Cyclists' deaths & statistics

[srw]

Agreed

But nearly twice as many road deaths in france occurs than in the UK?

So the question is why?

No - the question is does the difference matter? And I'd say that to a first approximation the answer is "no" from the perspective of the ordinary road user - both countries are very safe.)

(If you want the answer from the perspective of the public health official, I suspect the answer to your question is a combination of factors, mostly structural: France is a bigger country with larger distances between towns, has a bigger network of minor roads, has toll motorways which means more people use minor roads for longer differences, and has a different attitude to drink-driving.)

 

[albion]

Actually both statistics show that using roads is very safe.

If you clock up the miles it can be said to be quite unsafe, especially here in the UK.

In that '600% more chance of injury' here in the UK, at what level does it actually makes it unsafe?

 

[briantrumpet]

If you clock up the miles it can be said to be quite unsafe, especially here in the UK.

In that '600% more chance of injury' here in the UK, at what level does it actually makes it unsafe?

DoT figures for 2011 (source) state there were 35 deaths per billion miles travelled (that's one death per 28.5 million miles travelled). I'm happy to take my chances on that.

 

[albion]

It really does sounds like you do not cycle.

What on earth has that to do with cycling?

 

[briantrumpet]

It really does sounds like you do not cycle.

Only about 9,000 miles a year.

 

[Linford]

With regards to those real cycle stats linked, they shows that you have 2650% more chance of being injured on the roads in the US and 600% more chance in the UK compared to the Netherlands.

So we have 3 times the chance of 'cycling death' and 6 times the chance of injury here in the UK.
Considering that the overall quality of UK driving is actually very good methinks we must have an extremely dangerous minority of killers at the wheel of UK cars.

Overall stats show that the roads in NL are more dangerous than the UK though per bliion kms travelled which indicates that there are lower standards there.

 

[albion]

I still can't work out why you and Brian using car driving stats. It matters little if a driver has driven 14 hours or 1 hour as the UK one still kills 3 times as many cyclists per mile cycled.

Unsafe stats certainly makes for unsafer cycling.

 

[srw]

3 times bugger all is still bugger all.

A little over 100 cyclists per year are killed - out of 2 million regular cyclists and out of about 5 billion km.
http://cyclinginfo.co.uk/blog/2636/cycling/stats-uk/

That's 25 fatalities per billion km, or as Brian correctly says about 35 fatalities per billion miles. One death per 28.5 million miles. Even at a rather high 10,000 miles per year you've got to ride for nearly 3000 years to get to 28.5 million miles. And the increased risk in terms of heart disease and cancer of not taking exercise is massive.

 

[briantrumpet]

I still can't work out why you and Brian using car driving stats. It matters little if a driver has driven 14 hours or 1 hour as the UK one still kills 3 times as many cyclists per mile cycled.

To quote CTC info from DoT figures: "The mileage cycled in the UK is up 20% over the last 12 years from 4 billion kms in 1998 to 5 billion kms in 2011". That's about 3 billion miles cycled. 107 fatalities. That's about 35 fatalities per billion miles cycled.

 

[albion]

Seems my initial search of this 5 billion found car miles for foreign drivers.

http://www.ctc.org.uk/file/Public/1210_cp_factsfigs_brf.pdf
So the cycling They also say that there are 8 million cycle trips per death.
So if you make 2 trips per day you have a 200 to one chance of death over a 60 year cycling period.
Holland would be 600 to one.


Now, if instead of doing the average 2km you do 20 km per trip then it becomes a 1 in 20 chance of death compared to 1 in 60 for Holland.
That equates to a calculation I did a while that my risk of death cycling takes a 1 year off my life but adds 5 to 10 years through health benefits.

 

[srw]

Seems my initial search of this 5 billion found car miles for foreign drivers.

http://www.ctc.org.uk/file/Public/1210_cp_factsfigs_brf.pdf
So the cycling They also say that there are 8 million cycle trips per death.
So if you make 2 trips per day you have a 200 to one chance of death over a 60 year cycling period.
Holland would be 600 to one.


Now, if instead of doing the average 2km you do 20 km per trip then it becomes a 1 in 20 chance of death compared to 1 in 60 for Holland.
That equates to a calculation I did a while that my risk of death cycling takes a 1 year off my life but adds 5 to 10 years through health benefits.

False logic. The 8 million cycle trips per deaths includes everything from the 2km pootle to the 200km all-day ride - and beyond.

 

[albion]

And 300 yard trips to the shops.

Maybe the UK average is more(anyone know?) but the logic certainly is not false.
Those chances of death still read high even with a longer average trip.


One thing for sure., using those stats I'd be very wary of cycling on road in the US.
All relative of course. Long term I'd still like the 3 to 6 times safer Netherlands record here.

Surely that is achievable?

 

[srw]

And 300 yard trips to the shops.

Maybe the UK average is more(anyone know?) but the logic certainly is not false.
Those chances of death still read high even with a longer average trip.

Take a look at my post a few up. That answers your point. There's one death per 28.5 million miles. You've somehow come up with a figure equivalent to one death per 292,000km - assuming you ride 40km per day, 365 days per year.

 

[albion]

"So the cycling They also say that there are 8 million cycle trips per death.
So if you make 2 trips per day you have a 200 to one chance of death over a 60 year cycling period.
Holland would be 600 to one."

Trip length is irrelevant with the stats above. But assuming they both use same source that makes for an average trip length of about 5.5km.

 

[wealthysoup]

Agreed

But nearly twice as many road deaths in france occurs than in the UK?

So the question is why?

Your missing a lot out by using only the deaths per 100,000 population figure.

What we can safely assume:

French drivers drive further than British drivers, on average each year (taken from your earlier post, road deaths per billion km travelled).
If we were to take a comparison of both of those figures together the chances of dieing on a road in France wouldn't be nearly double that of the UK (too tired to figure it out exactly at the minute).

If France has more countryside and less built up areas that the UK then we also need more information which may affect the fatality rate.
This could include things such as:

Average distance to a hospital.
Road lighting if relevant.
Ambulance coverage and response times.
Speed limits and a comparison of how likely drivers are to stick to them in each country.
Mobile Phone coverage.
Average age of cars in use on the road.

There will be more factors than this but I'm sure you would agree that if France was behind the UK on factors such as these they could all contribute towards the difference in fatalities.