BBC helmet cam film to explore cyclist-motorist conflict

[Poacher]

I'm kinda disappointed that people seem to think that slapping a vhicle is only done to wind up the driver. On the two occations iv had to hit a car in that way it's done because I though If I didn't I might end up under under his wheels if I had not warned him.

Most of us don't have horns, and we can't shout louder than a car engine, it's seems a very good defensive measure if you ask me.

I agree entirely that slapping a vehicle is a valid defensive measure, but it does tend to provoke a disproportionate response at times. After being on the receiving end of plausible death threats for slapping a car when the driver was paying more attention to his mobile phone than his driving, and was drifting left, leaving me with little option but to bale out onto the footpath, I decided to fit an Airzound to my commuter. It's rarely used, but when it has been necessary, it seems to shock the errant drivers into driving responsibly, rather than the "You touched my car - I'm going to kill you!" reaction.

 

[SportMonkey]

the production company did two particular things to Gaz that I think where underhand:

1 - the licking of the lips - it did and offered nothing.

2 - did anyone notice the camera was lower, looking up towards Gaz (may not have been inferential though) while every other camera was level with the interviewees head/eye?

1, the way they did it, the amount they did it, the focussing of it, was totally uncalled for, they wanted to make Gaz look weird.

2, the camera angle did seem not suited to Gaz coming across well.

 

[User482]

Obviously in bunched up traffic or a complete jam, you are going to be moving faster. I was referring to situations when you are aware that a vehicle is behind you (or a line of vehicles) and you are holding them up. I know about the advice of taking centre positon to be seen, or to prevent overtaking, but if that is going to put you in the position of causing the rest of the traffic to slow down for longer than a short distance, then unfortunately it's going to make you annoying!

Motorists often hold me up for "longer than a short distance". They also seem curiously determined to overtake so they can join the back of the next queue. They're annoying.

If you think about it, a car driver is unlikely to pull in for anything because there's hardly any room to maneuver. Unless it's for an emergency vehicle, they're just going to sit there hoping they will be moving again shortly anyway.

They could easily pull in to the kerb so I can overtake safely on the right. They don't, because they can't wait to join the back of the next queue. They're annoying.

 

[grumpyoldgit]

Ride faster.



I suggest you'd feel more at home there then, with your little grumpy friends.

I was referring to how cyclists are perceived to be by others,&,as a cyclist,I was interested.

 

[Boris Bajic]

I like the cabbie "I've never seen a cyclist get nicked,ditto I've never seen a cabbie get nicked,and they should be.

Cabbies do get nicked.

I was tipped off (at speed) by an FX4 making an illegal U-Turn on Oxford Street back in the 80s.

I got two witnesses, reported him and it went to Magistrate's Court. I showed up and found my two witnesses, which I though was touching as they'd taken time off work.

Annoyingly, the cabbie didn't show. He made a plea of Not Guilty through his brief once (I assume) it was clear the witnesses were there and he was cooked.

The usher found me in the waiting area and told me he'd got 6 points, but not what he'd got them for. There was a three-figure fine, too.

Cabbies do get nicked. And I imagine it cost this chap a lot more than his fine and the cost of his brief.

I even felt a little bit sorry for him, as I told him at the scene I was going to report him, then he offered me a lift home (Shepherds Bush). I accepted the lift, took my mangled bike out of the cab and he said "There's no need to report anyone for this is there..."

I'm afraid I swallowed awkwardly and said "Thanks for the lift and yes there is". I even made sure he dropped me one street away from home... I ought to have screwed him for the cost of new forks, but I was younger then....

Cabbies do get nicked.

 

[SportMonkey]

I was referring to how cyclists are perceived to be by others,&,as a cyclist,I was interested.

So you have enough time in your day to pick a fair selection of forums and find the "Gaz is a knob" thread? I suggest you get out on your bike more.

 

[SportMonkey]

Cabbies do get nicked.

I was tipped off (at speed) by an FX4 making an illegal U-Turn on Oxford Street back in the 80s.

I got two witnesses, reported him and it went to Magistrate's Court. I showed up and found my two witnesses, which I though was touching as they'd taken time off work.

Annoyingly, the cabbie didn't show. He made a plea of Not Guilty through his brief once (I assume) it was clear the witnesses were there and he was cooked.

The usher found me in the waiting area and told me he'd got 6 points, but not what he'd got them for. There was a three-figure fine, too.

Cabbies do get nicked. And I imagine it cost this chap a lot more than his fine and the cost of his brief.

I even felt a little bit sorry for him, as I told him at the scene I was going to report him, then he offered me a lift home (Shepherds Bush). I accepted the lift, took my mangled bike out of the cab and he said "There's no need to report anyone for this is there..."

I'm afraid I swallowed awkwardly and said "Thanks for the lift and yes there is". I even made sure he dropped me one street away from home... I ought to have screwed him for the cost of new forks, but I was younger then....

Cabbies do get nicked.

That's the same punishment as being caught speeding on the motorway. I'm not sure that it is a fair and equitable system.

 

[grumpyoldgit]

So you have enough time in your day to pick a fair selection of forums and find the "Gaz is a knob" thread? I suggest you get out on your bike more.

I would love to,but I am tied to an office,work is such a curse at times.

 

[SportMonkey]

I would love to,but I am tied to an office,work is such a curse at times.

No wonder you're grumpy. I can also see why you're jealous of Gaz, whilst I'm in a slightly different role in development (c.f. my work profile pic), software development generally allows us to do the hours we wish; which means just going off cycling whenever we like. Maybe you should give up your job and get some pointers from Gaz how to be like him.

 

[Dusty66]

I don't know where you ride, but in central London, where Gaz rides (and I expect this is true for him as well), in my experience it is never the case that a car is faster than me on my bike. Cars are always in the way, they are always slower. This is true as much on Euston Road as it is on Victoria Embankment as it is on the Strand. Gaz is perfectly correct to take the lane, it is defensive cycling and recommended (as it is for PTWs in the CBT) and he would not cost the cab any time at all. The only annoyance is a cab driver who thinks it's acceptable to use his cab as an aggressive weapon to force people out of his way, and to hold himself (apparently) to the standard that since he's never knocked anyone off, he's a good driver. I beg to differ.

Nope I don't ride in central London - I wish I did because it looks lovely and flat! I agree it looks like a nightmare, but all cities are pretty bad at rush hour and I live in a city. I guess what I'm trying to say, is that I ride my bike in the same way that I drive my car. I'm not agressive, I don't take risks and I think I'm quite conscientious. On a bike I also have the advantage of knowing what it's like to be driving a car. I know that I am difficult to see and I know that I can appear to be in the way - even if I am not! It's a psychological thing. I don't expect preferential treatment, just fair treatment and I think on the whole I get that.

 

[Miquel In De Rain]

Gaz isn't the problem,the problem is cyclists general poor behaviour out there.Same mentality as motorists,can't wait two seconds.

 

[grumpyoldgit]

No wonder you're grumpy. I can also see why you're jealous of Gaz, whilst I'm in a slightly different role in development (c.f. my work profile pic), software development generally allows us to do the hours we wish; which means just going off cycling whenever we like. Maybe you should give up your job and get some pointers from Gaz how to be like him.

Sadly I am not as clever as you & Gaz,otherwise I would.

 

[Trevrev]

No wonder you're grumpy. I can also see why you're jealous of Gaz, whilst I'm in a slightly different role in development (c.f. my work profile pic), software development generally allows us to do the hours we wish; which means just going off cycling whenever we like. Maybe you should give up your job and get some pointers from Gaz how to be like him.

Were you in the playground when you typed this? Very school boy!
Made me laugh though!

 

[PK99]

Cycling in primary isn't done all the time, and the choice of when to do it is a weighted decision,

I do think that the choice of terms "Primary" and "Secondary" by Frankilin was a poor one.

I know we cyclists like the perversity of clipping into our clipless pedals, but that is just an in-joke. However to call the normal or default riding position "Secondary" and the exceptional or occasional position "Primary" seems designed to confuse. In any safety programme with multiple users of different backgrounds the use of exclusive jargon words is not recommended.

Better would have been:

Primary Position = normal road position 1-1.5m from kerb.

Safety Position = central in the lane.

Run the conversation:

Irate driver: "Why the fizz were you in the middle of the lane"
Cyclist: "Because that is the recommended Primary Position"
Even more irate driver "Primary! You think you own the fecking road?!"

(We've seen that run numerous times on cycle cam up loads)

or

Irate driver: "Why the fizz were you in the middle of the lane"
Cyclist :" Because that is the Safety position the highway code recommends on narrow roads"
Puzzled driver "Eh?"
Cyclist: ... explains the logic

The second conversation is one i have had (obviously using different words) on a number of occasions.

 

[Dusty66]

So a person should put themselves at risk? Cycling in primary isn't done all the time, and the choice of when to do it is a weighted decision, the length of the queue of cars isn't generally one of them; although I can't think of any time that there has been a long queue behind me whilst taking a whole lane.

Why should a cyclist move over for a car then, if there's no room to manoeuvre then there is no room to overtake safely, so cyclists always have to cycle in primary and annoy cars...

There was a scene on the programme (sorry forgot who it was) but he was getting tooted from behind. He was taking centre position and you could see that the traffic infront of him was pulling away into the distance - ie., travelling a lot faster than he was at that point. The guy tooting basically couldn't get past and was getting aggrivated. In that instance, I think the cyclist was in the wrong.

The only time a cyclist should pull over for a car is when the cyclist is holding things up. Same as the driver of a slow vehicle would (if he was a good driver).