First electric car experience

[vickster]

Have you heard of Bicycles ?

Not everyone is physically able to cycle (even on an e-bike/trike) especially not long distances with luggage

 

[Pale Rider]

Not everyone is physically able to cycle (even on an e-bike/trike) especially not long distances with luggage

Which presumably he knows, thereby qualifying the post for dumbest of the day.

But there's still plenty of time for it to be beaten.

 

[gzoom]

It's merely about the best and most cost effective way to achieve that.

....Those of us who buy used will still have the option of petrol/diesel or electric.

What you should be doing is encouraging everybody who can buy a new car to get an EV, that is the only way used prices will fall!!

The actual ownership and running costs of an EV is pennies compared to combustion cars. My 'luxury' SUV, costs £0 in VED, I have serviced it ONCE in 4 years and 40k+ miles, and despite been able to do 0-60mph in under 5 seconds the 160 mile we did to see family last night cost us under £5 in fuel.

The low running costs and ease of ownership is why used prices of EVs are holding firm, ours has depreciated less than 30% in 4 years and its going to be long long time before it reaches the same price of current used combustion cars. But that isn't anyone's 'fault' its simply supply and demand.

 

[mikeIow]

What you should be doing is encouraging everybody who can buy a new car to get an EV, that is the only way used prices will fall!!

The actual ownership and running costs of an EV is pennies compared to combustion cars. My 'luxury' SUV, costs £0 in VED, I have serviced it ONCE in 4 years and 40k+ miles, and despite been able to do 0-60mph in under 5 seconds the 160 mile we did to see family last night cost us under £5 in fuel.

The low running costs and ease of ownership is why used prices of EVs are holding firm, ours has depreciated less than 30% in 4 years and its going to be long long time before it reaches the same price of current used combustion cars. But that isn't anyone's 'fault' its simply supply and demand.

View attachment 605262

Why the quotes around ‘luxury’?
It’s fine to point out the fabulous low running costs, but when those are being applied to a car costing north of £80K, those savings are very much for the few, not the many!
I’ve had a fair number of new cars in my time, but never one costing over 50k, never mind 80 😜

Don’t get me wrong: I’m a massive fan of EVs - we got a Kona EV 26K miles ago: love it to bits 👍
Sure, the running costs are low, but right now those savings are still costing upwards of 6-10k more than an ‘equivalent’ ICE.
You may not be aware that everyone but Tesla still suck service costs from punters every year. The newer Kona has a 4th year service change of some fluid that means the service costs over £400 😳

Maybe everyone should buy a Tesla!
Curious how their brand came 3rd in the Auto Express awards this year, and yet over 40% of customers had problems with them. FORTY! Most other brands were below 20%. There remains an element of ”fanboism“ with the brand: they must put something in the a/c….or maybe nobody wants to admit such a massive purchase was slightly flawed 🤣

What is needed to encourage more take-up is government encouragement.
Norway subsidise EVs by removing their taxes paid, which makes them the same cost as an ICE.
Result: more EVs than ICE now being sold there.

Of course more infrastructure - chargepoints - is needed…but that will get there.
Opening up Tesla charging, as promised by Lord Elon later this year, will help….although might hack off Tesla owners a bit, I suspect….

 

[gzoom]

Why the quotes around ‘luxury’?
It’s fine to point out the fabulous low running costs, but when those are being applied to a car costing north of £80K, those savings are very much for the few, not the many!
I’ve had a fair number of new cars in my time, but never one costing over 50k, never mind 80 😜

But the savings are the same for a used £5K Leaf or a new £20K MG. When I had my Leaf I think I worked out it was cheaper to use a transport than getting x3 different bus passes needed to cover the city....Yes EVs are CHEAPER to OWN+run than getting a bus pass!!!

There are also plenty of combustion cars costing well north of £80K, if I wasn't in a Tesla I would almost certainly be in a BMW M5 o XJR SuperSport, virtually the same purchase price but doing sub 20mpg. Hence why EVs just don't deprecate that much compared to combustion cars .

 

[mikeIow]

But the savings are the same for a used £5K Leaf or a new £20K MG. When I had my Leaf I think I worked out it was cheaper to use a transport than getting x3 different bus passes needed to cover the city....Yes EVs are CHEAPER to OWN+run than getting a bus pass!!!

There are also plenty of combustion cars costing well north of £80K, if I wasn't in a Tesla I would almost certainly be in a BMW M5 o XJR SuperSport, virtually the same purchase price but doing sub 20mpg. Hence why EVs just don't deprecate that much compared to combustion cars .

I guess you missed my point about service costs…..Tesla are an exception with your 1 service in 4 years + 40k miles.

EVs are certainly cheaper to RUN than ICE cars, but I disagree that they are cheaper to OWN at this point in time, comparing like for like.

& infrastructure in the UK is still not yet there for the vast majority. Great for those like us: detached house, fuel pump on driveway, second car for long distance, load carrying, runs to the tip….but not for everyone yet, sadly. My early years were in terraced houses: yes, I know street lights could house chargepoints, but there are a helluva lot of streets to cover!!
The jury remains out on the environmental cost of batteries too: I’m not blind to that, although I hope things improve….

 

[gzoom]

Maybe everyone should buy a Tesla!
Curious how their brand came 3rd in the Auto Express awards this year, and yet over 40% of customers had problems with them. FORTY! Most other brands were below 20%. There remains an element of ”fanboism“ with the brand: they must put something in the a/c….or maybe nobody wants to admit such a massive purchase was slightly flawed 🤣

Actually what Tesla have shown is the importance of software integration customers in the £50k+ price level wants/expects. Tesla is a software company first and car company second, and everything they do reflects that. If you don't get why mobile apps are such big things for companies, or why companies like Amazon and Peloton have completely rewritten the rule book on delivering a totally different customer experience using digital technology than you will never 'get' why Tesla get such loyalty and positive feedback from owners.

I will happily tell everyone I know our Tesla has been the MOST UNRELIABLE car I have ever owned, but at the same time I will tell them its by far THE BEST car I have ever owned and we as a family would swap our ultrareliable Lexus for another Tesla in a heartbeat (finances been not an issues).

Our Tesla isn't just a car, its somewhere to play when whilst waiting out for the rain to stop.

Trying to fiddle with complex sat navs on tiny screen for navigation is just something no one should need to put up with in a car.

The software updates over the our ownership has turned a car that was as 'dumb' as any other to one that essentially is more aware of whats on the road than me!!

Than ofcourse is the 'promise' of autonomy, if you haven't seen the update on developments its worth watching....Ignore the crazy Elon on drugs talk about 'robots' at the end .

The actual software been developed by Tesla is cutting edge and just advanced as anything DeepMind is implementing. But the difference here is the software stacks been written are been designed to be DEPLOYED in real life, in cars like mine which remember was produced in 2017. Which other car made in 2017 has any hope of getting a single software update, let alone having neural network software so advanced been pushed to it over the air without ever visiting a dearship!!

If you have no interest in software, or NeuralNetwork development than don't buy a Tesla, as I've ready pointed out there are loads of other cheaper (and more expensive) EVs around made by traditional car companies. But if you have any vague interest in seeing the bleeding edge of AI NNs development than you will quickly see why Teslas appeal so much over any other car brand.

It really isn't about physical products these days, the growth is in digital technologies and who can best leverage it, and on that front Tesla is leagues ahead of everyone else. Its not for everyone, but for my self this is why Tesla is doing so well.

I have toyed with the idea of a getting a Taycan, is more expensive than a Tesla and you see plenty around these days....But would a £100k+ Taycan get access to the same level of software development as a £40K Model 3?? Not a chance, so inthat regards why would our next car purchase by any other brand apart from Tesla??

View: https://youtu.be/j0z4FweCy4M?t=5070

 

[mikeIow]

People need an interest in neural network development to buy a Tesla?
Now I’ve heard it all 🤣
I understand very well how Tesla is a computer company first and car company second. I love their vehicles, despite the panel gaps and poor paint. It has taken Elon to shake things up, and the old guard manufacturers are struggling to play catch up. His play on dedicated chargepoints was brilliant.
Hyundai & Kia are perhaps closest on catching up: the Ioniq5 is a brilliant EV.
The OTA updates worry me, especially as I see how shoddy some coding i….but I appreciate is is the future.
I also have a decent understanding of AI/ML/DL, having just left a career in tech!

It gets harder to ignore crazy Elon, mind.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlO2gcs1YvM
, in case you are wondering how it all ends…..slaughterbots. That’ll be a fun time 😜

It does concern me how the likes of Elon, Bezos and even Branson can harbour such monstrously huge wealth to play with space games, whilst a big chunk of humanity struggles. The inequality gap gets broader every second we are typing….

 

[figbat]

On the cost of ownership thing, I am swapping my MINI Cooper S for a MINI Cooper SE - roughly equivalent cars - and I’ll be paying about the same per month on PCP. Take away the VED and servicing costs alone and running it is already cheaper, before we get to the cost of filling with electrons vs petrol.

 

[gzoom]

I also have a decent understanding of AI/ML/DL, having just left a career in tech!

Surely you can appreciate even more how cutting edge Tesla is pushing with their software development and more importantly deployment in the real world.

A Model 3 is £40k, an Ionqi 5 is £40k, which do you think will able to take advantage of AI development now and on going into the future??

If you even have a hint of interest in software development Tesla really is the only brand that make sense. This is why Tesla gets industry leading customers loyalty despite not actually been that good at making the cars themselves.

 

[mikeIow]

Well, in a relentless drive towards the singularity, I guess it would be great for one IT company to become the vehicle manufacturer of the future....but I prefer to hope for competition.
If you doubt the capability and desire of the Korean manufacturers to push and drive forward, then regardless of how good Tesla are today, I call "fanboi alert" !

A huge number of people prefer some buttons for basic functions: diving through screens to turn the temperature up or down (not all voice systems work well 😉), etc, is not what I call the best solution. A hybrid works very well for us with the Kona. The Koreans appear to be better at getting more miles per kWh at the moment too: something else to admire.

By your logic, we should only be shopping with Amazon (what's not to like about their prime delivery capabilities and ways to beat sellers down on price keen pricing capabilities, not to mention creative tax strategies to help avoid helping the greater society keep pricing low & Bezos getting even more billions
Tesla have a number of business challenges, & whist I don't doubt their abilities today on the IT front, others are also deep into software development.
DeepMind at google is very heavy computer science that will help with all sort of future things: Tesla don't (yet) own them...

Watch your falcon doors

Anyway, must go.....a whiff of sport to go and watch live!

 

[gzoom]

The Koreans appear to be better at getting more miles per kWh at the moment too: something else to admire.

Sadly not ture for the Ionqi 5, it has the same efficiency as our X despite been smaller and slower!! It appears the efficiency of the Kona is all down to smaller size and less powerful motor .

Google is already in direct competition with Tesla on autonomy, Waymo is about the only real competition with Tesla. Both are the only companies really pushing the envelope, and its a good thing. But you cannot access Waymo tech unless you are an employee or working on their team, a £40k Model 3 you can buy today on the other hand has access to all the software developments Tesla are pushing.....though Government regulatory bodies are doing their best to stop that!!

Plenty of people do have £40k+ to spend on new cars, what Tesla have done is redefine what connectivity and software integration should be standard. But most car companies really don't have a clue where to start with software development, because after all they are car companies not tech companies.

As for the doors on our X, some people will always be clueless but I love them!! Infact even the software needed to make them work in tight environments would be a massive headache for most car manufacturers!!

 

[cougie uk]

Not everyone is physically able to cycle (even on an e-bike/trike) especially not long distances with luggage

Not everyone is able to drive either.

 

[simongt]

An interesting point ref. charging bays which I hadn't noticed until now. Refilling petrol / diesel, you're invariably in a well lit, sheltered area. Not so charging bays. All the ones I've seen to date, even at service areas are out in the open and either unlit or badly lit.
Scenario; you need to recharge to be able to continue your journey. It's dark and raining heavily. You have to deal with your payment card and then work out how best to get the ELECTRIC plug connected to the ELECTRIC socket on your car without too much rainwater getting into the connectors.
Hmm.

 

[simongt]

I’ve had a fair number of new cars in my time, but never one costing over 50k, never mind 80 😜

With cars, I agree. However, paying lots of money for things which can cost a lot less is relative. There are folk who blanche at the idea of spending more than £200 on any new bike, but there are those on this community who will happily dole out £5k. for one.
My niece is a petrolhead and has just forked out nearly £30k. for a used Jag SUV with which she is now obsessed. ( go figure - ! 🤣 )
Depends on your particular preferences.