First electric car experience

[Archie_tect]

Our plug-in hybrid has a capacity of 13.4 kW so costs £4.02 to charge up at 30p/kW. That will take us 34m if I'm careful. which is 11.8p/mile.

At home on our current domestic supply [not Economy 7] it's just over 6p/mile.

A gallon of petrol on the motorway gets us roughly 55miles and costs £6.04 [£1.34/litre at Tescos up here] which is 10.9p/mile.

Ironically our old diesel Seat estate did 72mpg so worked out at 8.5p/mile.

Full EV cars with sufficient range for longer journeys, charged overnight at home on 6p/kW Economy 7, work out at 2.3p/mile - which means an EV car, costing £13,000 more to buy, than our plug-in hybrid doing 10000 miles a year, breaks even after,15 years. Hopefully the technology will have moved on in the next five to make EVs far more economic.

This is not a compelling argument to spend the extra until second hand EVs come onto the market with [say] better than 250mile range between Economy 7 charges. Factor in commercial charging rates and they will never be economic to run. This does nit take into consideration battery life/ servicing an ICE car etc.

... that's why Shell and BP have invested so heavily in the EV charging infrastructure because they know they have a captive market once the oil runs out. More fool the National Grid and electric suppliers for allowing the oil companies to run the show.

 

[mikeIow]

Our Octopus Go Faster tariff gives us 5p/kWh for 4 hours, so 28kWh for £1.40. We get around 4 miles/kWh from the Kona, so that is over 100miles. 1.4p/mile 😇
Maybe we can break even within the 8yr battery warranty period 🤪

Things will change….energy costs are only going one way, unless you have your own private solar farm 😳 (just roof panels don’t really count - we have them, & on a great day we might get around 20kWh generated, but those are not the UK “normal”…..plus we have other things using that energy too)

So far, it also feels that EV costs are only going up….I feel like we still await a lower cost (£ and environmental - batteries are not perfect)

In the meantime, each human can only do what is right and affordable for them 👍

 

[gzoom]

Things will change….energy costs are only going one way

Even with price increase its still pretty cheap, our E7 night rate has gone from 7p per kWh to 12p per kWh over the last 18 months or so. But even with our relative inefficient EV at 12p per kWh its costing us 4p per mile in fuel. At current fuel costs of £1.35/L for unleaded and a true 50mpg, our Lexus hybrid costs 12.2p/mile, so still three times as much.

Not forgetting the lack of servicing costs of the EV, and the fact we actually have 'Free for life Supercharging' on ours with some Supercharger costs now going up to 40p/kWh at some sites over the next few years it may actually save up a reasonable amount of £.

As people have also suggested VED on EVs cannot remain £0 forever, it really is a case of getting in early before everyone else does and the costs go up.

 

[CXRAndy]

Dont forget the zero whilst travelling emissions. A big aspect of owning an EV

 

[MrGrumpy]

Well at least someone recognises the cost benefit ratio of EVs. A lot of man maths at work . I think we really ought to stop driving as often ! In any car !

 

[Pale Rider]

Our plug-in hybrid has a capacity of 13.4 kW so costs £4.02 to charge up at 30p/kW. That will take us 34m if I'm careful. which is 11.8p/mile.

At home on our current domestic supply [not Economy 7] it's just over 6p/mile.

A gallon of petrol on the motorway gets us roughly 55miles and costs £6.04 [£1.34/litre at Tescos up here] which is 10.9p/mile.

Ironically our old diesel Seat estate did 72mpg so worked out at 8.5p/mile.

Full EV cars with sufficient range for longer journeys, charged overnight at home on 6p/kW Economy 7, work out at 2.3p/mile - which means an EV car, costing £13,000 more to buy, than our plug-in hybrid doing 10000 miles a year, breaks even after,15 years. Hopefully the technology will have moved on in the next five to make EVs far more economic.

This is not a compelling argument to spend the extra until second hand EVs come onto the market with [say] better than 250mile range between Economy 7 charges. Factor in commercial charging rates and they will never be economic to run. This does nit take into consideration battery life/ servicing an ICE car etc.

... that's why Shell and BP have invested so heavily in the EV charging infrastructure because they know they have a captive market once the oil runs out. More fool the National Grid and electric suppliers for allowing the oil companies to run the show.

Excellent effort by @Archie_tect to work out the various pences per mile a lot of us could expect.

Another upward pressure on EV costs, albeit a relatively minor one, is I think it's unrealistic to expect most owners to cover every mile at their cheapest at home tariff.

Inevitably, if I had an EV I would end up suffering some high cost motorway recharges purely out of convenience, not to say necessity.

Several posts on this thread indicate charging away from home - at any tariff - may not be as easy as EV proponents would have us believe.

Too many tales of full EV bays/broken chargers for my liking.

None of which is insurmountable, but once again it comes down to alternative cost.

Recharging uncertainty and possible aggro against refuelling certainty and no aggro.

I know which I'd choose at present, although that situation may change in the coming years.

 

[nickyboy]

Excellent effort by @Archie_tect to work out the various pences per mile a lot of us could expect.

Another upward pressure on EV costs, albeit a relatively minor one, is I think it's unrealistic to expect most owners to cover every mile at their cheapest at home tariff.

Inevitably, if I had an EV I would end up suffering some high cost motorway recharges purely out of convenience, not to say necessity.

Several posts on this thread indicate charging away from home - at any tariff - may not be as easy as EV proponents would have us believe.

Too many tales of full EV bays/broken chargers for my liking.

None of which is insurmountable, but once again it comes down to alternative cost.

Recharging uncertainty and possible aggro against refuelling certainty and no aggro.

I know which I'd choose at present, although that situation may change in the coming years.

It's interesting that your rationale is entirely based on cost to YOU and aggro to YOU and nothing about potentially reduced emissions which are a benefit for ALL

 

[Bazzer]

The ones I've used are 30p per kWh.
I think the ultra fast ones are double that but do you really need that speed ?

That (30p) was the cost I had noted when I looked at the charging price. Diesel was being sold at £1.58 per litre, with petrol 0.05p per litre cheaper.

 

[Archie_tect]

When EVs are so much more expensive to buy the fact that they are better for the environment has no bearing as people just can't afford them... It;'s like asking everyone to invest in phase change materials to 'store' heat from solar gain during the day to release when it's needed. The idea to preserve energy being lost at source is a no-brainer but the cost is off the scale. [Phase change material technology has been around since the late 70s.]

 

[Archie_tect]

That (30p) was the cost I had noted when I looked at the charging price. Diesel was being sold at £1.58 per litre, with petrol 0.05p per litre cheaper.

No-one buys fuel at motorway services though... so the actual cost is around £1.34 for petrol and £1.39 for diesel at supermarkets... Costco was £1.19/litre for petrol and £1.24/litre for diesel a couple of weeks ago.

 

[MrGrumpy]

It's interesting that your rationale is entirely based on cost to YOU and aggro to YOU and nothing about potentially reduced emissions which are a benefit for ALL

Pollution from vehicles is a mear drop in the ocean , however we all will need to do our bit I suppose. The way I see it our biggest problem is China, being the largest producer of CO2 into the atmosphere. However whether we like it or not they are that intertwined in everything it’s a hard nut to crack !

 

[All uphill]

Pollution from vehicles is a mear drop in the ocean , however we all will need to do our bit I suppose. The way I see it our biggest problem is China, being the largest producer of CO2 into the atmosphere. However whether we like it or not they are that intertwined in everything it’s a hard nut to crack !

Seems to me we exported our polluting to China along with our manufacturing. I frequently buy bike bits that originate there and am aware that by doing so I am contributing to their polluting.

I guess a big part of the solution is to consume less.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

Pollution from vehicles is a mear drop in the ocean

Transport emissions are a significant part of overall greenhouse emissions.

Following from US EPA

 

[Bazzer]

No-one buys fuel at motorway services though... so the actual cost is around £1.34 for petrol and £1.39 for diesel at supermarkets... Costco was £1.19/litre for petrol and £1.24/litre for diesel a couple of weeks ago.

I appreciate the fuel at the motorway services was around 0.20p per litre than I paid both before we left for Devon and actually in Devon. The figures quoted were so that anyone who wished to disect the figures was comparing like with like. After all, some people do use motorway services both for liquid fuel and recharging batteries.
I'll confess to not knowing how much the angry pixies cost at local charging stations because of charging at home. It was simply that I had the opportunity of a long journey to see what costs were, already knowing liquid fuel was more expensive.

 

[Pale Rider]

It's interesting that your rationale is entirely based on cost to YOU and aggro to YOU and nothing about potentially reduced emissions which are a benefit for ALL

Not really, I post honestly what I think, not what might garner a few likes on a cycling forum.

In any case, the overall environmental impact of EVs remains a matter for debate.

Leaving aside propulsion systems, I have long thought it would be a lot greener if we all bought fewer brand new cars.

In other words, trading in something perfectly serviceable at two or three years old to buy a new vehicle, with all its attendant manufacturing costs to the environment.