Doubling Up On Road

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DonnyDarko

New Member
Regardless of what the law says, I find it discouteous.

It's perfectly legal to walk three-abreast along the pavement, but if a little old lady is coming the other way with her shopping trolley, it's kind, courteous and thoughtful to move into file while she passes.

The argument that 'a passing car should allow as much space as it does for a car' can lose something in real life.

If we are arguing that a car must allow a single cyclist the same room they allow a car, does that mean a whole lane?

That is the width I allow for a car when I'm passing it in my car.

That being so, do I then allow two whole lanes for two cyclists riding abreast?

If not, do I allow them the width I'd give a car plus the width of one bicycle?

This is a serious question, not some exercise in elementary trolling.

In the lanes around my picturesque market town, passing a single bicycle is fraught with difficulty. I know. I train regularly on those lanes; so do my two younger children, who still live at home.

Passing two cycles abreast is a practical impossibility unless they go in line astern.

I ride 2-abreast with my children along the lanes, but as soon as we hear a car we slip into line. It's a common courtesy.

On most roads, I would not even consider riding two-abreast.

"Because the HC says I can" just seems the weak justification of the kind of cyclist who refers to motorists as 'motons'.

But I'm lucky. In 40 years cycling and 30 years driving, I've never had a cross word with another motorist or cyclist. Maybe if I'd been unfortunate enough to elicit quite unjustified insults from other road users, I'd be more inclined to hang with my grimy fingertips onto the hallowed word of the HC. I don't know.

That's what I sort of thought.

Though clearly it is law and okay, so that answers my questions then. I'll keep sitting behind them until I can get in the other lane okay then. :smile:

Sorry to the others if I got your back up. It was a genuine question, but clearly as a car driver (if you see my other threads I'm actually after advice on bikes, but thought I'd ask some other stuff while I'm here).
 
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DonnyDarko

New Member
S'funny you know, motorists have little problem being patient and giving a very wide berth to horses ....

You're right there. But I give a wide berth and generally try not to rev when overtaking them in case they pull some wild west stut and jump on the car lol

Unless it's Danny McKaskill (spelling?!) I couldn't see it happening with a biker.
 

Hip Priest

Veteran
You are misquoting what the highway code says. Is that to try to give some apparent validity to your erroneous point?

Erm no.

MrHappyCyclist said:
HC rule 163 says: "give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car". That means, if you would give a car 9 feet in which to manoeuvre when you pass it, then you should give a cyclist 9 feet in which to manoeuvre when you you pass.

Exactly. If you give a car and a cyclist 9 feet of clearance, you'll be further over for the car than the bike, simply because the right hand side of a car is going to be further over to the right than that of a bike.
 
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DonnyDarko

New Member
You seem to be making the same points to me there. I get it though.

If it's okay to double up then that's sound. And if making a bigger appearance saves lives when grouping up, that's more than just sound, that's probably saving a few lives there a year.

So you've all answered my question. In a car I'll just hang back more now. And on a bike I'll try to tail a couple of people.

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YES! been looking for the smiley thing and just clocked it. Wanted a thumbs up one earlier. haha
 

MrHappyCyclist

Riding the Devil's HIghway
Location
Bolton, England
Exactly. If you give a car and a cyclist 9 feet of clearance, you'll be further over for the car than the bike, simply because the right hand side of a car is going to be further over to the right than that of a bike.
The point is that it doesn't say "clearance", it says "room". There is also a picture to show what the interpretation should be.

If the cyclist's wheel is 3 feet from the kerb then, allowing for the width of the bicycle, giving them 9 feet of room means giving them about 5 feet of clearance. When passing a 6 foot wide car whose nearside is 2 feet from the kerb, giving the same amount of room would actually mean giving them just 1 foot of clearance. In both cases, the overtaking vehicle's nearside would be the same 9 feet away from the kerb.
 

Mad at urage

New Member
Back in the olden days when courtesy was expected in order to pass a car test, we were taught that the amount of room to give a cyclist was enough room to fall over.

Because they just might hit that pothole you've not noticed and fall over.

In case the hard of thinking haven't got it yet ... the amount of room taken up by a falling cyclist is one lane width.

I am courteous to courteous drivers but I require a lane's width when being overtaken; as it says in the HC, the same amount of room, on the road, that you'd give a car.

Yes, when I'm driving a car I give cyclists their own lane.
 

Hip Priest

Veteran
The point is that it doesn't say "clearance", it says "room". There is also a picture to show what the interpretation should be.

If the cyclist's wheel is 3 feet from the kerb then, allowing for the width of the bicycle, giving them 9 feet of room means giving them about 5 feet of clearance. When passing a 6 foot wide car whose nearside is 2 feet from the kerb, giving the same amount of room would actually mean giving them just 1 foot of clearance. In both cases, the overtaking vehicle's nearside would be the same 9 feet away from the kerb.

Ah, I see. Why didn't you post that clarification earlier? Would've been more helpful than accusing me of deliberately misinterpreting the HC to make an 'erroneous point'.
 

Little yellow Brompton

A dark destroyer of biscuits!
Location
Bridgend
Are you allowed to ride side-by-side on roads?

Seen a lot of group cycling going on and they seem to ride in pairs. Which is annoying when you're in a car and are trying to overtake half a dozen pairs around blind bends etc (or sit behind them all the whole journey).

It's like overtaking a coach in length, but one with the stability of string, as every now and then one will dodge a pot whole and jut out without looking behind first etc.


Wondering what the correct way to go about this would be as I'll be cycling to work soon and a few people have the same route and I wouldn't mind a natter on the way to work but not if it's against the law (or unsafe).

Thanks for your help. :smile:



Would you prefer them to be riding in single file and now be 2 coach lengths long?
 

steve52

I'm back! Yippeee
lets learn from the netherlands and change our perspective towards cyclist and peds (better inclued electric vehical users to)
 

MrHappyCyclist

Riding the Devil's HIghway
Location
Bolton, England
Ah, I see. Why didn't you post that clarification earlier? Would've been more helpful than accusing me of deliberately misinterpreting the HC to make an 'erroneous point'.
Ah, yes, it would have helped if I had highlighted the word that you were misquoting. I'll try to do that if the occasion arises again.
 

screenman

Legendary Member
Lets us also remember that on windy days like we are having now the cyclist has very limited hearing from cars behind, so although you may see them the chances may well be that they have not heard you and do not know you are there. When approaching a group I will give just a small inoffensive toot on the horn to let them know I am there, I certainly know I appreciate it if a driver does so for me.

By the way I drive 30,000miles pa, motorbike 10,000 and cycle 7,000 so I come from all angles on this one as do most.
 

VamP

Banned
Location
Cambs
trying to overtake half a dozen pairs around blind bends


Oh FFS, which part of ''when it's safe to do so'' is so ****ing hard to understand?


Is the Highway Code no longer a requirement in the process of obtaining a driving licence? Or are you just unable to read? :angry:
 

PK99

Legendary Member
Location
SW19
You are misquoting what the highway code says. Is that to try to give some apparent validity to your erroneous point? HC rule 163 says: "give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car". That means, if you would give a car 9 feet in which to manoeuvre when you pass it, then you should give a cyclist 9 feet in which to manoeuvre when you you pass.


No, it means leave the same space between the car and vehicle it is passing
 
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