Armstrong charged and banned

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yello said:
I'd say 'unlikely'.

The evidence will out one way or another. We've the arbitration for both Bruyneel and Martin to come, USADA to make conclusory statements - both of those could see official channels. Then we've got Hamilton's book, probably other witnesses too may want to publish, JV will slowly dribble info out just to prolong his own torture. There'll be lawsuits against Armstrong with the court packed with journalists hanging on every word of the prosecutions case. A potentially restarted federal case the same. Then there'll be leaks of course.

We'll see the evidence one way or another.
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This, I think, hope. People need to see the evidence but exactly. With this capitualtion out will come peoples stories. This is a last tactic by Armstrong to keep it all quiet and it will work for a short time and in the longer term we'll be arguing over it for years. Satisfying for those of us who know but quite difficult to explain how this makes him guilty to anyone outside the sport.
 
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yello

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re who does the stripping of titles, I think it's probably formally/officially UCI but it's like a royal ascent thing - UCI are bound by their agreement with WADA and have to respect the decision. So practically it is USADA that strips the titles. IF UCI refuse to recognise the sanction, they themselves face sanction and probably expulsion from the olympic movement by the IOC. So no cycling at the Olympics Games.

Another thing, re Armstrong's appeal. My understanding is that he can't. By refusing the arbitration process, he has effectively said he does not contest the charges or - to rephrase - he accepts the sanction. There's no route to CAS. You can't appeal a decision you've effectively agreed with. As I said earlier, I reckon he's painted himself into a corner.

If he tries the court route, they'll just bounce it saying he hasn't exhausted the options made available to him. Again, you can't complain about a process you haven't taken part in.

He'll continue his fight in the court of public opinion, and the tide will slowly slowly turn against him until nobody cares. And he'll still protest his innocence. It's the one thing I've never been able to factor in to my thinking - Armstrong himself. Some say he's a sociopath, that he'll never admit because he doesn't believe he's done anything wrong. I've no idea about that but there'll no doubt be bio-pics in time that explore his personality. It'll be something to watch on a rainy Sunday afternoon.
 
albion

albion

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"Some say he's a sociopath"

Did he kill Nixon too?
 
Boris Bajic

Boris Bajic

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If he's stripped of the titles, who gets them?

1999 it would be Zulle of Festina fame.

2000, 2001, 2003 would be Jan Ullrich..... Not exactly Mr Clean.

2002 Beloki..... Lots of smoke, but no fire. Well... not much. But we all love him because of that horrid crash taking his pure speed from him.

2004 Kloden. Blood doping allegations - not sure where that one ended up....

2005 would be Basso. Lots of smoke. Not without fire.

So... Take lance's victores away and award the races to Zulle, Ullrich, Beloki, Kloden and Basso instead. That'd be fair.

I've thought that pro cycling was dirty since before I started to read about it and watch it in the mid-80s. I'm pretty sure it's still dirty in parts and I do not subscribe to the notion that certain riders cannot possibly be doping because we love them or we admire them or they have cute, sad faces or they inspired us to turn our lives around or started a cancer charity.

I always thought LA was a doper, partly because I spent the TdF weeks in France for his winning years. Opinion was clear and undivided over there.

But... Why remove his victories and hand them to other dopers or probable dopers?

Or... Do we count back down the GC for all those years until we get to a clean rider (one who was so little known that he was hardly tested)?
 
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