgotten by those for whom it is. He may be happy to leave his car parked up elsewhere and has decided that for him it's an acceptable compromise.
Did he already have a car before?

 

[geocycle]

I never said it's impossible, but it's not convenient for all which seems to get forgotten by those for whom it is. He may be happy to leave his car parked up elsewhere and has decided that for him it's an acceptable compromise.
Did he already have a car before?

I think there is a perception in some folk, including me, on how inconvenient it would be. However, for many people doing less than 10,000 miles a year, a once a week charge could be enough with a 200 mile range. It all depends on location and circumstances. I don’t disagree that infrastructure needs to be really improved to keep up with demand and I am concerned about inequalities.

He sold his fiesta for a second hand Zoe, partly as he works in renewables and it seemed the right thing to do, especially when arriving at clients.