Crossing a junction on foot?

[tom73]

Like others have said why can’t you ? What he was thinking god’s know’s suspect he was being a bit power mad and a bit of look at me.

Unless the pavement or highway has clear marking or signage prohibiting cycles then what’s the problem it’s not like your jumping the lights on your bike for example.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

A question for the legal experts: can a cyclist hop off their bike and walk across a junction if the lights turn red (and it is safe to do so!)?
The background: on my regular cycle-commute, I have learned that some sets of traffic lights turn red then have a pedestrian crossing period before the opposing traffic goes, then the lights turn green for me. This evening, the lights turned red so I dismounted (fully) and walked the bike across the side road with some pedestrians. I was about to recount the bike on the far side when a policeman stopped me and threatened me with a fine. His reasoning was that you cannot flip between being a cyclist and a pedestrian - if you approach the junction as a cyclist you must cross as a cyclist and you cannot get off and walk!
Has anyone had experience of this or can anyone point me to relevant rules?
It's just out of interest since he didn't fine me but it would be useful to know in case there's a next time!

As far as I'm concerned, you did nothing illegal - when you're pushing a bike you're a pedestrian. I know of no cases to prove the contrary. Copper flipped because you flipping can flip.

(I have have no idea whether getting out of a motorised vehicle and pushing it across the lights is legal. But I'd love to see it....)

 

[Drago]

(I have have no idea whether getting out of a motorised vehicle and pushing it across the lights is legal. But I'd love to see it....)

Depends on the exact manner in which you do so - if you're in control of the propulsion and braking then you're stuff. Pushing, or even paddling with your feet have stated cases confirming their status as propulsion.

 

[Milkfloat]

Hmmm...I can sort of see the issue if you just pedal up to the junction, stop on the road, dismount and push your bike across that doesn't feel great.

But if you dismount, push bike onto the pavement (thus becoming a pedestrian) and then push bike across the road with other pedestrians that feels better

I don’t see why either matters, as far as I am aware we don’t have a jay walking law and can cross where we like when it is safe to do so.

 

[Welovekorea]

What Nickyboy said. I'm presuming you dismounted and took to the footway with the rest of the peds.

Yes, absolutely. Right off the pedals and walking beside the bike amongst the pedestrians!

 

[nickyboy]

I don’t see why either matters, as far as I am aware we don’t have a jay walking law and can cross where we like when it is safe to do so.

True, but having stopped on your bike in the road, getting off and pushing it across the road doesn't feel right

Having stopped on your bike, if.you then push it onto the pavement then push it across the road with other pedestrians feels much better

 

[Milkfloat]

True, but having stopped on your bike in the road, getting off and pushing it across the road doesn't feel right

Having stopped on your bike, if.you then push it onto the pavement then push it across the road with other pedestrians feels much better

Pushing a bike at all feels wrong to me.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Yes, absolutely. Right off the pedals and walking beside the bike amongst the pedestrians!

Did you cross on the crossing? which side of the red light did you walk, the pavement side or the road side?

 

[mjr]

I don’t see why either matters, as far as I am aware we don’t have a jay walking law and can cross where we like when it is safe to do so.

According to the "it's illegal" crowd AIUI, propelling the bicycle is the offence. If you abandoned the bike on the kerb, it would be fine.

I don't agree but the legislation seems ambiguous and I don't know any direct case law on it. If the offence was driving (rather than propelling) the vehicle past a stop line, that would make it clearly OK, but the lawmakers didn't do that.

 

[Welovekorea]

Did you cross on the crossing? which side of the red light did you walk, the pavement side or the road side?

Road side, but it was a busy crossing (right next to Baker St tube stn in rush hour) and the pavement was full so there were peds right beside me.

 

[boydj]

Did this regularly at one particular set of lights on my commute. There's nothing to stop you, as a pedestrian pushing a bike, from crossing on a pedestrian green.

 

[subaqua]

You mean the asthma police?

CHIMPS

Can’t Help In Most Policing Situations...

 

[mjr]

I had to think a bit hard about this post.

So the argument is that if you come to a halt at a stop line, facing a red light, then dismount and walk your bike across the stop line, then you have effectively "driven" your vehicle over the stop line. But if you propped your bike against the kerb and walked across the stop line there would be no offence. Am I right?

That's how I understand the argument, yes: it's the bike crossing the stop line which is the offence, not you.

Meanwhile we know (from Crank v Brooks) that a person pushing a bike is a "foot passenger" (pedestrian) and is entitled to use a pedestrian crossing with the same protections as other "foot passengers".

So, for the "it's illegal" argument to apply you would have to remain on the carriageway and enter the ped crossing by passing (on foot) over the stop line. But if you'd dismounted, stepped on to the footway with your bike, and entered the crossing from the footway then the "it's illegal" argument wouldn't apply.

Have I understood that right? I have only idle curiosity, but hopping off my bike and walking it through tricky bits then hopping back on is something I do from time to time, so it may be worth understanding.

I think the fly in the ointment with your reasoning is that if there's no stop line (as there isn't on the footway), then the first stop light acts as a virtual stop line.

Personally, I think part of the problem with that whole argument is that you can even ride freely along a cycleway on the left past a traffic light, even when cockwombles put the flaming traffic light post in the cycleway!

 

[pjd57]

Coming home from Hampden after a football match , I came to a set of lights.
No traffic whatsoever. Green Man showing , so I peddled across.
100 yards down the road a police motor cyclist comes up behind me , blue light on and stops me.
When I said I went through on green Man, no traffic etc he launched into his lecture...
I couldn't be bothered arguing or telling him to go chase criminals etc.
He seemed pleased with himself and rode off.

I rode through the same junction today and noticed that the green Man is accompanied by a green bike.
I don't know if it's been changed since my chase incident.

 

[derrick]

A question for the legal experts: can a cyclist hop off their bike and walk across a junction if the lights turn red (and it is safe to do so!)?
The background: on my regular cycle-commute, I have learned that some sets of traffic lights turn red then have a pedestrian crossing period before the opposing traffic goes, then the lights turn green for me. This evening, the lights turned red so I dismounted (fully) and walked the bike across the side road with some pedestrians. I was about to recount the bike on the far side when a policeman stopped me and threatened me with a fine. His reasoning was that you cannot flip between being a cyclist and a pedestrian - if you approach the junction as a cyclist you must cross as a cyclist and you cannot get off and walk!
Has anyone had experience of this or can anyone point me to relevant rules?
It's just out of interest since he didn't fine me but it would be useful to know in case there's a next time!

So how many seconds did you save yourself?