Cyclists down a30

[mooseracer]

I grew up in Blackwater (Itself on the A30 until it was bypassed some years ago and not far from this terrible tragedy) and still travel on that road frequently. It is very busy at this time of year. Despite the fact there's a hard shoulder on most if it I would feel very uncomfortable indeed riding any distance on it.

RIP to these 2

 

[Risex4]

Horrific and tragic. Potentially an understatement, but I can't think of the right words to use in this instance.

I'm not going to get into the blame game as there are too many questions for other people to consider first, but regardless of who ends up being at fault here, at what point does someone turn around and say we need to review the rules of the road re: cycling allowance on such highways?

I get what people have said about weighing up the risks on an personal basis, but truly its not fair when people don't/can't understand the individual risks. Motorways are motorways, everyone knows what to expect, and that bikes shouldn't be on them; everyone's happy.

IMO, the A-Road classification (and the subsequent allowance of cycling transit upon them) in this regards is far too broad. A Roads can be anything from pseudo-motorways to gridlocked, single-lane moving car parks in town centres. Ok, people can prepare to a degree by pre-investigating them, but you will never truly know the nature of a road until you've cycled it, sometimes to a very high cost. Locals would know to give it a wide birth, "foreigners" may well think its a risk worth taking through lack of experience.

I know it may be a dubious subject, but I believe roads like this stretch need some kind of re-categorization and subsequent banning of bikes. Whether we like it or not, this kind of road was designed for the fast transit of heavy transport, the fact that we are allowed upon them is a technicality and an oversight. To simply say lorry drivers need training or some such thing is too simplistic.

I've been measuring up a direct JOGLE route, and the A30 was very much in consideration. I'm now having a serious rethink.

 

[DWiggy]

Would it be a stupid idea/suggestion if cyclists were able to ride on the hard shoulder but on the opposite side of the road (Facing oncoming traffic) on these large unavoidable A roads?

 

[subaqua]

Which cannot happen whilst >50% people rely on cars. Or are you advocating the end of democracy?
Would it be better not to go for presumed liability which is feasible? A greater deterrent than we have now even if far from perfect.

We can presume this driver did not intend to kill. We do not even know if a collision was unavoidable (and if it was deterrents don't count). Why not wait until we know the cause and hence what remedies might be best employed. And presuming somebody out there is going to suggest banning bicycles on the A30 - how we deal with that?

For what its worth I would love to see the national speed limit reduced to 40 mph EXCEPT where a carriageway is provided for cyclists and maintained to the same standard allowing two cyclists side by side in each direction to cover the same distance in the same time. Yep, I know I'm dreaming too - except isn't this much the norm in the Netherlands?

In much the same way that the A406 north circular in vast parts has, the same way the A12 link road has, the same way the A55 expressway has local byelaws for that particular road.
I know that bit of road fairly well and it is a motorway in all but name all the way from Bodmin to Carland Cross. even the single carriageway towards Zelah from carland is terrible - even more so at this time of year when tourist season hits.
When i ride in that area I try and use the A3075 but even that is hairy in the summer between 3 Burrows and Newquay and the hill at Rejerrah ain't my favourite

 

[Mo1959]

They have been named now.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-23157100

 

[lejogger]

And presuming somebody out there is going to suggest banning bicycles on the A30 - how we deal with that?

There are sections of other A roads that prohibit cycling and maybe that's something to be looked into on the A30.
Although it may seem from my posts that I'm pro cycling on the A30, I'm not so much, (although I have done and didn't feel much more in danger than other busy A roads) it's more that I think by blaming these deaths on the fact that they chose to cycle on a busy road we're doing them a huge disservice. Any road that doesn't ban cycling should in theory be somewhere a cyclist can ride and feel safe. Blaming the A30 is excusing the true cause of the accident which I believe is as yet unknown but likely to be something that 'could' have happened anywhere.

There's a whole lot of knee jerk reaction going on. Yes this is an absolutely horrific case, but it would be interesting to see the stats on cycling related incidents/injuries/fatalities for this road especially considering the location on the LEJOG route it must be one of the most used sections of dual carriageway by cyclists in the country.

If we start shouting to be banned from roads whenever a horrible accident takes place we'll eventually be restricted to cycle lanes and pathways only. What we should be shouting for is making all suitable roads safer for us to be on. Whether it's by reducing speed limits, separate cycle lanes, redesigned or better visibility on large vehicles, or whatever else it may be.

Let's enable ourselves to cycle safely, not restrict ourselves from our right to travel by our own means.

 

[Mo1959]

@lejogger Excellent post.

 

[BigonaBianchi]

....there are to many cars...its that simple...we are a tiny country with way way to many cars . Reduce car ownership and you reduce the risk....

That lorry driver killed. Simple as that, intentional of course not, but that's no excuse, when you point a bloody great big lorry at anybody that person will die just as if you 'accidently' point a gun in their direction. Its a lethal weapon and the law should reflect it.

 

[lejogger]

....there are to many cars...its that simple...we are a tiny country with way way to many cars . Reduce car ownership and you reduce the risk....

Car drivers would argue that there are too many bikes. Why should they be disadvantaged because we want to feel safer?
We can't stop them owning a car in the same way that they can't stop us owning a bike.

Infrastructure needs to reflect that the numbers of drivers and cyclists are only going to increase and there needs to be a way for us all to live together.

I'm sure there are many options to improve the situation, but denying freedom of choice to travel how you wish isn't one of them.

 

[StuartG]

If we start shouting to be banned from roads whenever a horrible accident takes place we'll eventually be restricted to cycle lanes and pathways only.

It isn't us but non-cycling centric road safety people and sound reasonable to most people. It something we need to be pro-active about as heavily used near motorway roads are likely to proliferate in the Government's projected infrastructure investments.

Which didn't mention cycling! Realistically we need to push that any new road being 'dualled' should accommodate cyclists in some way. And not being banished to an ill maintained, narrow, windy, junction ridden cyclepath. The bottom line is the cyclist should be seen as having the right to progress on any alternative as fast as on the new provision. It would be great if that could be made statutory.If, for practical or cost reasons it isn't realistic than the speed limit be lowered to lower risk to cyclists on the road. It isn't just about collisions. An artic doing 60 making a close pass will blow/suck you from your path ...

 

[BigonaBianchi]

Car drivers would argue that there are too many bikes. Why should they be disadvantaged because we want to feel safer?
We can't stop them owning a car in the same way that they can't stop us owning a bike.

Infrastructure needs to reflect that the numbers of drivers and cyclists are only going to increase and there needs to be a way for us all to live together.

I'm sure there are many options to improve the situation, but denying freedom of choice to travel how you wish isn't one of them.

there is a limit to what we as humans can just keep taking....just to assume more cars and bikes will mean more cars...we don't have a god given right to just expand our tin can culture endlessly...we don't need more roads...we need less cars, less greed and people just have to accept that they cant always get what they want...the car culture is king in this mixed up society, its time to change attidudes...and not just keep saying we need more cars more roads more more more more more....

roll on the next oil crisis...

 

[jefmcg]

http://uk.virginmoneygiving.com/fun....action?userUrl=mcmenigallwallace&isTeam=true

 

[Deleted member 20519]

Absolutely awful

 

[nilling]

RIP fellow cyclists

I commute on an A-road not too dissimilar. There are no alternative routes with it being on the coast. Expect more calls to ban cyclists from busy A-roads

 

[4F]

RIP to the two cyclists and thoughts with the families left behind.

I think the problem with this road in particular is that it is treated as an extension of the M5 being the main artery route into the south west inwards from Exeter and road users just do not expect to see cyclists on it. There are some A roads in this country which literally are essentially motorways all bar the name. The A14 here is another one I would put in this catagory and whilst I have ridden on part of it on a Saturday morning, it is not an experience I would consider doing again and certainly not one I would ever do on a week day down to the constant flow of HGV's that use it.