Are we being forced to go electric?

[Alex321]

This is a real issue that's been coming for a while. The assumption was EVs would get cheaper over time so priced would fall to a similar level of combustion cars.......

Which will almost certainly happen.

But the reality is the opposite, our very expensive Model X costs us £72k in 2017, to get the same spec car today is going to cost us £113k!!!

"The reality" hasn't come close to happening yet.

Don't expect EVs to be competitive on price until at least 20% of new cars are EVs, maybe more. And that is a few years away yet.

But manufacturers have to keep selling reasonable numbers of cars t stay in business. Their main profit drivers are mass market cars. And when new pure IC cars are no longer allowed to be sold (less than 10 years away), EVs will be priced to fit that market.

 

[CXRAndy]

I don't think driving about 3000 miles a year is that detrimental to the environment compared to aeroplanes, lorries, big tanker ships and other large vehicles used daily all over the world.

That's is a misplaced opinion of your own use is not creating much if anything to the problem of owning an ICE vehicle.

We all need to reduce our carbon footprint, pollution, waste etc

 

[Alex321]

Rubbish.

Few people genuinely "need" a car. Few will die if suddenly forced to give them up. Try not driving your car tomorrow - I bet you make it through the day alive, as will your loved ones, so where is this "need"?

We need food. We need water. We need air. Vitrually no one needs to drive.

Indeed, 17 million households in the UK do not have a car and manage just fine. What makes you a more deserving or special case than them? Nothing. You drive solely for the massive convenience it brings you

Not a single person is born needing to drive a car. Most peoples own life choices dictate this later "need" to drive. As aforementioned, 17 million households either cannot or do not want to, so any "need" you may have is purely a fiction to allow you to carry on without bothering to do anything differently.

The truth is you drive because it is incredibly convenient, and you want to keep it that way. Sadly, you can't even be honest with yourself.

Unlike you, most people do not consider "need" to mean the absolute "will die without it".

Technically, of course that is correct, but in real life terms, it isn't.

 

[fossyant]

There will be a large number of older vans worth next to nothing in Greater Manchester as of May next year. My BIL is getting rid of his that they use for work, and just using the car instead. £10 a day. Gone are any plans of converting an older small van into a day van as I'm in the zone

 

[gavroche]

Rubbish.

Few people genuinely "need" a car. Few will die if suddenly forced to give them up. Try not driving your car tomorrow - I bet you make it through the day alive, as will your loved ones, so where is this "need"?

We need food. We need water. We need air. Vitrually no one needs to drive.

Indeed, 17 million households in the UK do not have a car and manage just fine. What makes you a more deserving or special case than them? Nothing. You drive solely for the massive convenience it brings you

Not a single person is born needing to drive a car. Most peoples own life choices dictate this later "need" to drive. As aforementioned, 17 million households either cannot or do not want to, so any "need" you may have is purely a fiction to allow you to carry on without bothering to do anything differently.

The truth is you drive because it is incredibly convenient, and you want to keep it that way. Sadly, you can't even be honest with yourself.

You seem to have double standards. On one hand, you criticize others for having a car and on the other, you have motorbikes and a petrol guzzling Volvo.
Yes, my car is incredibly convenient for the reasons I gave earlier and that is why I am not prepared to give it up yet, but I don't abuse the use of it.

 

[Landsurfer]

Rubbish.

Few people genuinely "need" a car. Few will die if suddenly forced to give them up. Try not driving your car tomorrow - I bet you make it through the day alive, as will your loved ones, so where is this "need"?

We need food. We need water. We need air. Vitrually no one needs to drive.

Indeed, 17 million households in the UK do not have a car and manage just fine. What makes you a more deserving or special case than them? Nothing. You drive solely for the massive convenience it brings you

Not a single person is born needing to drive a car. Most peoples own life choices dictate this later "need" to drive. As aforementioned, 17 million households either cannot or do not want to, so any "need" you may have is purely a fiction to allow you to carry on without bothering to do anything differently.

The truth is you drive because it is incredibly convenient, and you want to keep it that way. Sadly, you can't even be honest with yourself.

I assume you have divested yourself of the Volvo’s .. or ... Your going for your Troll Gold Medal ...

 

[Nebulous]

I can remember the outrage when petrol reached £1 a litre in the 1990s. Some garages had to change their pumps because they could only cope with a 2-digit price. I don't drive anymore so if it is a conspiracy to get people out of petrol cars then it's working.

I passed my test just as petrol reached £1 a gallon. The papers were claiming people would stop driving rather than pay it, but I never met any of them.

 

[Drago]

Unlike you, most people do not consider "need" to mean the absolute "will die without it".

Technically, of course that is correct, but in real life terms, it isn't.

Last time I checked I was living real life... This is the different between need and want. You, like Gavroche, appear not to be able to tell the difference.

But seeing as youre in youre typically contrary mood, why don't you explain why 17 million households don't need to, but you and Gavroche do need to?

Just be honest. You want to, because the alternative is an inconvenient pain in the backside.

I assume you have divested yourself of the Volvo’s .. or ... Your going for your Troll Gold Medal ...

Wakey wakey! I ain't the one claiming a need to drive a car.

I own a car, I drive it a bit, and I absolutely, positively, do not need to drive it anywhere. I make no bones about that at all.

In Mrs D's case she uses a wheelchair. Disability, and the need to access stuff like daily radiotherapy etc, is a real need, perhaps the few genuine justifications for using that word in this context

 

[Landsurfer]

Last time I checked I was living real life... This is the diffenrent between need and want. You, like Gavroche, appear not to be able to tell the difference.

But seeing as youre in youre typically contrary mood, why don't you explain why 17 million households don't need to, but you and Gavroche do need to?

Just be honest. You want to, because the alternative is an inconvenient pain in the backside.

Drago ... Have you been drinking alcohol ??? ....

 

[fossyant]

Gav has said his Mrs can't walk far so they need a car.

 

[Tenkaykev]

Volvo has admitted that the production of their all electric cars (Polestar) produces 70% more carbon than their petrol range.
The carbon payback for their electric cars is 13 years.
The carbon payback for their petrol cars is 8 years.
The continuing world of "Emperors New Clothes” .... continues ....

But Volvo said as an EV the C40 Recharge has a far lower carbon footprint than its comparable petrol version during the 'use phase', though suggests it would take a prolonged period of ownership before it offsets its higher emissions from production.

When charged with clean energy, such as wind power, the lifecycle CO2 footprint of the new electric SUV comes down to approximately 27 tonnes of CO2, compared with 59 tonnes for an XC40 compact SUV powered by a combustion engine
The Swedish car maker said that over a car's lifetime the electric version will become greener overall, though this will only be achieved after covering between 30,000 and 68,400 miles - taking between four and nine years for the average UK motorist.

 

[ClichéGuevara]

But Volvo said as an EV the C40 Recharge has a far lower carbon footprint than its comparable petrol version during the 'use phase', though suggests it would take a prolonged period of ownership before it offsets its higher emissions from production.

When charged with clean energy, such as wind power, the lifecycle CO2 footprint of the new electric SUV comes down to approximately 27 tonnes of CO2, compared with 59 tonnes for an XC40 compact SUV powered by a combustion engine
The Swedish car maker said that over a car's lifetime the electric version will become greener overall, though this will only be achieved after covering between 30,000 and 68,400 miles - taking between four and nine years for the average UK motorist.

That rather depends how they choose to calculate the CO2, and ignores other emissions as a consequence of the overall production. It also assumes that sufficient 'green' energy is available, and is actually as 'green' as is claimed.

 

[Mike_P]

The battery plays a big part in the cost and battery prices are predicted to tumble. The lack of emissions from the vehicle is a big advantage and their are distinct health benefits in reducing exhaust emissions. I'm trusting my 8 year old tax free Ford Fiesta will last until EVs become afforable.

 

[ChangFai]

With the cost of petrol/diesel going up by the day and now teaching £1.50 a litre

Which means it is back to 2009 levels.

In that time, public transport in my area has more than doubled.

 

[cougie uk]

Volvo has admitted that the production of their all electric cars (Polestar) produces 70% more carbon than their petrol range.
The carbon payback for their electric cars is 13 years.
The carbon payback for their petrol cars is 8 years.
The continuing world of "Emperors New Clothes” .... continues ....

Your figures are the wrong way round.
The electric is about 50% less carbon footprint than the petrol version.

There's no way that drilling petrol, moving it across the world and then burning it in a car is going to be lower carbon than electricity.

https://www.electrive.com/2021/11/04/volvo-reveals-the-co2-footprint-of-the-c40-recharge/