Cycle versus car - false economy?

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JhnBssll

Veteran
Location
Suffolk
On a similar note I read an interesting article a few years back which was suggesting ebikes were better for the environment than bicycles because the energy required to grow/farm/process/transport food was higher than that required to make a battery and keep it charged. Obviously I've paraphrased and didn't check the accuracy of their arguments but it does make you think.

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Sharky

Guru
Location
Kent
Sure, but if the individual cyclist ends up thinner
This could skew the analysis completely. The cyclist may have to budget for a completely new set of clothing in smaller sizes!
 

roubaixtuesday

self serving virtue signaller
On a similar note I read an interesting article a few years back which was suggesting ebikes were better for the environment than bicycles because the energy required to grow/farm/process/transport food was higher than that required to make a battery and keep it charged. Obviously I've paraphrased and didn't check the accuracy of their arguments but it does make you think.

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Presumably depends enormously on the foodstuff consumed? Different foods have wildly different greenhouse gas emissions.

I vaguely recall a tabloid article claiming driving was better than cycling a few years back.

Turned out they assumed the car driver was in the most efficient car on the market, shared with 4 other people, and the cyclist was consuming Wagyu fillet steak for their calories...
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Sometimes you do wonder if cycle commuting is cheaper, especially when you've had a run on a new set of wheels, chain, cassette and chain rings, brake pads and tyres (all since summer). :ohmy:

But then again, parking is £4 a day, and petrol can be up to £6 a day, much less if I take the Aygo (£3). I've yet to drive into work this year, but I have to drive for the next week or two (post covid) so I'll be able to work the cost out properly. I'm in the office 3 days a week so it's an easy saving of £30 a week. Only takes a month or two of riding to recover the cost of the 'annual' parts though, so the next 10 months I'm saving, and, most importantly, keeping fit without having to resort to Zwift or night riding. :okay:
 

EltonFrog

Legendary Member
What about time? The cost of your effectiveness. I have a journey which I do weekly. It’s a twelve mile drive, park and cycle the last 3.5 miles. The time it takes ,me to ride the 3.5 miles is about 15 minutes, if I drive that same journey can take from 20 to 45 minutes. Should we factor the cost of our time? In the above scenario it cost about £3.12 to ride and between £4.16 and £9.37 to drive that last 3.5 miles.
 

JhnBssll

Veteran
Location
Suffolk
Presumably depends enormously on the foodstuff consumed? Different foods have wildly different greenhouse gas emissions.

I vaguely recall a tabloid article claiming driving was better than cycling a few years back.

Turned out they assumed the car driver was in the most efficient car on the market, shared with 4 other people, and the cyclist was consuming Wagyu fillet steak for their calories...

Of course you make a good point, you can prove almost anything with statistics after all. I think there's something to this single person electric transport though, the Chinese have been running electric mopeds for decades based on 12v car batteries - I remember almost getting flattened by a mob of silent moped commuters when I first visited Shanghai!
 

roubaixtuesday

self serving virtue signaller
Of course you make a good point, you can prove almost anything with statistics after all. I think there's something to this single person electric transport though, the Chinese have been running electric mopeds for decades based on 12v car batteries - I remember almost getting flattened by a mob of silent moped commuters when I first visited Shanghai!

Oh, I agree it could well be better from a GHG perspective, and certainly miles better than driving in all sorts of ways. Just a little sceptical of statistics.

I was also astonished on the one time I visited Shanghai by the e-scooters. I assume they just banned two strokes for air pollution. I didn't realise they were lead acid battery driven, assumed they were lithium.
 

Ming the Merciless

There is no mercy
Location
Inside my skull
Plus of course if you drive you’ll stop at the drive through McDs, buy a chocolate bar and coke when you fill up. All food consumed when you drive that you wouldn’t consume if you were cycling.
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Time wise, it's faster for me to cycle 10 or 13 miles (depending upon route) than it is to drive the 10 miles. Certainly more reliable as I arrive at work within a couple of minutes around a 45 minute cycle. Car can be 45 minutes, an hour or even longer. OK getting changed/showered adds time, but I'd have to then fit in extra time in an evening to exercise.
 

si_c

Guru
Location
Wirral
Time wise, it's faster for me to cycle 10 or 13 miles (depending upon route) than it is to drive the 10 miles. Certainly more reliable as I arrive at work within a couple of minutes around a 45 minute cycle. Car can be 45 minutes, an hour or even longer. OK getting changed/showered adds time, but I'd have to then fit in extra time in an evening to exercise.

For sure, but then you'd have had a shower before you left the house anyway so that time is just shifted to the end of your journey.
 
OP
OP
wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
On a similar note I read an interesting article a few years back which was suggesting ebikes were better for the environment than bicycles because the energy required to grow/farm/process/transport food was higher than that required to make a battery and keep it charged. Obviously I've paraphrased and didn't check the accuracy of their arguments but it does make you think.

View attachment 668709
I must admit I thought similar when posting this (well, in isolation about the energy cost of food, not relative to ebikes) but closed the lid on that particular pandora's box and slowly stepped away :whistle:


What about time? The cost of your effectiveness. I have a journey which I do weekly. It’s a twelve mile drive, park and cycle the last 3.5 miles. The time it takes ,me to ride the 3.5 miles is about 15 minutes, if I drive that same journey can take from 20 to 45 minutes. Should we factor the cost of our time? In the above scenario it cost about £3.12 to ride and between £4.16 and £9.37 to drive that last 3.5 miles.
Indeed; although again that could go both ways. The sausagemongers is probably a 2.5hr round trip on the bike on a good day, maybe an hour in the car. Is that 1.5hrs wasted on the bike when I could have been doing something else, or a bonus hour on the bike getting some exercise in, that I'd otherwise have spent sat on my arse in the car?
 

cyberknight

As long as I breathe, I attack.
What about time? The cost of your effectiveness. I have a journey which I do weekly. It’s a twelve mile drive, park and cycle the last 3.5 miles. The time it takes ,me to ride the 3.5 miles is about 15 minutes, if I drive that same journey can take from 20 to 45 minutes. Should we factor the cost of our time? In the above scenario it cost about £3.12 to ride and between £4.16 and £9.37 to drive that last 3.5 miles.

for me i have to cycle further to get to the same destination and takes me an extra 15-20 mins each way .Shortest route is 8.5 miles but not safe to cycle so the shortest safe way is 9.70 miles .
 
My main use for a car - were I to have one - would be to go to the German discount supermarket for my groceries. There isn't one within easy walking distance, nor is there a bus service to the nearest one. So until last summer I'd been getting a taxi - either there and back to the nearest, or bus to another, and taxi back. It used to be a weekly expense of £10 - £15 but since getting my bike last summer and fixed up with roomy racks and baskets front and back, I think I've gone the taxi route maybe half a dozen times in nearly 18 months, which by my reckoning means the bike has paid for itself and anything else I get from it - pleasure, for instance! - is free.
 
OP
OP
wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
My main use for a car - were I to have one - would be to go to the German discount supermarket for my groceries. There isn't one within easy walking distance, nor is there a bus service to the nearest one. So until last summer I'd been getting a taxi - either there and back to the nearest, or bus to another, and taxi back. It used to be a weekly expense of £10 - £15 but since getting my bike last summer and fixed up with roomy racks and baskets front and back, I think I've gone the taxi route maybe half a dozen times in nearly 18 months, which by my reckoning means the bike has paid for itself and anything else I get from it - pleasure, for instance! - is free.

Excellent work - that's got to be a great saving against the cost of taxis!

My situation is similar as the nearest half-decent supermarket is 6-9 miles away depending on the route. Can't say as I'm too enthusiastic about taking the bike on days like today though..
 
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