Coronavirus outbreak

[pawl]

Don’t know about paramedics but in Scotland nurses have not paid fees for some time now so I presume by “ national” you mean England.

I did my RMN training back in1984 No tuition fee and was paid a salary We had a book allowance and provided with two made to measure suits.i was married and no way could’ve afforded the burden of tuition fees

Registered training is now a degree course About half of my course were like me mature students

 

[marinyork]

40% are using the app on the Isle of Wight - sky news from the community secretary.

Higher than Singapore. Lower than what is needed.

 

[marinyork]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/10/only-50-of-britons-would-download-nhs-tracing-app-poll

52% of people tell an opinium poll they would download the NHS app. Higher than 40% on the isle of weight and much higher than 17% in singapore. Not that far off 60% needed.

 

[Pat "5mph"]

If tonight Boris lets non essential shops reopen, we are goosed.
Social distancing will go to pots.
Don't know if Nicola Sturgeon has the powers to go above Boris, folks will not listen anyway, they are hardly listening now.
Anyhow, we must go back to work eventually, the only thing is hoping we don't catch the virus, if we do, let's not die from it!
About the cycling, I think here in Glasgow, if public transport stays reduced, people will just take to their cars more.
There will also be an increase in cycle commuting, friction on the roads, more cyclist injured, more walkers annoyed at cyclist on shared paths.
Give it to until the schools reopen, then all will go back to how it was pre- corona.
Until there is a vaccine, there will be a steady daily number dying in the background, nobody caring unless they suffer a personal loss.

 

[Slick]

If tonight Boris lets non essential shops reopen, we are goosed.
Social distancing will go to pots.
Don't know if Nicola Sturgeon has the powers to go above Boris, folks will not listen anyway, they are hardly listening now.
Anyhow, we must go back to work eventually, the only thing is hoping we don't catch the virus, if we do, let's not die from it!
About the cycling, I think here in Glasgow, if public transport stays reduced, people will just take to their cars more.
There will also be an increase in cycle commuting, friction on the roads, more cyclist injured, more walkers annoyed at cyclist on shared paths.
Give it to until the schools reopen, then all will go back to how it was pre- corona.
Until there is a vaccine, there will be a steady daily number dying in the background, nobody caring unless they suffer a personal loss.

That's a pretty bleak picture you have painted there Pat, I can only hope you are wrong. I do know Nicola has already stated she will decide how we come out of lockdown, thankfully as we are some weeks behind the likes of London in the curve apparently which would have helped us as we went in to it together which again I assume means we were effectively earlier in the curve.

I take it lots of people near you are already ignoring the rules?

 

[marinyork]

If tonight Boris lets non essential shops reopen, we are goosed.
Social distancing will go to pots.
Don't know if Nicola Sturgeon has the powers to go above Boris, folks will not listen anyway, they are hardly listening now.
Anyhow, we must go back to work eventually, the only thing is hoping we don't catch the virus, if we do, let's not die from it!
About the cycling, I think here in Glasgow, if public transport stays reduced, people will just take to their cars more.
There will also be an increase in cycle commuting, friction on the roads, more cyclist injured, more walkers annoyed at cyclist on shared paths.
Give it to until the schools reopen, then all will go back to how it was pre- corona.
Until there is a vaccine, there will be a steady daily number dying in the background, nobody caring unless they suffer a personal loss.

I hear what you're saying in Glasgow. In London in Hackney the papers went big on hundreds of large groups having pizza, beer and wine. I've been going to the same park every day around heading home time and there are more and more groups of 4-5 people. Yesterday next door there was a birthday and at least ten households turned up, although most were sensible to sit in the front/back garden or talk at the gate. I go to the same park every day and day by day at heading home time there are more groups of 4-5 people sunbathing/meeting than there were a couple of weeks ago.

It's interesting in places like south korea. So a super spread called patient 31 in Daegu spread it widely around her church in South Korea. So Seuol has closed bars and pubs again https://news.yahoo.com/seoul-closes-bars-clubs-over-fears-second-virus-015054584.html after a new cluster from a superspreader - some saying 30, some 50 cases linked and been around 3 nightclubs or 5 bars and nightclubs the other saturday night depending on which version you read.

 

[tom73]

It's come to something if even private eye is happy to join the government spin.
That only bit's of the NHS are worth any support or funding. We have no magic "front-line" or army of HCP's sat at home on full pay waiting for things to go "back to normal". Neither is a hospital the only part of the health service most care happens in the community. In the bit that no one one talks about "Primary care". Which is carrying on as it has been going in far it's doing even more than before. Any "spare" staff are really better off as is happening. Helping maintain , set up and expand "hospital at home" services to keep people who need the next step up in care out of hospital and away from the GP. it's a whole lot cheeper , more effective and is long over due. Then if we have a few left over they'd be better helping out with at home palliative care services.

We can't send in NHS staff into care homes on mass. We don't have any "NHS" staff. NHS Staff are not employed via one NHS but each trust and staff have been redeployed within them. Sending nurses for example into a care home we'd effectively turn them into all into nursing homes. Registied HCP's have to act as such so can't be expected to work in areas that put that registration at risk. Care homes are not set up the same, the management is totally different , they have different care standards. We'd have none registered staff working under the direct control / accountability of registered staff. With no idea what level of training they've had or if the care plan in place even meets the basics. We'd end up with totally unregulated set of homes which would be a legal and ethical nightmare.

Homes come under LA remit so maybe use them but the only trained staff they have which use the "NHS" brand are employed in a public health role mostly nurses and health visitors. But then who's going to do all this "track and trace" or carry on working with some of the most in need families we have or dealing with other the infectious diseases that have not gone away. Since Public health moved to LA control it's a total mess redeployments will make it even worse.

The current care home issue is not mostly about lack of staff but as with everything else it's lack of planning at all levels.
Many care home are fine they planned for this and it looks to be working. Care sector need's help and fast but sending in an "army" of NHS Staff may sound great but it's not a quick fix as with most things to do with health. You need to dig a lot deeper to really fix things.

Oh and let's move away from the idea that everyone in a care home is 90 and just sat in the chair knitting waiting for a call from the Grim Reaper. Many people in care homes are a lot younger than you think many with a brain that is fully working but with bodies that don't.
Or need full time help to have an active life day to day like group homes do. Equally many patients in a hospice are not day's away from death either.

 

[Unkraut]

The current care home issue is not mostly about lack of staff but as with everything else it's lack of planning at all levels.

You mean there are too many managers who don't actually know how to manage. They like the title and the authority, but when a crisis comes don't have the savvy to deal with it, and blunder around trying to cope with things they ought to have foreseen and planned for. This malaise comes from the top down.

 

[tom73]

You mean there are too many managers who don't actually know how to manage. They like the title and the authority, but when a crisis comes don't have the savvy to deal with it, and blunder around trying to cope with things they ought to have foreseen and planned for. This malaise comes from the top down.

Either that or many being owned by off shore edge funds or other companies just in it for the money.

 

[Pat "5mph"]

I take it lots of people near you are already ignoring the rules?

There has been a very loose interpretation of lockdown here in Glasgow, since the beginning.
Remember, I had to attend hospital daily for 3 weeks at the beginning of lock down.
The hospital is 8 miles in the opposite direction of where I live, so I could clearly see how people were behaving.
If one followed the government rules as they were given, one would have a different idea of what is going on "outside", because, obviously, one is shielded.
All I can say is, let's hope for the best.
A bit like road commuting in rush hour

 

[Slick]

There has been a very loose interpretation of lockdown here in Glasgow, since the beginning.
Remember, I had to attend hospital daily for 3 weeks at the beginning of lock down.
The hospital is 8 miles in the opposite direction of where I live, so I could clearly see how people were behaving.
If one followed the government rules as they were given, one would have a different idea of what is going on "outside", because, obviously, one is shielded.
All I can say is, let's hope for the best.
A bit like road commuting in rush hour

I must admit, I remember when someone posted about the que round the block when B&Q opened and I thought that at least it wasn't happening here until I saw the length of the que round my local store the next day on the news. Because I was following the rules, I wasn't seeing it. I do think when they do finally lift the lockdown, or ease it, we will need to be most careful.

 

[Rickshaw Phil]

I see that the latest slogan from the government is getting mercilessly ragged on twitter.

I quite liked this take on it.


As many have pointed out over there, Stay Apart would be a better message than Stay Alert.

 

[tom73]

This is a public info film on social distancing not from this county.
But the 1st part shows what's about to happen when we get allowed to believe it's all gone away.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJ2NMD3VWio

 

[mjr]

40% are using the app on the Isle of Wight - sky news from the community secretary.

Higher than Singapore. Lower than what is needed.

He said downloaded on the BBC, which does not mean using, but it's still disappointingly high.

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

If tonight Boris lets non essential shops reopen, we are goosed.
Social distancing will go to pots.
Don't know if Nicola Sturgeon has the powers to go above Boris, folks will not listen anyway, they are hardly listening now.
Anyhow, we must go back to work eventually, the only thing is hoping we don't catch the virus, if we do, let's not die from it!
About the cycling, I think here in Glasgow, if public transport stays reduced, people will just take to their cars more.
There will also be an increase in cycle commuting, friction on the roads, more cyclist injured, more walkers annoyed at cyclist on shared paths.
Give it to until the schools reopen, then all will go back to how it was pre- corona.
Until there is a vaccine, there will be a steady daily number dying in the background, nobody caring unless they suffer a personal loss.

Been saying from Day One that multiple "governments" in one country doesn't work in a crisis like this. Leadership is needed and it needs backed with a big stick used liberally. We've got the unfortunate situation of very poor leadership from London and a powerless leader in Edinburgh.

If Thatcher were in charge we'd see a proper lockdown