Dishwasher tablets

[Fab Foodie]

A few months ago Aldi changed the pack for their one litre Magnum washing up liquid. Previously the bottle was the same shape, but larger, as the 500ml offering. It was also renamed Magnum Original. I didn't think much of this till I started using it and found I needed 2-3 times the amount to get any sort of decent lather which didn't last very long.

I bought a second bottle and found the same. It occurred to me the active ingredients might have changed. Earlier this week I checked it out when I bought the 500ml bottle which is giving the results I expected.

Magnum Original (79p per litre)
Anionic Surfactants 5-15%
Amphoteric Surfactants <5%

Magnum 500ml (£1.38 per litre)
Anionic Surfactants 15-30%
Non-ionic Surfactants 5-15%
Amphoteric Surfactants <5%

Out of interest, I'm not really this sad, I've checked the active ingredients in dishwasher tablets.

Fairy Platinum (26p Sainsbury website)

• 5-15% Non-Ionic Surfactants Oxygen-Based Bleaching Agents,
• <5% Phosphonates,
• Polycarboxylates,
• Enzymes,
• Perfumes,
• Citronellol,
• Limonene,
• Linalool

Aldi Magnum Premium (11p Aldi website)

• 5-15%: Oxygen-based Bleaching Agents, Non-ionic Surfactants
• <5%: Phosphonates
• Polycarboxylates
• Enzymes,
• Perfumes
• Limonene
• Benzisothiazolinone
• Sodium Pyrithione.

I'm no chemist but it seems to me for washing up liquid cheap isn't great value. The dishwasher tablets appear identical and one is paying 15p per tablet for marketing. You pays your money............

Whilst I basically agree with you here, there is some wriggle-room in those ranges; 5 to 15 meany is can have 5 or 15. And less than 5% can be a significant difference. Much of this is due to labelling regs for that type of product. Those ingredients that are not given a range might be present at a significantly active level or at trace levels only for the declaration. Therefore there could be notable differences between performance even if the ingredient declaration is the same.

Also, as alluded to upthread, just because Bigsoapco make expensive branded products as well as cheaper own-label versions that the recipes and the quality of the ingredients are exactly the same - they will not be.
But in the real world, you pays your money and takes your choice. Wimpers will pay a premium for Neurofen at 3 to for times the price of the supermarket version - both have the same active ingredient, but she believe the branded version works faster.

My last comment comes from a meeting at Bigsoapco many years ago. Having seen all the testing work etc that goes on I quietly asked one of the R&D staff which they thought was best to buy...after a quiet look around the answer was 'whatever's on special offer'....

 

[Pale Rider]

Without pre-rinsing ours demolishes toughies such as solidified Weetabix and even baked-on gunk on frying pans.

I suspect the amount of abrasive in the detergent has a big impact on performance.

Which brings into question care of your cutlery and crockery.

Gold painted crockery used to be a complete no-no, but I believe some makers now claim their soap/machine will not damage such items.

I'm a bit cynical about that because the cleaning can only be a mixture of water pressure and abrasive.

Far better to use Fairy and have hands like Nanette Newman.

 

[Alex321]

Unless you have a large family or work in a cafe/residential home etc then i dont see the point of them. Its quicker to wash up and rinse in the sink.Also when pots and pans have a lot of food on them still , you have to wash them first anyway?

The dishwasher usually gets things cleaner than I can manage by hand, and I never wash anything first. If something has baked on food, I will soak that first, but that is about it.

 

[Alex321]

Re; dishwasher salt. Many of the tablets are 3 in 1 or 4 in 1 and have their own salt/rinse aid 'built in' so if you put additional additives into your machine you are effectively paying twice and throwing excess chemicals down the drain.

If the salt is not needed, it won't be used up.

The first dishwasher we ever had, we were in a soft water area (most of South Wales is), I loaded up the salt receptacle, and never needed to top it up - it hadn't gone down noticeably in a couple of years use.

 

[Alex321]

I use a sink and washing up liquid, but do genuinely wonder about the merit of dishwashers.

Seems a lot of faff, expense, and probably wasted time and water if you have to rinse the stuff first.

You don't. Unless there is baked on food residue, everything just goes straight in the dishwasher with us. Baked on residue will get a soak from when we finish using it until I load the dishwasher.

I've some sympathy for large families, but as a sad, lonely, single person, leaving several days of washing up festering in the dishwasher to fill it is also a nonsense.

There are only two of us, but it is a rare day when we use little enough for me to put the machine on half load.

I did use a commercial dishwasher while working at a control on London Edinburgh London.

That thing did do the job, but I bet it thrashed the crockery and cutlery.

I believe gold painted crockery is still a risk in a dishwasher, which is something else that rules me out.

Yes, the jets are powerful enough that they are likely to damage that sort of thing. But we wouldn't use that crockery for everyday use.

The one thing that has caught me out recently was my wife's drinking bottle. It couldn't take the heat and went misshapen. I discovered that boiling water in it has a similar effect, but even while soft, couldn't get it back to original shape. My wife was NOT pleased. My bike bottles are absolutely fine in the dishwasher.

 

[Alex321]

I suspect the amount of abrasive in the detergent has a big impact on performance.

Which brings into question care of your cutlery and crockery.

Gold painted crockery used to be a complete no-no, but I believe some makers now claim their soap/machine will not damage such items.

I'm a bit cynical about that because the cleaning can only be a mixture of water pressure and abrasive.

Far better to use Fairy and have hands like Nanette Newman.

No, it isn't abrasive, it is detergent, not that different to the detergent in your bottle of fairy liquid. But the water pressure can certainly damage some delicate items.

 

[lazybloke]

If the salt is not needed, it won't be used up.

The first dishwasher we ever had, we were in a soft water area (most of South Wales is), I loaded up the salt receptacle, and never needed to top it up - it hadn't gone down noticeably in a couple of years use.

Your dishwasher might merely have its softener switched off. There are magic key presses to do this, or to adjust them for various degrees Clark/hardness.

I guess the better dishwashers will self-adjust.

My water comes out of a borehole through solid chalk, which is why i buy 25kg bags of salt!

 

[Pale Rider]

No, it isn't abrasive, it is detergent, not that different to the detergent in your bottle of fairy liquid. But the water pressure can certainly damage some delicate items.

Seems that bold assertion needs a little qualification.

Gel tablets may not be abrasive, but compressed powder ones are.

You can even clean your oven with those.

https://www.tasteofhome.com/article...hard powder tablets,to scratch the oven glass.

 

[Alex321]

Your dishwasher might merely have its softener switched off. There are magic key presses to do this, or to adjust them for various degrees Clark/hardness.

I guess the better dishwashers will self-adjust.

My water comes out of a borehole through solid chalk, which is why i buy 25kg bags of salt!

Not that one. We are talking early 90's here. The salt just doesn't dissolve if the water is soft.

 

[lazybloke]

Not that one. We are talking early 90's here. The salt just doesn't dissolve if the water is soft.

Your pasta must taste dreadful!

 

[Alex321]

Your pasta must taste dreadful!

Surprising as it may seem, dishwasher salt is not the same as table salt

Having just read up on it, the salt does actually dissolve, but then just sits in the water softener reservoir (it never actually gets into the water that is used for washing the dishes). The salt actually replenishes the ions in the water softener, so if those are not used up because the water is already soft enough, then the salt never gets used up either.

 

[lazybloke]

Surprising as it may seem, dishwasher salt is not the same as table salt

Having just read up on it, the salt does actually dissolve, but then just sits in the water softener reservoir (it never actually gets into the water that is used for washing the dishes). The salt actually replenishes the ions in the water softener, so if those are not used up because the water is already soft enough, then the salt never gets used up either.

Pretty sure it's just table-salt, NaCl. I've even put table salt in my dishwasher on occasion. not recommended!


I've had a whole-house softener for the last 20 years. The photo is looking into the brine tank so you can see the salt tablets.
incoming watet is only circulated through the resin in the blue pressure vessel; the it goes off to the taps.

When the resin needs a refresh, the electronics do some clever things to somehow draw the brine through the resin. I can't think how this is achieved, as there isn't any pump that I can see.

 

[Alex321]

Pretty sure it's just table-salt, NaCl. I've even put table salt in my dishwasher on occasion.

You shouldn't, it could damage the dishwasher water softener (and is a lot more expensive).

Yes, it is Sodium Chloride. But it doesn't have the additives that table salt does, such as anti-caking agents. And conversely, dishwasher salt isn't defined as food-grade, so could have traces of toxins that would not be allowed in table salt. It is also larger crystals.

 

[lazybloke]

You shouldn't, it could damage the dishwasher water softener (and is a lot more expensive). Yes, it is Sodium Chloride. But it doesn't have the additives that table salt does, such as anti-caking agents.

Ooh, hadn't thought of additives. I will edit my previous post so people don't take table salt as a recommendation for their dishwashers.
Fortunately I've not used table salt in my current dishwasher; no need to when I have 25kg bags of softening salt.

And conversely, dishwasher salt isn't defined as food-grade, so could have traces of toxins that would not be allowed in table salt. It is also larger crystals.

No, the blocks won't fit in my salt cellar!

It ceratinly isn't packaged or stored in the same high quality conditions as table salt, but it is designed for treatment of drinking water. I understand it's the same purity as table salf (purer in fact, as it doesn't have the additives you mention). Hopefully no toxins!

 

[Alex321]

It ceratinly isn't packaged or stored in the same high quality conditions as table salt, but it is designed for treatment of drinking water. I understand it's the same purity as table salf (purer in fact, as it doesn't have the additives you mention). Hopefully no toxins!

It doesn't get into the water being treated at all, or only in very tiny amounts (either in a dishwasher or in a home water softener). It sits in a separate reservoir (or "brine tank"), and is only used for refreshing the resin beads which do the actual water softening.