At last a challenge to Big Pat

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BJH

Über Member
If cycling has got better on doping in thelastvfew years it's absolutely nothing to do with him. His comments when Landis and Hamilton were blowing the lid were a disgrace. Reminiscent of Police Chiefs in the past steadfastly denying that any copper could ever be bent.

For that alone as an incredible error of judgement he should have the sense to go.

That said, I can only repeat previous comments I have posted, people with snouts in the trough are always reluctant to give it up. Unless of course an even better one like he Olympics comes your way, but Big Heiny isn't letting go of that one just yet.
 
 

oldroadman

Veteran
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So when Cookson is elected there may be some painful interviews for senior staff members, then. Of course, there will be the old defence "I was only obeying orders". Where was that heard before?
You honestly could not make this stuff up - anyone writing a script with a plot like this would be a laughing stock.

At what point do you deliberately jeopardise your career or job by refusing to do something you're employed to do on a principle. Especially if you're employed to create the principles in the first place. As Resal is often pointing out, Cookson has been involved in the UCI for many years, what's the difference?
 

oldroadman

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Location
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At what point do you deliberately jeopardise your career or job by refusing to do something you're employed to do on a principle. Especially if you're employed to create the principles in the first place. As Resal is often pointing out, Cookson has been involved in the UCI for many years, what's the difference?

The staff are in a difficult position. They may well have been ordered to do what they did by the incumbent president. Looking at the UCI's announcements and general dictatorial methods (president says something and without any consultation it's suddenly a "rule" interpretation - remember what's coming on 1.1.2014). Resal may point at Cookson but he's been there for about 4-5 years only, and old methods are hard to shift. Once on the management committee, I wonder how the jobs are decided, like running CX or road commissions. Maybe it's a presidential appointment, just as likely as any other way?
Cookson (and possibly other dissenting committee members) are probably trying to shift things, but as anyone who has served on a committee will know, once a decision is made you support it or resign, and you can't change things from outside. So even if you don't agree a decision and vote against, the majority win. It's a funny thing called democracy, which isn't perfect but better than anything else!
It ould be argued that resignation is an honourable thing to do, spilling the beans once gone, but look at the record of the Verbruggen/McQuaid presidencies and see how often the legal route has been used to stifle criticism.
My own opinion is that Cookson is a straight and honest bloke who will fight to put things right. His track record at BC would appear to back that up. Which makes me think that he may be constantly frustrated by the goings-on at UCI and will want a massive cultural change. I think we should be pleased that someone has the will to try and stop the rot.
 

resal

Veteran
The staff are in a difficult position. They may well have been ordered to do what they did by the incumbent president.
Resal may point at Cookson but he's been there for about 4-5 years only, and old methods are hard to shift. Once on the management committee, I wonder how the jobs are decided, like running CX or road commissions. Maybe it's a presidential appointment, just as likely as any other way?
Cookson are probably trying to shift things, but as anyone who has served on a committee will know, once a decision is made you support it or resign,

My own opinion is that Cookson is a straight and honest bloke who will fight to put things right. His track record at BC.
Got it right there. Only decent thing was to resign. By staying there he was as much a part of the problem as anyone.

Look, Cookson was not getting a salary so it would be incredibly double faced of him to give those who have dependents, a hard time about not telling the boss to shove off.
If Cookson had not got the guts to do it when he didn't have a job on the line, he sure as hell can't expect the full time guys to do it.
They can quote the same rubbish, "we were trying to change things from the inside".

It's rubbish, if there is a corrupt show, you blow the whistle and walk out. From 2004 Cookson had all the evidence he needed to do that. A total lack of spine.

As for Cookson being straight - pull the other one! In January he was bleating that the women didn't deserve a minimum wage. Now he says things have changed. Nothing's changed apart from he want's votes. The women.s circuit has gone further down the pan whilst he has been boss of the road commission.

Someone ought to buy the guy a mirror.
 

thom

____
Location
The Borough
Anyone linked to this inrng blog yet ?
There is speculation that the asian nominations McQuaid my need if the Swiss nomination is revoked, may have been made subsequent to the deadline for nominations and that the rule change proposal made by UCI senior members that may activate the back up nominations, is erroneously made.
 

oldroadman

Veteran
Location
Ubique
Got it right there. Only decent thing was to resign. By staying there he was as much a part of the problem as anyone.

Look, Cookson was not getting a salary so it would be incredibly double faced of him to give those who have dependents, a hard time about not telling the boss to shove off.
If Cookson had not got the guts to do it when he didn't have a job on the line, he sure as hell can't expect the full time guys to do it.
They can quote the same rubbish, "we were trying to change things from the inside".

It's rubbish, if there is a corrupt show, you blow the whistle and walk out. From 2004 Cookson had all the evidence he needed to do that. A total lack of spine.

As for Cookson being straight - pull the other one! In January he was bleating that the women didn't deserve a minimum wage. Now he says things have changed. Nothing's changed apart from he want's votes. The women.s circuit has gone further down the pan whilst he has been boss of the road commission.

Someone ought to buy the guy a mirror.

A robust opinion robustly expressed, which I equally robustly contend is flawed, and leave the other interested members on this forum to form their own opinions and possibly comment thereon.

Women's racing down the pan? Obviously no study of the plans for 2014 at least in GB, then. A small matter of the ToB organisers putting on a women's 5 day to the same standard as the ToB, as ever GB leading the way and showing what should be done. Let's hope others have the same resolve to follow this example.
 

resal

Veteran
......as ever GB leading the way and showing what should be done. Let's hope others have the same resolve to follow this example.
You have not dealt with the point about Cookson's failure to address the bung from Lance to the UCI. We also have totally forgotten all the stories about how Lance knew in advance that the testers were about to arrive. Again, the point at issue is at what level was the corruption? How far up/down the UCI pyramid did/does it go ?

For years we had the stated position of the UCI that they knew nothing about the post dated Certificate of exemption from Lance in the 1999 Tour. Now the official UCI position is that they did know about it. This is a factual change of stated position. That is an absolute that needs dragging into the open. Who were the people who knew about that? Did it go to the top ? We are all pretty sure it did, but we don't know. Dead easy - independent commission, taking testimony under oath,all records into the public domain, convened by the current UCI board. Could get the job done in about 4 months. That is something to bring the building down. If it stops Hein getting another cushty job, so what. The guy deserves to be brought as low as Lance. Cookson could be doing this right now. If it takes down Pat and Hein, great. If it takes down the UCI as it exists, well it deserves to go. Not fit for purpose.

Now onto women's cycling - since that was the main part of your response.
A little Englander or GB centric viewer might see it like that. Have a look at the women's circuit around the World. No World Cup events in Canada, New Zealand, Australia, the German and Dutch races that traditionally finish the series - gone. The Giro is is only there on life support because without it there would be nothing and everybody was watching the Italian Federation in February as they attempted to find an organiser to take it on for them. Look at the reporting of it at Cylingnews. It is close to being a joke. For the Swedish Vargarda TTT round last week the field was weak, with several local teams being needed to pack it out. Again, how did Cyclingnews report it ? Not one word of editorial just a list of participants and times. This was a round of the World Cup. If the UCI were serious about supporting the women's scene they would ensure that someone wrote something for World's press. Surely they could spare the £50 for a contract journo to speak to the organiser.

In the UK we are not following we are about one and a half decades late to the party. This last 12 months there has been debate in the UK press. Lizzie did well to air it straight after her event in London. Then I think everyone was so shocked in January when Cookson responded to Cooke's retirement statement with his defence of the indefensible, that it focused a few minds. Could we have a sector of society where there was no minimum wage ? Whilst Cookson was out of the spotlight and could hide his mysogyny, he was happy in his beliefs, probably sharing them with his mates that thought exactly like him. When flushed out into the open, it was obvious that most of society did not hold the same view. Undoubtedly he could not run for office in 2013 without sounding like he was making the right noises. However, he must be thanking his lucky stars he is running against someone as toxic as Pat, because none of the press have thought to ask him to flesh out his ideas. In the meantime a number of people have stepped up to the plate and the plans put forward relating to a women's ToB are indeed pleasing to see. That they cannot be laid at Cookson's door is so evident from the fact that for the last 10 years BC has done nothing to showcase the women's road scene, when it had a number of talents. Surely after Silver and Gold in the TT and RR at Bejing, they could have done something for Pooley and Cooke.

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news...oucle-to-honour-cooke-with-british-start.html How did our "Leading where others follow" BC do with this one ?I think the facts are that this plan died a death.

We have debated here in the past. The 2008 London bid for the women's Tour, to follow the men's start in 2007, as mentioned in that CW story I linked, was shot down in flames by BC. Leading where others follow! I think the facts would indicate exactly the opposite. A male centric organisation that ignored women for far to long, now trying to create a new "year zero". Next you will be telling us they will have a new World's first by having a women's team Sky to go along with the men's team Sky.
 

resal

Veteran
Me no likely 1000 word post, brain hurty
Me neither !
Load of facts pointing out that a the UCI have failed to step up to the plate in terms of answering a single one of the questions from the USADA inquiry into Lance, that pointed to them.

More facts indicating that BC and the UCI Road Commission have done nothing for women's cycling as it has declined over the last 10 years.

Oh and Pat is toxic !
 
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