First electric car experience

[gzoom]

Dropping £25K on a second hand electric car makes no sense to me when I can get a better diesel one for a lot less.

Am not sure how anyone can think a diesel car can come close to any EV. I traded in a 400bhp twinturbo inline 6 for a Nissan Leaf and haven't looked back since.

EVs are far superior to any combustion engined car.

 

[midlife]

We bought our daughter a diesel Smart Fortwo with £22k to spare from the £25k budget you mention.....

 

[MrGrumpy]

Am not sure how anyone can think a diesel car can come close to any EV. I traded in a 400bhp twinturbo inline 6 for a Nissan Leaf and haven't looked back since.

EVs are far superior to any combustion engined car.

Not for towing my twin axle and don’t mention Model X as that’s the only one ! However……. I may get around that with hybrid, although I’m also hearing batteries overheat when towing on these.

 

[Peugeotrider]

I am in the motor trade and tbh...I think in ten years diesel/petrol will still be king.
I know the sales guys from my local Citroen garage were in with me last week and they tested the new Citroen ev. Makers claim way over 200 on a charge....best the sales guys could manage was 120 which is dire and they said it handles awful.
I see it as a future flop....like water base car paint was in the 00s.
Local council forced my trade to use it and it's nothing but problematic. Slow to apply and has no lasting quality.
Since we have left the EU...we have been able to go back on solvent paint legally but we have been on compliant solvent now for years with no issues.
I don't think battery technology is just there yet for the ev

 

[MrGrumpy]

I am in the motor trade and tbh...I think in ten years diesel/petrol will still be king.
I know the sales guys from my local Citroen garage were in with me last week and they tested the new Citroen ev. Makers claim way over 200 on a charge....best the sales guys could manage was 120 which is dire and they said it handles awful.
I see it as a future flop....like water base car paint was in the 00s.
Local council forced my trade to use it and it's nothing but problematic. Slow to apply and has no lasting quality.
Since we have left the EU...we have been able to go back on solvent paint legally but we have been on compliant solvent now for years with no issues.
I don't think battery technology is just there yet for the ev

I fear you maybe right, hydrogen fuel cells ?

 

[Peugeotrider]

I fear you maybe right, hydrogen fuel cells ?

A safer bet I reckon.
I'd lease an ev for a year first as a trial before I'd make my mind up on buying one

 

[Deleted member 1258]

I fear you maybe right, hydrogen fuel cells ?

But is hydrogen as clean as they say it is? Interesting article .

https://eandt.theiet.org/content/ar...ogen-more-carbon-intensive-than-gas-and-coal/

 

[cougie uk]

I am in the motor trade and tbh...I think in ten years diesel/petrol will still be king.
I know the sales guys from my local Citroen garage were in with me last week and they tested the new Citroen ev. Makers claim way over 200 on a charge....best the sales guys could manage was 120 which is dire and they said it handles awful.
I see it as a future flop....like water base car paint was in the 00s.
Local council forced my trade to use it and it's nothing but problematic. Slow to apply and has no lasting quality.
Since we have left the EU...we have been able to go back on solvent paint legally but we have been on compliant solvent now for years with no issues.
I don't think battery technology is just there yet for the ev

Have you actually driven an EV yourself ?

 

[gzoom]

I am in the motor trade and tbh...I think in ten years diesel/petrol will still be king.

You do know new EV sales are already higher than diesel sales for the last 2 months running and its looking like to stay that way.

Am actually quite surprised on a pedal bike forum there is so much love for diesel?

 

[cougie uk]

I fear you maybe right, hydrogen fuel cells ?

I find this very unlikely to take off.
I charge on my drive.
Why would I go out of my way to pump hydrogen ?

 

[MrGrumpy]

You do know new EV sales are already higher than diesel sales for the last 2 months running and its looking like to stay that way.

Am actually quite surprised on a pedal bike forum there is so much love for diesel?

Not just diesel , petrol as well. EV works for some, but not for all. They are here to stay for a long time. Granted the non compliant non euro 6 engines are going to be a problem driving into cities and towns. I own one so that’s something I’m trying to address soonish.

 

[MrGrumpy]

I find this very unlikely to take off.
I charge on my drive.
Why would I go out of my way to pump hydrogen ?

I’ve no idea either but you can’t keep mining battery raw materials either , it’s not exactly enviro friendly !! What’s worse ?!

 

[cougie uk]

You do know new EV sales are already higher than diesel sales for the last 2 months running and its looking like to stay that way.

Am actually quite surprised on a pedal bike forum there is so much love for diesel?

People don't like change. There's still people on here afraid of carbon fibre.

Prices will come down for EVs.
Range will probably increase a bit.
People need to change their mentality from always comparing battery range to a full tank of petrol. (that 99.9% of people would never use without a stop anyway).

 

[icowden]

Dropping £25K on a second hand electric car makes no sense to me when I can get a better diesel one for a lot less.
Further, given that I'm not especially wealthy, spending that amount could be seen as financially irresponsible.
The carrot just isn't going to work, hence the stick due in 2030.
Which is fine, but let's not kid ourselves as to what's going on here.

Define "better".
I agree with you about cost, but you have to concede that the Government hasn't bothered with the Carrot.

For example in California:

the price of a Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus is now $38,490 — at the time this article was originally written. After the $1,500 California Clean Fuel Reward deduction, the price is then reduced down to $36,999.

California residents can also apply for a $5,000 grant offered by the Clean Vehicle Assistance Program (CVAP). This program has eligibility criteria based on individual or family income.

The California Clean Vehicle Assistance Program also offers a $2,000 grant for the installation of charging infrastructure at your home. So this bumps up the total grant to $7,000 for eligible applicants.

Bay Area residents also have another option called the Clean Cars For All program. If this grant is stacked on top of the $7,000 grant noted above, the maximum of a $9,500 rebate can be available to a prospective (and qualified) Tesla buyer in California.

By the way, there’s more! It turns out that there’s another grant named the California Clean Vehicle Rebate Project (CVRP), and luckily, Tesla Model Y and Model 3 both are on the eligible vehicle list. This adds another $2,000 rebate if you apply online. Once approved, you’ll get a check for $2,000 sent to your mailbox — simple and straightforward.

The CVRP grant also offers an additional $2,500 rebate for low and moderate-income households in the San Joaquin Valley and San Diego County. To be specific, the California CVRP website notes, “The option to get pre-approved through Rebate Now is currently available for increased rebates to low and moderate-income residents in San Diego County and the counties that make up the San Joaquin Valley who have not yet purchased or leased their vehicle.”

So that's a $25,000 car instead of a $38,490 car (as long as you qualify).
In Norway they have incentivised EV purchases so that they are cheaper than ICE purchases.#

in the UK, the deluded morons who run the country have made it more expensive. Because? God knows.

the discount for Category 1 cars has shrunk from £4,500 to £2,500.
Today, the grant covers up to 35 per cent of the car’s purchase price, up to a maximum of £2,500, if the car has a list price below £35,000

I agree that even £25k is too expensive for a lot of people, but the prices will start to come down. The biggest obstacle is to convert those with an ICE mindset, that they need to change their thinking.

It's a bit like going back 100 years or so and saying "well, it'll never catch on. There's nowhere to get that oil stuff. I can feed a horse anywhere, and hitch it to the pub rail. ".

In the same way, motor manufacturers need to stop converting ICE cars to electric and actually design electric cars. That's what makes Tesla better than other EVs.

Of course, it could be a short lived dead end - if Tesla get level 5 self driving I think we will start to see autonomous fleets and more people deciding they no longer really need to own a car.

 

[Pale Rider]

Am actually quite surprised on a pedal bike forum there is so much love for diesel?

The love is for personable mobility, which most of us are welded to for work and leisure.

It's merely a matter of achieving that in the most cost effective manner.

Define "better".

Range, general ease of use, like for like accommodation because the fuel tank is smaller/easier to design in than a couple of pallets of batteries, slightly less savage depreciation because the diesel won't be seen as worthless after six or eight years unlike the electric which will need thousands spent on it to make it anything other than a giant door stop, and easier to fix if it breaks because only a tiny number of garages know anything about electric cars.

But I've obviously got the wrong end of the stick somewhere because:

EVs are far superior to any combustion engined car.