Are we being forced to go electric?

[cougie uk]

Where does the electricity come from ? Wind power ? Diesel gensets ...........and more diesel gensets ....... and even more diesel gensets .... or green electricity as EON call it ......
If your happy with children mining the essential minerals for batteries in the Congo ....... ?????

To help you get your figures right in future - I'll summarise for you.

According to the life cycle assessment, the C40 Recharge has a CO2 footprint of around 27 tonnes over its entire life cycle if the charging current comes exclusively from clean energy sources. If, on the other hand, the vehicle owner uses the average global energy mix, in which about 60 per cent of electricity is generated from fossil fuels, emissions rise to as much as 50 tonnes of CO2 – with the EU-28 electricity mix, the figure is still 42 tonnes of CO2.

The Volvo XC40 with combustion engine, for example, has 59 tonnes of CO2 over its life cycle. The so-called “end-of-life” emissions and the share of production in the Volvo factories are the same regardless of the type of drive.

So it does depend on the mix of electricity. I'm on a renewables only tariff - so if that was my Volvo - it would be less than 50% of the carbon footprint of the ICE version.

And nobody should be happy about kids mining - but where's your outrage for laptops, phones, bike torches ? It's the same battery technology.

Don't forget - petrol isn't nice for kids either - not when its oil or when it's burnt and clogging their lungs.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-42168902

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...fumes-children-health-air-pollution-emissions

 

[ClichéGuevara]

To help you get your figures right in future - I'll summarise for you.

According to the life cycle assessment, the C40 Recharge has a CO2 footprint of around 27 tonnes over its entire life cycle if the charging current comes exclusively from clean energy sources. If, on the other hand, the vehicle owner uses the average global energy mix, in which about 60 per cent of electricity is generated from fossil fuels, emissions rise to as much as 50 tonnes of CO2 – with the EU-28 electricity mix, the figure is still 42 tonnes of CO2.

The Volvo XC40 with combustion engine, for example, has 59 tonnes of CO2 over its life cycle. The so-called “end-of-life” emissions and the share of production in the Volvo factories are the same regardless of the type of drive.

So it does depend on the mix of electricity. I'm on a renewables only tariff - so if that was my Volvo - it would be less than 50% of the carbon footprint of the ICE version.

And nobody should be happy about kids mining - but where's your outrage for laptops, phones, bike torches ? It's the same battery technology.

Don't forget - petrol isn't nice for kids either - not when its oil or when it's burnt and clogging their lungs.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-42168902

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...fumes-children-health-air-pollution-emissions

If you're looking at full balance, 'green' energy, on top of the environmental and social damage in areas where the raw materials are extracted, rely on back from localised generators around the Country to cope with fluctuations, and you'd also need to account for the improvements in technology and lifestyles, as well as the massive reductions in the impacts of environmental disasters that fossil fuels have brought about.

 

[classic33]

That's literally what taxi drivers do. You pay them to take you places. In my old job we used to have chauffeur cars to collect us from the airport. They need do driving jobs all over the country.

Pricey but so is owning a car.

Many will take you for a ride.

At roughly £2.50 a mile* it'd be one expensive taxi ride.

*Quite probably more given the journey length, and the fact it'd be one way only for the taxi driver.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I think we are being encouraged to buy electric.

But the whole idea that EVs are a 1:1 environmentally friendly replacement for fossil fueled vehicles is flawed. Of course the automotive industry want it to be that way because they will be able to continue existing in a similar form. And people at large want it to be that way because they will be able to continue to have the convenience of a personal vehicle for every trip, no matter how trivial.

But the only effective environmental impact will be for people to dial down their "need/want" meter, and for levels private ownership of vehicles to be reduced enabling fewer, more intensively used, vehicles out there to provide transport services as needed.

I'm sceptical whether that will happen. People are too darn lazy and entitled. (Is this getting too NACA-ish)?

 

[cougie uk]

Many will take you for a ride.

At roughly £2.50 a mile* it'd be one expensive taxi ride.

*Quite probably more given the journey length, and the fact it'd be one way only for the taxi driver.

If you had any sense - you'll book ahead and arrange a fee first. You'd not do it on the spur of the moment.

The point is - having a private car isn't the only way to live. I'll bet most of us had a lot less access to cars in our parents time. Life went on. People got around.

 

[classic33]

If you had any sense - you'll book ahead and arrange a fee first. You'd not do it on the spur of the moment.

The point is - having a private car isn't the only way to live. I'll bet most of us had a lot less access to cars in our parents time. Life went on. People got around.

Emergencies can't be planned for. And some folk have vehicles adapted to suit disabilities. There's more wheelchairs visible today than there were thirty years ago. I doubt the number of people requiring one has increased, more that they're getting out more.

I can't drive, so no car to worry about.

 

[MrGrumpy]

I'm afraid the age of mass car ownership has got to come to an end. Everyone wants a great big shiny new car, there are more and more people so there are more and more cars and their screwing the world up. Soon there will just not be enough room for all the cars and roads. Get used to it, you're being priced off the road.

Would not mind so much but with an awful public transport system currently , it’s still cheaper to drive into the city than get the train . Bus is cheaper mind but I need two buses to get to my work and it would take me twice as long. That their is why folk are still driving vehicles added to the fact that workers have to commute further for jobs. I know plenty driving from one side of the central belt to the other, just for work.

 

[MrGrumpy]

If you had any sense - you'll book ahead and arrange a fee first. You'd not do it on the spur of the moment.

The point is - having a private car isn't the only way to live. I'll bet most of us had a lot less access to cars in our parents time. Life went on. People got around.

That will be a time when everyone worked locally. We live in a totally different world now !

 

[MrGrumpy]

Oh and quell surprise . We did have conversation about chopping in the cabriolet e class as trade ins are good just now, and maybe choosing something else hybrid or maybe an EV. However needs enough room for dogs as well. EQC maybe

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Reading through the thread I am wondering how on Earth wind energy is clean energy. Surely, at best, it can only be relatively clean energy with all the construction materials and human activity needed to build the whirly things.

 

[Alex321]

Reading through the thread I am wondering how on Earth wind energy is clean energy. Surely, at best, it can only be relatively clean energy with all the construction materials and human activity needed to build the whirly things.

This is very true. There is no such thing as completely clean usable energy, it is all relative.

 

[yello]

That will be a time when everyone worked locally. We live in a totally different world now !

Times do change, we've certainly become more centralised in our approach over the years; jobs, shopping, etc. It's one of the things any 'solution' needs to address. That is, a decentralising or spreading out. Car ownership, and the 'need' thereof', has to be seen in a broader context and that context (and indeed the numerous contexts/layers) addressed.

I see Paris's mayor (Anne Hidalgo) is talking of a '15 minute city'. That is, everything needed being within 15 minutes walk/cycle... or was it helicopter? Whatever. Anyways, that's cool to aim for and address it in a urban environment but my rural environment sees the deemed necessary local bakers closing down in high numbers in the last 10 years. There's many things I can get to in a 15 minute walk but a bakery, shop, doctor, school, whatever, is not one of them. That said, there's a brave little shoe shop battling on in our closest village. I think she's long since past retirement age and must be selling off old stock. Something to do rather than a business per se.

Point is, there needs to be encouragement for businesses relocating, providing jobs and stimulus to local economies.

 

[Dogtrousers]

That will be a time when everyone worked locally. We live in a totally different world now !

We made this different world. And we made it over a relatively short period of time. So we are likely to have to un-make it, and make a new one. Or suffer the consequences.

 

[yello]

And we made it over a relatively short period of time.

George Monbiot touched on that point recently in an article. I think he actually classes it amongst the 'only hopes' (I'd have to reread the article) Basically, we've brought this situation on ourselves quite quickly so we can just as quickly unmake it.

 

[mistyoptic]

George Monbiot touched on that point recently in an article. I think he actually classes it amongst the 'only hopes' (I'd have to reread the article) Basically, we've brought this situation on ourselves quite quickly so we can just as quickly unmake it.

That pre supposes that the entitled masses will willingly give up their vehicle enabled autonomy. Looking around me at the large number of X5, Q7, Defender, and other behemoths, mostly being single occupied, I hold out very little hope for the “unmaking”