COVID Vaccine !

[fossyant]

I'm pretty unfazed about the virus personally, but I've never gone for all the conspiracy theory stuff that says the virus is "fake news", because clearly it is 100% real. All the stuff about it being invented by the government to control people or secretly beamed around by British Telecom using their microwave transmitters, is really bizarre.

I'm hoping to get 5g built in, then no need to carry a phone ! 😄

 

[Pale Rider]

Does there?
I'll have it when it comes my way, just not as bothered as some on getting a date.

Only 55 so a bit to go I would suspect.

At the risk of giving the silly leaver/anti-vax notion more attention than it deserves, it currently seems the reverse may be true.

Older people were more likely to vote for Brexit, so we are told, thereby selfishly ruining the lives of the younger generation, blah, blah.

Take up for the vaccine among older people has been close to universal.

Thus we might conclude Brexiteers are more likely to be pro-vaccine.

Remains (ho-ho) to be seen what the take up of younger people is, but I reckon it will be lower for the reasons I've stated earlier.

Ethnic minorities appear to have more vaccine resisters than other groups, but I've no idea what their view on Brexit was.

 

[Rusty Nails]

Is there a correlation between leavers and anti-vaxers? Seems it.

What statistical analysis demonstrates that? It's not Bill Gates sending telepathic messages to you is it?

 

[Julia9054]

I haven't had any kind of vaccination since I was still at school. I had a really nasty virus of some sort in the 96/97 New Year that put me out of action for nearly a week, then nothing much until March 2020 when I got a dose of what I strongly suspect was the Coronavirus. It didn't make me as ill as the previous 96/97 episode though. Someone has said to me I might have had the Bird Flu 24 years ago, although it seems a bit far-fetched. It's rare for anything to really knock me out though, but that 96/97 virus did.



Surely the most important factor in immunity is who is immune not how many? Within a month the vast majority of high risk people with likely bad reactions to the coronavirus will be at least partly if not fully immune. Why would it matter if the low risk population is susceptible, since only a small number of those are ever likely to be hospitalised or die? It's quite conceivable to have a substantial ongoing number of coronavirus cases happening for some time to come without it making very many people seriously ill, in which case the presence of the virus doesn't matter. There are loads of viruses around us all the time. We don't obsess about them.

One aspect you haven't considered is the ability of viruses to mutate. The more a virus circulates, the more opportunities for mutation there is. If one of those mutations means that the previously vaccinated vulnerable people are no longer immune we are back to square one.
Far better that as much of the population are vaccinated as possible, reducing viral circulation and thus mutation. From this perspective "I don't fancy the vaccination because I won't get seriously ill" perspective doesn't really cut it

 

[Ajax Bay]

Is there a correlation between leavers and anti-vaxers? Seems it.

What do you think suggests there might be, @dodgy What deduction(s) would you draw if there was? Is there a correlation between minority communities and anti-vaxxers? Share your definitions of an 'anti-vaxxer' please, just so we know how wide you cast that net.

Surely the most important factor in immunity is who is immune not how many? Within a month the vast majority of high risk people with likely bad reactions to the coronavirus will be at least partly if not fully immune. Why would it matter if the low risk population is susceptible, since only a small number of those are ever likely to be hospitalised or die? It's quite conceivable to have a substantial ongoing number of coronavirus cases happening for some time to come without it making very many people seriously ill, in which case the presence of the virus doesn't matter.

"Surely the most important factor in immunity is who is immune not how many?"
For reducing the number of deaths and serious illness: yes. But we're trying to get beyond that to getting back to a new normal where individuals, communities and the economy can thrive, with the associated necessary tax revenue. And so we need to vaccinate enough to achieve herd immunity, with or without an estimated contribution (?2M under 30) of those who have had C19 since November (June minus 6 months). So "how many" matters (is a major factor).
"Why would it matter if the low risk population is susceptible, since only a small number of those are ever likely to be hospitalised or die? It's quite conceivable to have a substantial ongoing number of coronavirus cases happening for some time to come without it making very many people seriously ill, in which case the presence of the virus doesn't matter."
Two reasons: first: the small number who do get seriously ill or die could be cut by 90%: a good thing in itself. Second: those low risk people are both liable to infect others so contributing to continued circulation of the virus, and increasing its opportunities to mutate to a more lethal and/or a more transmissible and/or a variant against which the current set of vaccinations is less or in-effective. This is not a 'good thing' and by mass vaccination (and other mitigations) the risk can be minimised. [Edit: x post with Julia on that.]
Thus "the presence of the virus" does matter, and herd immunity is an objective worth shooting for, nationally and world-wide. I encourage everyone to say 'yes' to the offer.
By my maths (at a (conservative) 2.5M total doses a week in UK from now on) herd immunity (80% of 67M) on these islands might be achieved by end July (with a few reasonable assumptions, see earlier posts).

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Wife had hers this pm. Very slick operation. Even in a small backwater town the throughput was astonishing to watch. 12 vaccination booths in use and in the short time I was waiting for her to come back out the number of people exiting was very impressive.

No holding the patients (?) back re 15 minutes observation time. She was told not to drive for 15 minutes and that was it.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Were her peers in the hall/queue all under 60? Your time will come soon enough.
Administration of the Oxford-AZ vaccine does not mandate 15 minutes under observation.

 

[AuroraSaab]

The covid jab conspiracy theories are interesting but, as I read elsewhere, what exactly was Bill Gates planning to do on his first day in control of 90 year old Margaret from Coventry?

 

[nickyboy]

The covid jab conspiracy theories are interesting but, as I read elsewhere, what exactly was Bill Gates planning to do on his first day in control of 90 year old Margaret from Coventry?

You've seen Westworld, starring Yul Brinner?

 

[dodgy]

I'm sure the people who are unable to be vaccinated are comforted by those exercising their choice not to get vaccinated.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

Look at the US to see what happens when restrictions are lifted too soon, or not there in the first place.

Except that the per capita mortality rate in the US is actually quite a bit lower than that of the UK and several other European countries. Some parts of Europe can't shout too much about their virus stats either. The official infected percentage of the population in the USA is 8.2%, mortality 145/100k. In the Czech Republic the official infected population is 10%, mortality 168/100k. Same goes for Slovenia, infected percentage 8.5%, mortality is 177/100k. In fact there are nine countries within Europe who have a worse virus mortality rate than the USA, but everyone with a political axe to grind against Trump conveniently turns a blind eye to those and focuses on the total number of recorded US cases, which although high, is not the worst performance by a country that probably has reasonably accurate stats.
Then you've got the global figures that are not realistic. For example does anyone seriously believe that Nigeria, with a population of around 206 million, has only had 144,000 cases and 1710 deaths? Or Iran only having 1.5 million cases amongst 84 million population? Half the official national stats across the globe are just fantasy.

 

[classic33]

It doesn't have to be on the list. All you need is to be able to claim discrimination as one of the others. Employers are going to run a mile from this, along with any business providing goods & services. You think this won't happen? The ambulance chasers are always on the lookout for the next tranche of business. They'll lie low for a good few months yet, because in the current climate it would be bad PR, but when it calms down later in the year the lawyers will be out with a vengeance; "were you refused work or service due to your beliefs not to have a vaccine?" and "did your employer endanger your safety by making you come into contact with others who may have had the virus at work"?
Business are treading on eggshells ATM. Loads of people on my job have had way more time off work than they would normally get away with. Most of them would ordinarily be on a warning for excessive absences by now. Any case of a sniffle or possible virus contact (real or made up) and its "don't come in, you better stay at home on full pay" No questions asked. I could have an extra couple of weeks off anytime I fancy it to do some DIY if I tell them I might have been in contact with the virus, and nobody will bat an eyelid. They're all covering their arses. The unproductive wage costs they will happily swallow this year, they don't want a legal claims time bomb going off in future.

And more work places are demanding offical proof that you've been told to isolate. Similar with the tests, some are asking for a negative test result before allowing you back.

 

[PaulSB]

Surely going seriously stir crazy paul if you're looking forward to a trip to blackburn that much. Especially as the cathedral spoons will be shut.
(Excellent outdoor shop in blackburn though probs shut as well i suppose)

Sadly the shop is currently closed! 'Twas partly tongue in cheek but, yes, this lockdown is getting to everyone I know.

Most of my buddies are spending hours on the turbo. I don't have one. This is a worry.

 

[PaulSB]

I won't be bothering to have it, once they start offering it to the lower age groups. I'm just not that concerned about the virus. Half the population will have either had the vaccine or the virus itself, by the end of March anyway. There won't be so much virus circulating around, and a high proportion of the population will have some level of immunity, so there will be less and less benefit going forward in bothering to get the vaccine.

An astonishingly selfish attitude showing scant regard for society and those you live and work with.

A few hours out of your day to help tackle a pandemic is asking nothing of you.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

I'm sure the people who are unable to be vaccinated are comforted by those exercising their choice not to get vaccinated.

At the end of the day, if someone else chooses, for whatever reason, not to have the vaccine that's up to them. Even if it's because they believe the conspiracy theories and think the government wants to inject them with a microchip. Whatever the reason, its their right to say either yes or no, and it's no business of yours or anyone else's. You make your own decisions, don't poke your nose into other peoples decisions.
It's the typical busybody Remainer attitude from 2016 all over again, where one group of people think everyone who doesn't agree with them must be stupid and need to be lectured about how they should think or act.