'Fast' Tyres

[Yellow Saddle]

There possibly isn't a better or alternative source for those results - but the results are all 'theoretical, lab condition tests' anyway. His choice of using a roller covered in chequer plate 'in order to reflect real world road conditions' is a bit bizarre. And sticking a weighted 1mm needle into a tyre at 90deg to the road surface is not really an ideal measure of puncture resistance, because it doesn't really reflect real world conditions. The point I'm making is that it is probably best to ignore stuff like that. The guy clearly gets off on testing tyres, but I don't think it means very much in reality.

C'mon. Give the guy some credit. His experiments are good - very good. What does it matter if they are theoretical lab tests? The way he's done it may not come up with the exact RR, but the consistency of the experiment sees to it that the results are in proper order from good to bad. Who cares if he's a watt or two off? It is not the actual number that counts but the proportions. His results are good enough to show you what the best tyre is for a TT and the best for PP.

Further, the treadplate drum is a better approximation of asphalt road than you give credit to. Again, the drum itself doesn't matter, it can be smooth or rough, but the results will be in the same proportions because RR is an overlay over whatever the road throws at you. Besides, what does a standardised road look like?

As for the anecdotes. I think he's done well. There's no nonsense in there. He gives us a little bit of history on the tyre, describes its construction and makes no subjective findings that cannot be corroborated with his data.

He's answered a lot of questions in that piece of work of his. Lots of people would love to know how much better tubeless is over tubed etc etc.

I agree there's no real world test for punctures but that is as good as any. It is a baseline.

All-in-all, I think the experimenter has done great work and documented it fantastically and opened the results to all and sundry. Some of the peer-review stuff in the accompanying forum is good and keeps him on his toes.

We need more amateurs to take initiatives like this and fight the marketing BS that plagues our game. Have a beer. I'm sure you can change your mind.

 

[NorthernDave]

cant say ive noticed the lack of grip/traction, but then again I havent taken my carbon out in the rain. Ive been in some light drizzle and damp conditions but never full on rain. Though, I weigh a tonne so i probably have enough weight on the back to avoid sticky situations.

There are a couple of sharp hills under trees (so the road surface gets virtually no sun at this time of year) on my regular routes and I've managed to spin the back wheel climbing them in the damp with the Rubino Pro's on, which is unsettling to say the least. I'm comfortably upholstered too, so that's unlikely to be the problem and I doubt my power output will be excessive...
Never had a problem with the Zaffiros that were originally on my alu bike, or with the Gators that are on both bikes now.

 

[mjr]

Argh! Zaffiros! Might as well cover your inner tubes in hedgehog skins, spikes facing inwards. Rubinos were far better but pick up a lot of winter junk but it's a shame if they've changed it and reduced the grip.

My road bike is currently on Schwalbe Active Line tyres but it's oooold... sorry, I mean vintage

 

[NorthernDave]

Argh! Zaffiros! Might as well cover your inner tubes in hedgehog skins, spikes facing inwards. Rubinos were far better but pick up a lot of winter junk but it's a shame if they've changed it and reduced the grip.

My road bike is currently on Schwalbe Active Line tyres but it's oooold... sorry, I mean vintage

I never had a minutes problem with the Zaffiros, although they did start to cut up quite a bit which is why I replaced them. Perhaps if have suffered if I'd carried on with them.

 

[mjr]

I never had a minutes problem with the Zaffiros, although they did start to cut up quite a bit which is why I replaced them. Perhaps if have suffered if I'd carried on with them.

They didn't last long enough to cut up much apart from the holes. It may be local conditions and our lovely hooked flints. Gatorskins are also notoriously bad for the back roads around here.

People both rave and rant about the Durano Plus. Having felt the difference between Marathon and Marathon Plus, I'm not in a rush to try them.

 

[dim]

I'm a Durano Plus fan for winter .... currently, I have Continental Grand Prix 4 seasons fitted on my S-Works and which came with the bike .... I've done losts of miles on some bad roads and so far so good .... no punctures and they roll ok

I cycle lots of miles and my next tyres on the S-works will be durano Plus for the coldest months ....

In early spring, I will get the 4 seasons again and for summer, I will run GP 4000SII ...

so in a nutshell: Conti 4 seasons for autumn and spring, Durano plus for winter, and GP4000Sii for summer

 

[russ.will]

For the new bike I've ordered, I will 'need' some new, decent, tyres.

I'm not sure whether to go for the ever popular 4000SII, or something slightly more extravagant (with tan sidewalls perhaps). The bike will be a 'dry' bike, and used as best, so they don't need to put up with commuting in all conditions. I'm very tempted by some Victoria's, but am worried they'll be cut to shreds by the time I reach the first cafe...

What do you have on your 'best' bike?

Mmm. Now I've got through a few tyres this year. I had GP4000 on my ali bike before I replaced them with Duranos for winter and never had much problem with either. Duranos were possibly a touch more harsh on ride comfort, but nothing I'd complain about and punctures were mercifully few in either.

Then the KTM turned up with (tubeless ready) Schwalbe One Pro 1, but with inner tubes in place. Removing the tubes and adding goo was a revelation in terms of ride comfort but little else. Then I picked up a puncture (a good flint slice) that wasn't going to be plugged by any sort of goo, so I decided that they were to be replaced. I bought One Pro 1 again, but this time in 28mm.

Now these rocked. They made me feel like a road bike fraud, so smooth and floaty did they ride and mid corner grip was immense. My Strava times were still getting better, so I clearly wasn't suffering from a wider tyre, beyond digs from my mates who think they looked 'gravel' ready. And then they got a puncture that even at 10psi less than the 25mm wouldn't repair. Argh! Tubeless was supposed to be the grail!

Now I can't remember why I did this, but I saw some 25mm Challenge Strada Open Clinchers in tan-wall and thought, why not? Not quite true. They looked like sex and I wanted them. Well, I'm happy I did. The ride and grip is so close to the tubeless Schwalbe as to be near as dammit. I've had only one puncture (despite running lightweight tubes) and that was when I used a cycle path that I don't normally use, because it's renowned for punctures...

But and this may be a biggy; you can get them on and off without tyre levers. They're weird, because their construction means they're not rounded in profile. They are completely flat, like a ribbon. Until you have a few psi in the tube, they actually don't want to stay on the rim. In practice this means you need the lightest of finger pressure to get them on/off the rim and so the one puncture I had was laughably quick to change with zero chance of pinching the tube with levers, because you don't use them.

Okay, a bit of a left field proposition and the tan-walls do dirty up quick in the winter, but they grip well at all temperatures, punctures are easy to sort (and as I always carried a tube when tubeless, nothing has changed) the ride is creamy and did I say they look like pure sex? If they made them in 28mm, it would be game over, from where I'm sitting, but they actually come up big for a 25mm anyway.

Not cheap, but definitely worth a look and as someone riding them through winter, you'll have no issues for dry use only.

Russ

 

[Drago]

C'mon. Give the guy some credit. His experiments are good - very good. What does it matter if they are theoretical lab tests?

Because most of us don't cycle to work along a road surfaced in chequer plate, so it is unrealistic. Indeed, it's not even much use for test the tyres rolling resistance relative to one another, because he has not established that each tyre behaves in the same way on chequer plate as it would on asphalt. It's akin to testing a cars performance by going for a spin on a PS4.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

Because most of us don't cycle to work along a road surfaced in chequer plate, so it is unrealistic. Indeed, it's not even much use for test the tyres rolling resistance relative to one another, because he has not established that each tyre behaves in the same way on chequer plate as it would on asphalt. It's akin to testing a cars performance by going for a spin on a PS4.

Before you call foul on my statement you will have to demonstrate how a treadplate changes rolling resistance over asphalt. Your analogy in the last sentence is just plain silly.

 

[gbb]

Unless there's a clamour of puncture reports for any particular tyre, and they're universally accepted as rubbish, I disregard isolated reports of poor puncture protection.
I generally run Gators, have done for years. I've run 2 years straight with no punctures at all then had one nearly new tyre gashed and another small run of regular punctures. That's not the tyres, that's just good luck bad luck. The same can probably be said for most tyres.
I've moved up to GP4000 ii this year just for a change and they're generally accepted as a better tyre. Can I feel the difference....no. Do they seem faster....not in any appreciable way.

TBF, I am at a low ebb in my cycling life so perhaps had I tried when I was fit I might have seen the difference..perhaps they are good and without them I'd be even slower .

I'm kinda reluctant to praise them because the delivery time was slow but I got a fantastic bargain with the GP4000 ii from Radial Cycles, once I'd applied an online discount number, I think I got them cheaper that I could get Gators.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

Unless there's a clamour of puncture reports for any particular tyre, and they're universally accepted as rubbish, I disregard isolated reports of poor puncture protection.

I am afraid you are bashing your head against a brick wall. It is now universally accepted that puncture protection prediction (PPP) is a science practiced by occasional riders who cite random events in support of their findings. These findings are always underpinned by careful reports of what type of bike they ride, how many bikes they have and of course, the piece de resistance - what the previous tyres were before the panacea was discovered.

Apparently the Royal Society is considering a special branch for the discipline of PPP.

 

[Sbudge]

The older Michelin Endurance Pro4 have been my favourite winter tyre and pretty good value when you can find them still. I just could not get Gators onto one of my sets of wheels (you name it, I tried it) so switched to the Michelins out of desperation and haven't looked back. As for tubeless, I've gone that way for the balloons/tyres on my Slate (42mm!) and they've been brilliant...ok I did get covered in sealant by one particularly energetic puncture 'fountain' but a quick pump and I was back on the road.

 

[SWSteve]

The older Michelin Endurance Pro4 have been my favourite winter tyre and pretty good value when you can find them still. I just could not get Gators onto one of my sets of wheels (you name it, I tried it) so switched to the Michelins out of desperation and haven't looked back. As for tubeless, I've gone that way for the balloons/tyres on my Slate (42mm!) and they've been brilliant...ok I did get covered in sealant by one particularly energetic puncture 'fountain' but a quick pump and I was back on the road.

If finally found the problems with Gatorskins, I have them on my TCX, went to put a tyre given to me by local lbs to use on a turbo, and couldn't get the damn gator skin off!

I'm madly in love with the idea of a pair of Vittoria tan-walled tyres, but feel 4000sII win out on price.

 

[andrew_s]

Here's a review of different tyre pressures on different surfaces for the same tyre (GP 4000 SII 25mm):
https://silca.cc/blogs/journal/part-4b-rolling-resistance-and-impedance

What I find interesting is that even on new, smooth, tarmac, the effect of a pressure 10 psi higher than optimum is as much as running a dynohub with the lights on.

 

[HLaB]

I run Rubino Pro's on my carbon bike, Had them on since April or May and they have done me well especially since I have used the bike to commute around london.

I have Durano Plus tyres on my main commuter and since that its coming to its second year running them, they have small holes cuts all over them that go into the protection layer. Im sure they've saved me from a few roadside repairs but Im going to replace them with a pair of Michelin Pro4 ENDURANCE V2's soon which have had great feedback so far.

The only thing I could say negative about the Pro 4 Endurance is they are a little harder to change at the side off the road on that odd occasion. But that the same for other more p'ture protection brands and that wouldn't put me off using them, I'm currently using them on my commuting road bike and used their predecessor (Kyrlion Carbons which were rebranded Pro4 Endu the V1's) on my summer (all year round) bike and think they are great tyres :-) FWIW I've swapped the summer (all year round) road bike to conti 4000s firstly and now pro 4 SC and cant say either of these tyres are much faster