Edmund King, President of the AA....

[User482]

Just thinking the same thing.Mile upon miles of coned of motorway with nothing happening is very frustrating.

A lot of people say that, but I don't understand why. The delay on all but the longest journeys is trivial.

 

[srw]

Oh no it isn't. The slightest criticism of people's motoring habits is always greeted with a tide of defensiveness and indignation.

I can't decide whether you're reading a different forum to me or whether I'm blanking out a handful of posters who you're fixing on. What I see is cycling habits - however dreadful - being greeted with defensiveness and indignation and driving habits - however careful or thoughtful - being criticised. Which, in society, I'll give you, is unusual.

Oh well.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

A lot of people say that, but I don't understand why. The delay on all but the longest journeys is trivial.

And who do the longest journeys? I suspect that the road haulage industry is behind this proposed change, through lobbying or perhaps funding ''research'' - all done in the name of safety, of course.

 

[Aravis]

A lot of people say that, but I don't understand why. The delay on all but the longest journeys is trivial.

This I completely agree with. In fact, once I've reached the real roadworks, I quite enjoy the stress-free experience of easing along at 50mph knowing that my fuel consumption is improving, and that the impact on my journey time is negligible.

What is stressful is prolonged crawling and jostling as three lanes funnel themselves into 2 or 1. Made worse by those who insist on carrying on until the last moment in the lane that's about to disappear before forcing their way across. If that process could be improved so that the delay is minimised, then I think (hope may be nearer the mark) there'd be much less complaint about the 50 limit.

 

[growingvegetables]

Where the filtering takes place is immaterial. It is how it takes place that matters. If people were to be able to drive more collaboratively and less competitively, they could merge more easily and all get along better. Self-driving cars should be able to sort the problem.

I LOATHE and DETEST optimism.

 

[growingvegetables]

 

[swansonj]

This I completely agree with. In fact, once I've reached the real roadworks, I quite enjoy the stress-free experience of easing along at 50mph knowing that my fuel consumption is improving, and that the impact on my journey time is negligible.

What is stressful is prolonged crawling and jostling as three lanes funnel themselves into 2 or 1. Made worse by those who insist on carrying on until the last moment in the lane that's about to disappear before forcing their way across. If that process could be improved so that the delay is minimised, then I think (hope may be nearer the mark) there'd be much less complaint about the 50 limit.

[QUOTE 5008105, member: 45"]The delay would be minimised if everyone did the correct thing and filtered towards the front. Instead of those who joined the lane too early then getting annoyed at the driver, doing the right thing, who they think got one up on them.[/QUOTE]
We did this a few years ago on here and someone dug out some American research.

If the traffic is flowing at a reasonable speed the optimum strategy is to get into the new lane early, while you still have space to do so without having to slow. If the traffic is dense enough for crawling to be inevitable, the optimum strategy is to leave it to near the end so as to maximise use of road space. That US paper had specific data on speeds and volumes for the switch point.

The UK is crap at telling you what to do. We put the diagonal sideways arrow on about three successive motorway gantries before the red cross and no one knows whether to treat the diagonal arrow as an instruction or a warning.

Of course, @User13710 's point is absolutely valid, that if we treated motoring as a collaborative activity it would matter much less. But that problem is not confined to motoring....

 

[swansonj]

[QUOTE 5008224, member: 45"]I agree. We were talking about the latter (bold).[/QUOTE]
Fair enough. But whilst there are times when stop-start is inevitable, there are also times when people leaving merging to the final stretch of road forces what could otherwise be free-flowing unnecessarily into stop-start.

 

[srw]

Made worse by those who insist on carrying on until the last moment in the lane that's about to disappear before forcing their way across. If that process could be improved so that the delay is minimised

If the traffic is flowing at a reasonable speed the optimum strategy is to get into the new lane early, while you still have space to do so without having to slow. If the traffic is dense enough for crawling to be inevitable, the optimum strategy is to leave it to near the end so as to maximise use of road space. That US paper had specific data on speeds and volumes for the switch point.

If memory serves, that was the optimum strategy for the population as a whole - rather than for the individual switcher or crawler. So those who "insist on carrying on until the last moment" are in fact improving things for everyone.

 

[boydj]

Funny how average speed cameras have the capacity to raise compliance levels to close to 100% and at the same time reduce incidents and ksi's, without raising the risk to roadside workers.

 

[smutchin]

As it happens, I suspect that if you ask drivers on a motorway to slow down suddenly from 70mph* to 30mph rather than to 50mph, the results would be chaotic. You would get lots of rear-end shunts.

There are works on the M2 at the moment, around junction 5. The works are signed 2 miles in advance. The reduction in speed limit is staggered - reduced to 50, then further along reduced to 40. Suggesting that people are being asked to "suddenly" slow down is disingenuous.

I appreciate the sentiment of it but it actually makes things worse for everyone behind. Personally I just change lanes.

Not always possible. At the above mentioned works, drivers staying on the M2 have to stay in the right hand lane - the left lane filters off into the junction, the road reducing to a single lane, then at the other side of the junction, the sliproad forms a new left-hand lane. So the other day, I'm coming past the junction, observing the 40 limit (got my speed limiter set). As I come past the junction, traffic joining from the junction means I can't move over to the left. Twat comes up from behind at ridiculous speed and has to brake hard to avoid shunting me, sits centimetres from my bumper and starts flashing his lights at me. I'm going nowhere simply because there is nowhere to go. I have the self-confidence to refuse to be intimidated but I can understand that others wouldn't.

Raising the speed limit is not the answer to that problem.

I don't care if some arrogant twat thinks he's in a hurry, driving fast is not a right. You're impatient? Not my problem. And I refuse to let you make it my problem. If it's a real emergency, stick your feckin' blue flashers on.

Also, hasn't it been comprehensively proven that raising the speed limit does not reduce congestion? Isn't it generally people driving too close to the car in front that causes congestion on motorways?

 

[Nigel-YZ1]

So the answer to HGV tailgating and flashing lights to shunt everyone out of lane 2 is to put the limit up so the poor truckers don't have to be forced to take such action.

Put some speed cameras in road works. Sorted.

They don't do it because they think it inefficient to go slower. They do it because they get away with it.

 

[Drago]

Brown shoes with a blue suit. That's the level of idiocy this guy stoops to.

The problem with speed cameras is that the working prosecution limit is 10%+2, which is 57MPH. The trucks are restricted to 56 and they know that if they keep their feet on the boards they will avoid prosecution. Instead of raising the speed limit they could more vigourously enforce the existing ones, use a prosecution limit of 2MPH over the limit, that would make them pay attention.

 

[srw]

Put some speed cameras in road works. Sorted.

You don't drive on motorways much, do you?

Speed cameras - the average speed ones you can't easily evade - are bog-standard along roadworks these days.

 

[srw]

There are works on the M2 at the moment, around junction 5. The works are signed 2 miles in advance. The reduction in speed limit is staggered - reduced to 50, then further along reduced to 40. Suggesting that people are being asked to "suddenly" slow down is disingenuous.

If we're swapping anecdotes, there were roadworks and a lane closure on the M40 yesterday aroung the Beaconsfield junction. Advisory speed limit only - 50mph - and the traffic slowed down to 50mph.