Broccoli head from Spain priced 20p in supermarket.

[mudsticks]

I think its the human condition, you only have to look around average urban estates now, few people seem to care about their own environment! Why would they care about anyone else's? Look at the low level fly tipping, its like no--one can be bothered to do the simple stuff. See our local junior school, the playground looks like a rubbish tip after a weekend, crisp packets, cake packets, cups, bottles strewn all over. Schools seem reluctant to encourage kids to do litter pick, if you cant encourage children to care, you're lost in 20 years time.
It seems to me we (society in general) have become remarkably selfish in this country.

Well yes there are problems in certain areas for sure, neglect and deprivation.
.
But it's not all doom and gloom
And it's not that no one cares, it's just that some dont..
That's always been the case though.

There are many youngsters taking a lead on these things too , very aware and proactive , doing their bit, where they can.

Look at all the kids concerned about, and campaigning on climate change, even in the face of the 'grown-ups' ignoring or denying it all.

It's a culture thing, which we can all help with (or hinder) by encouraging, or discouraging.

Certainly isn't fair to blame it on 'the youth of today' ..
Who brought them up, and showed them the way .??

 

[Arrowfoot]

If it came from the EU, entered UK and retails in ASDA, it is likely to be kosher. ASDA business models have buyers that seem to sniff opportunities well better than others.

Sometimes it seasonality, glut or a cancelled order and they are perishables. What I can reasonably expect is the price will not remain as such for long.

I think we will end up in the World of conspiracy theories if we let the mind wonder.

 

[mudsticks]

If it came from the EU, entered UK and retails in ASDA, it is likely to be kosher. ASDA business models have buyers that seem to sniff opportunities well better than others.

Sometimes it seasonality, glut or a cancelled order and they are perishables. What I can reasonably expect is the price will not remain as such for long.

I think we will end up in the World of conspiracy theories if we let the mind wonder.

There are no 'conspiracy theories' here.

It's just how trade in perishables largely 'works' atm.

It's deliberately set up to be weighted as a buyer's market, once the produce is grown, then suppliers are at the mercy of the multiples, who can cancel contracts or impose price reduction s.

It's all well documented.

Do we wish that inequitable situation, and the damage it causes to continue??
Thats the question.

 

[newfhouse]

if we let the mind wonder.

Something to be avoided at all costs, obviously.

 

[Arrowfoot]

There are no 'conspiracy theories' here.

It's just how trade in perishables largely 'works' atm.

It's deliberately set up to be weighted as a buyer's market, once the produce is grown, then suppliers are at the mercy of the multiples, who can cancel contracts or impose price reduction s.

It's all well documented.

Do we wish that inequitable situation, and the damage it causes to continue??
Thats the question.

Simply stating that the price of 20p is not sustainable. It is good that the trade does not do dumping to hold the price which is common.

Enjoy it while you can. Great veg btw.

 

[Arrowfoot]

Something to be avoided at all costs, obviously.

Not for the simps. It can be dangerous for all around. Just look at Trump's flock.

 

[mudsticks]

Simply stating that the price of 20p is not sustainable. It is good that the trade does not do dumping to hold the price which is common.

Enjoy it while you can. Great veg btw.

Agree it's not sustainable in many ways..

However, 'enjoy it while you can' is a fairly hollow exhortation for someone for whom growing and marketing veg is a large part of their income.

I sell direct, and my customers value, freshness, flavour, variety, freedom from chemicals, low food miles, and consistency of supply.

In addition to good value ..

But still my prices are somewhat 'pegged' by the supermarket 'offer'.

That price point doesn't include all sorts of externalised costs, to people and environment which are generally unseen by the consumer..

 

[BoldonLad]

Thank you again @gbb for the expanded info in your last post.
I was back in Asda today: it's on my route home from work, I tend to go every few days.
Depending on how much space I have in my panniers, sometimes I can only pick up a couple of items.
Anyhow, the sea of 20p Spanish broccoli was broken up by a lake of 20p Scottish carrots (I would say about a kg in weight, forgot to check) and by another lake of 20p British parsnips.
Both carrots and parsnips were freshly washed and packaged in plastic.
I think they must be last season's stock, I can understand local farmers wanting rid, but surely the transport and packaging must cost more than 20p for a kg.
I suppose, better a little money for the farmer than the produce going to landfill, which would cost the farmer anyway.
My new season carrots and parsnips have already germinated


I remember, when I came to the UK 35 years ago, there was only (British) seasonal produce in the supermarket. To buy a head of garlic you had to go to an Italian or Greek delicatessen.
In Scotland that was, I know London as always been more cosmopolitan.
With the start of cheap travel abroad in the 90s, I think the consumers were ready for a more varied food produce availability.
I was very surprised, though, when everything started to appear in supermarkets visually uniform, unblemished, already washed.
Totally different from a continental veg market: somehow, the British consumer is now expecting perfectly shaped veg, all the same size and weight - and clean!


To be honest, I was very surprised too. Here in Scotland we are famous for not eating our veg, mainly because they are traditionally boiled to death

Before reading this article, I wouldn't have thought that a country with a climate like Spain needs a lot of greenhouse space.
The article doesn't specify if also brassicas are grown under plastic: I know mine bolt at the minimum rise of temperatures, so do my spinach and lettuce.
Is the plastic needed to keep pests away, maybe?
The more I look into this, the less I'm inclined to buy 20p veg again, unless they are on yellow sticker at the end of the trading day

From my experience, veg in supermarkets in much of mainland Europe, is similarly blemish free and uniform, although, generally, more fresh than in Uk.

Spain May be hot in summer, but, can be surprisingly cold in winter, so, plastic and greenhouses May be to produce produce early?

 

[Dogtrousers]

One cup of broccoli has as much vitamin C as an orange. Also contains fibre.

I'm having trouble imagining a cup of broccoli. How would you fit it in? And other questions ....

Btw I love broccoli .... mmmm

 

[Cycleops]

I also love broccoli. Can't imagine how anyone could find them unpleasant.

 

[theclaud]

I also love broccoli. Can't imagine how anyone could find them unpleasant.

What do you use as the singular form? Broccolo?

 

[Pat "5mph"]

Today I passed by Aldi, also on my way home from work - I did a half day today
I found an abundance of carrots, parsnips, something else I forgot but no broccoli, same size packaging as Asda, all produce of GB ... at 19p!
I start to feel for the farmers: as a backyard small scale veg grower myself, I know how much work it takes to get a harvest, even taken in account the milder English climate, milder that Scotland I mean.
Tbh, I was never a great buyer of fruit and veg since moving to Scotland, apart from salad stuff and the usual potatoes and onions.
The reason was (is!) the bland taste compared to the freshly harvested produce abroad I was used to.
Of course I understand that due to our climate produce needs to be imported, harvested unripe because it needs to stay fresh during transport.
Anyway, I have developed a health condition that means I need to eat lots of leafy greens and brassicas, or take calcium supplements. Why taking a pill if you can eat food instead?
I'm forever searching for nice veg now, need to buy lots because they don't fill me like a carbonara would
At the same time I was told about my health condition, I was made redundant, so I had more than a year of lockdown to plan our building's communal backyard renovation: I decided I wanted to focus on growing vegetables organically.
I researched it while I was unwell and unemployed to boot lol, and I have decided to follow the no dig method by Charles Dowding and the small plot growing tips by Huw Richards.
They both grow organic veg in a climate similar to mine.
Meantime, I also got volunteering with the local foodbank and with a few other community gardening projects.
This is the background of my interest in commercial veg growing.

Broccoli is politics, Pat, as you seem to be discovering. Maybe explain that to Shaun, when you have a minute.

Let's not start this carry on!
Broccoli is economics in this instance.
Granted, economics and politics go hand in hand, but I don't think Conservative broccoli are more ethical or organic than Labour broccoli. Over to NACA with political broccoli, please

Is it British public driven, or is it the supermarkets being over zealous. Im sure the supermarkets would plead its what the public demand...but i dont buy it.

I think you are right. I think it's the supermarkets that create the standard of certain goods, then after a while the public demands it, well, as a standard.
Taking, again, veg as an example, surely the elderly buyers must remember the times when you bought a head of lettuce, you had to wash it and chop it.
Yet, I see many elderly shoppers picking bags of chopped, washed salad bags, at a dearer price that a head of lettuce.
Convenience? Habit, availability?
My veg growing hero Charles Dowding often says his farm makes lots of money from salad bags for supermarkets.
He grows tender leafy greens, his workforce goes around each plant daily picking leaves, they mix them, wash them, spin them, bag them.
Picking lettuce leaves one by one so not to kill the plant, for come again produce, is backbreaking work!
Are salad bags ethical? Are they environmentally friendly, all bagged up, with a shorter shelf life than a whole head of lettuce?

I'm lucky enough to have the kind of soil where I can overwinter all my roots in situ

I am going to try this season, not sure if it will work for me, but I'll give it a bash, maybe with carrots, potatoes, parsnips in tubs, covered. I think left in the ground here they would freeze.

Food production, who grows it and how, who gets the profit, who gets paid properly, who doesn't, can't help but be political
.
On average only 8p of the supermarket shelf price gets back to the primary producer.
That's not sustainable.

We are a capitalistic society, no matter who is the political party in government the system will still be driven by profit, imo.
I remember, many years ago I worked for Asda for a while, when it was the cheapest, before Aldi and Lidle came to play on the market.
I remember my colleagues complaining about some benefit reduction that I, as a new start, wasn't getting anyway.
I wanted to say: what do you expect, we shop here because it's cheap, but the biggest cost for a business is the workforce, how do you think they sell so cheap?
Of course, I shut up
For things to change, the public needs to be aware of the consequences of 20p broccoli.
Like @gbb said, though, will the public care?

But in our 'information' age there's not much excuse for not knowing about these things.
Perhaps some people would rather not know??

Imo, many people have more pressing issues that affect them personally to care much about a vague idea of fairness for farm workers.
I can say for certain "I will never buy 20p Spanish broccoli again" BUT: I don't have dependants, I choose to work lots of hours so I can choose to buy 90p British broccoli in Tesco and Fair Trade coffee at the Coop.
I am their community champion for my area, get a Coop discount, still Aldi's coffee is cheaper.
But I am lucky I can afford to buy Fair Trade, so I do.
I did attend a Fair Trade zoom once, the producer was asked how can people that are on a budget help Fair Trade?
The producer said "those that can afford it, should buy it"
It seems we need a Veg Fair Trade movement!

I think its the human condition, you only have to look around average urban estates now, few people seem to care about their own environment! Why would they care about anyone else's?

Sadly, this is true where I live, more some of us clean up, more other people litter.
One time, after a clean up event, someone posted on our FB page "the council should do it"
Nay, the community should not litter, I was going to post, but I didn't
A nearby community gardening group keeps getting vandalised, their aim is to make the local park look nice.
Often, after they have raised money for a project, it gets vandalized before they can complete it.

And it's not that no one cares, it's just that some dont..

Sadly, it seems lots don't. I guess it's depending on the area one lives in, though.

It's deliberately set up to be weighted as a buyer's market, once the produce is grown, then suppliers are at the mercy of the multiples, who can cancel contracts or impose price reduction s.

Thanks for this info, I didn't know that.

From my experience, veg in supermarkets in much of mainland Europe, is similarly blemish free and uniform, although, generally, more fresh than in Uk.

I haven't been to mainland Europe for a few years now, before I came to live in the UK I used to food shop at the local open air market.
Before Corona, I went to visit family in Germany: they took me to Aldi, looked just like my local one

 

[Pat "5mph"]

What do you use as the singular form? Broccolo?

Yes, of course: un broccolo, due broccoli

 

[theclaud]

Let's not start this carry on!
Broccoli is economics in this instance.
Granted, economics and politics go hand in hand, but I don't think Conservative broccoli are more ethical or organic than Labour broccoli. Over to NACA with political broccoli, please

I didn't say owt about parties.

 

[mudsticks]

Today I passed by Aldi, also on my way home from work - I did a half day today
I found an abundance of carrots, parsnips, something else I forgot but no broccoli, same size packaging as Asda, all produce of GB ... at 19p!
I start to feel for the farmers: as a backyard small scale veg grower myself, I know how much work it takes to get a harvest, even taken in account the milder English climate, milder that Scotland I mean.
Tbh, I was never a great buyer of fruit and veg since moving to Scotland, apart from salad stuff and the usual potatoes and onions.
The reason was (is!) the bland taste compared to the freshly harvested produce abroad I was used to.
Of course I understand that due to our climate produce needs to be imported, harvested unripe because it needs to stay fresh during transport.
Anyway, I have developed a health condition that means I need to eat lots of leafy greens and brassicas, or take calcium supplements. Why taking a pill if you can eat food instead?
I'm forever searching for nice veg now, need to buy lots because they don't fill me like a carbonara would
At the same time I was told about my health condition, I was made redundant, so I had more than a year of lockdown to plan our building's communal backyard renovation: I decided I wanted to focus on growing vegetables organically.
I researched it while I was unwell and unemployed to boot lol, and I have decided to follow the no dig method by Charles Dowding and the small plot growing tips by Huw Richards.
They both grow organic veg in a climate similar to mine.
Meantime, I also got volunteering with the local foodbank and with a few other community gardening projects.
This is the background of my interest in commercial veg growing.


Let's not start this carry on!
Broccoli is economics in this instance.
Granted, economics and politics go hand in hand, but I don't think Conservative broccoli are more ethical or organic than Labour broccoli. Over to NACA with political broccoli, please

I think you are right. I think it's the supermarkets that create the standard of certain goods, then after a while the public demands it, well, as a standard.
Taking, again, veg as an example, surely the elderly buyers must remember the times when you bought a head of lettuce, you had to wash it and chop it.
Yet, I see many elderly shoppers picking bags of chopped, washed salad bags, at a dearer price that a head of lettuce.
Convenience? Habit, availability?
My veg growing hero Charles Dowding often says his farm makes lots of money from salad bags for supermarkets.
He grows tender leafy greens, his workforce goes around each plant daily picking leaves, they mix them, wash them, spin them, bag them.
Picking lettuce leaves one by one so not to kill the plant, for come again produce, is backbreaking work!
Are salad bags ethical? Are they environmentally friendly, all bagged up, with a shorter shelf life than a whole head of lettuce?


I am going to try this season, not sure if it will work for me, but I'll give it a bash, maybe with carrots, potatoes, parsnips in tubs, covered. I think left in the ground here they would freeze.

We are a capitalistic society, no matter who is the political party in government the system will still be driven by profit, imo.
I remember, many years ago I worked for Asda for a while, when it was the cheapest, before Aldi and Lidle came to play on the market.
I remember my colleagues complaining about some benefit reduction that I, as a new start, wasn't getting anyway.
I wanted to say: what do you expect, we shop here because it's cheap, but the biggest cost for a business is the workforce, how do you think they sell so cheap?
Of course, I shut up
For things to change, the public needs to be aware of the consequences of 20p broccoli.
Like @gbb said, though, will the public care?


Imo, many people have more pressing issues that affect them personally to care much about a vague idea of fairness for farm workers.
I can say for certain "I will never buy 20p Spanish broccoli again" BUT: I don't have dependants, I choose to work lots of hours so I can choose to buy 90p British broccoli in Tesco and Fair Trade coffee at the Coop.
I am their community champion for my area, get a Coop discount, still Aldi's coffee is cheaper.
But I am lucky I can afford to buy Fair Trade, so I do.
I did attend a Fair Trade zoom once, the producer was asked how can people that are on a budget help Fair Trade?
The producer said "those that can afford it, should buy it"
It seems we need a Veg Fair Trade movement!

Sadly, this is true where I live, more some of us clean up, more other people litter.
One time, after a clean up event, someone posted on our FB page "the council should do it"
Nay, the community should not litter, I was going to post, but I didn't
A nearby community gardening group keeps getting vandalised, their aim is to make the local park look nice.
Often, after they have raised money for a project, it gets vandalized before they can complete it.

Sadly, it seems lots don't. I guess it's depending on the area one lives in, though.

Thanks for this info, I didn't know that.

I haven't been to mainland Europe for a few years now, before I came to live in the UK I used to food shop at the local open air market.
Before Corona, I went to visit family in Germany: they took me to Aldi, looked just like my local one

My younger son has just recently, relocated himself up north to your area.

After growing up eating tonnes of green leafy veg, but largely trying to dodge getting involved in growing any of it..

He's now joined a local guerilla growing group, and has lots of teensy kale and spinach beet plants on his balcony awaiting planting out on an old bit of railway ground .

So if you see a dark haired 'stringbean' surreptitiously gardening greens after dark..
You know who it is...