Freddie the seal attacked by savage dog

[Eric Olthwaite]

I'm sure there are many cases where a dog behaves badly in a way that its owners could not have predicted. I'm also sure there are many more cases where bad behaviour is expected and tolerated by owners.

We used to be friends with a couple who owned a rescue dog. We personally witnessed it attack their 5 year old son in our own garden and put its jaws around his head, leaving puncture wounds.

As far as I was concerned, that dog should not have left our property alive. Its owners still dote on it. Needless to say, we are no longer friends.

 

[Drago]

You mean "could not be bothered to have predicted".

Dogs are predatory pack animals, selectively bred and descended from wolves. The only dog that does not have the potential to cause iniury or fear of injury is a dead dog.

Every dog owner or person in charge of a dog has a lawful duty to ensure their dog does not cause injury, fear of injury, or damage. In this context "could not have predicted" actually means "criminally negligent".

 

[Beebo]

Having to be tracked down rather than handing herself in doesn't look good for her. So much for integrity eh!

It’s reported that she stayed with the seal until help arrived so she has some integrity. It’s terrible news but animals can be unpredictable.

How many people have cats that kill thousands of small birds a year. Where’s the national uproar?

 

[Nigeyy]

Absolutely. Let's not forget animals are.... well, animals. Sometimes they behave erratically. Even humans can.

I'm sure there are many cases where a dog behaves badly in a way that its owners could not have predicted. I'm also sure there are many more cases where bad behaviour is expected and tolerated by owners.

We used to be friends with a couple who owned a rescue dog. We personally witnessed it attack their 5 year old son in our own garden and put its jaws around his head, leaving puncture wounds.

As far as I was concerned, that dog should not have left our property alive. Its owners still dote on it. Needless to say, we are no longer friends.

 

[Nigeyy]

In fairness the OP was asking about dogs not being leashed and out of control. And quickly reading through the comments I didn't see any mention of cats taking down sheep or maiming small kids or killing seals (though granted if we introduced lions, tigers, cheetahs, that could change). I think that's probably a big reason why.

It’s reported that she stayed with the seal until help arrived so she has some integrity. It’s terrible news but animals can be unpredictable.

How many people have cats that kill thousands of small birds a year. Where’s the national uproar?

 

[Accy cyclist]

It’s reported that she stayed with the seal until help arrived so she has some integrity. It’s terrible news but animals can be unpredictable.

How many people have cats that kill thousands of small birds a year. Where’s the national uproar?

She probably stayed with the badly injured seal knowing that others were watching for her doing a runner. As for small birds being killed by cats,yes it's sad,but that as they say,that's nature. The women who let her dog savage the seal most likely knew the seal was there,as according to reports the seal had been there for days and was attracting much attention. Her dog attacking the seal wasn't a natural act,more a case of total irresponsibility on behalf of the dog's owner.

 

[Arrowfoot]

To all those calling for muzzles, compulsory leads, licencing and lord knows what else might car to reflect on the comparison to the gammon faced Daily Heil readers who call for all sortsnof compulsory training, licensing, insurance that cyclists should have each time one of our number jump a red light

I have never even owned a dog, but any clamp down will be at the expense of law abiding sensible owners of perfectly OK dogs, as the owners of nasty uncontrolled dogs will continue to not give a fark. Happy dogs running free in the park are overall "a good thing" and even when no especially obedient are rarely more than a mild nuisance.

All that said, can anyone explain why dog owners are supposed to hang bags of dog pooh in trees?

The 2 mantras that I hear so often

1. Guns don't kill, people kill ( US centric)
2. There are no bad dogs, just bad owners

Note the similarity in supposed logic. Note the how close the brain freeze applies in both of them. Note both do not address any issues other the person thinking that it is witty and smart.

The issue is how can we stop a baby seal being mauled or how do you stop deers being chased at Richmond and to avoid a stampede that might take lives. How can kids and adults walk in peace.

Don't focus on the dog alone. You need to address both the dog and the owner. You can't separate the 2.

We need a balanced and reasonable outcome. Short leash on all public places except at designated locations is one option that is least costly. There might be other ways. The second is to impose a fine which is % of one income when one can't control their dog on a leash or off leash.

Costly licensing, mandatory training of owners and dogs are also not reasonable options. Dog ownership is such a pleasure especially for a young kid and for those who live alone. Don't make it hard for them in getting a pet. We should encourage it and not discourage it.

Sitting on your hands and talking about how well my dog is trained is not contributing to the discussion.

 

[Accy cyclist]

Oh,it's ok! She's Oxford educated and lives in a 5.7 million pound house,so she's off the hook!

'Rebecca Sabben-Clare QC, 49, lives in a £5.8million house with her husband William, 57, not far away from Hammersmith Bridge, where Sunday's incident took place.

On Tuesday, her lawyers said she made contact with police after the attack and was referred to the RSPCA, and was told no offence had occurred'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...Freddie-seal-Oxford-educated-QC.html#comments
How many could/would make contact with 'their lawyers' before any charges had been brought? Money talks! Probably a back hander to the 'police benevolent fund' and the RSPCA sorted it.

 

[Bazzer]

She probably stayed with the badly injured seal knowing that others were watching for her doing a runner. As for small birds being killed by cats,yes it's sad,but that as they say,that's nature. The women who let her dog savage the seal most likely knew the seal was there,as according to reports the seal had been there for days and was attracting much attention. Her dog attacking the seal wasn't a natural act,more a case of total irresponsibility on behalf of the dog's owner.

You are saying there is a distinction to be drawn between letting an owner letting a dog loose from its lead, which may kill other animals and a cat being let out by its keeper and which will almost certainly kill other animals?
BTW I don't think dogs should be off a lead, except in very specific circumstances. And I don't consider the ridiculous expanding leads as sufficient for controlling dogs.

 

[stephec]

I've just seen a BBC report saying that Freddie has had to be put down.

 

[Drago]

Oh,it's ok! She's Oxford educated and lives in a 5.7 million pound house,so she's off the hook!

'Rebecca Sabben-Clare QC, 49, lives in a £5.8million house with her husband William, 57, not far away from Hammersmith Bridge, where Sunday's incident took place.

On Tuesday, her lawyers said she made contact with police after the attack and was referred to the RSPCA, and was told no offence had occurred'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...Freddie-seal-Oxford-educated-QC.html#comments
How many could/would make contact with 'their lawyers' before any charges had been brought? Money talks! Probably a back hander to the 'police benevolent fund' and the RSPCA sorted it.

She supposed to be a highly rated, high ranking lawyer herself. Says a lot her her confidence in her own good judgement if she's engaged another lawyers to speak on her behalf.

Trust me, the dibble dislike lawyers more than most. It would have to be an awfully fat brown envelope to help her out there.

 

[Jody]

As for small birds being killed by cats,yes it's sad,but that as they say,that's nature.

If it's nature for one then it's nature for both. Both are domesticated predatory animals.

 

[Bonefish Blues]

Oh,it's ok! She's Oxford educated and lives in a 5.7 million pound house,so she's off the hook!

'Rebecca Sabben-Clare QC, 49, lives in a £5.8million house with her husband William, 57, not far away from Hammersmith Bridge, where Sunday's incident took place.

On Tuesday, her lawyers said she made contact with police after the attack and was referred to the RSPCA, and was told no offence had occurred'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...Freddie-seal-Oxford-educated-QC.html#comments
How many could/would make contact with 'their lawyers' before any charges had been brought? Money talks! Probably a back hander to the 'police benevolent fund' and the RSPCA sorted it.

Accy, you are a media person's wet dream. Just as they do, you've created a scenario to suit the basest motives. How about we look through a different lens:

She's got a high profile role, and her dog and she have been involved in a highly-publicised incident. Do you think she should go to ground, lie low, get to a safe house, or what? I think the right, and professional course as a senior lawyer is to approach the Police and RSPCA (Who fyi, almost uniquely, have the legal right to bring prosecutions v-a-v animal crime). I expect she has engaged lawyers who have some expertise in this area of the law. I also expect that she has not bribed either police or RSCPA FFS.

In no way am I supporting her lack of control over her dog, which is a matter of shame and regret, but seemingly not a criminal matter.

BTW I have some mild experience in this area, being the owner of a dog which was severely injured by another dog in a public place, so to reiterate, I have no sympathy whatsoever with the owner, but we mustn't let that run away with us.

 

[swee'pea99]

We need a balanced and reasonable outcome. Short leash on all public places except at designated locations is one option that is least costly.

Well, it's not costly, but I'm not sure it's balanced or reasonable. Indeed, I'd say that along with many other posts on this thread, it would be a massive overreaction to one very sad but isolated, and highly unusual, incident.

The day poor Freddie was attacked I took Cassie out to the woods and she pottered through the undergrowth, had a good sniff, said hi to some other dogs and even a couple of people, had a fine old time and then came home again. Just like the couple of dozen other dogs we encountered on that walk, and have done pretty much every day for 14 years, without ever once seeing a single incident where any dog did any harm to anyone. Cassie doesn't mind being on a lead, but she loves going off for a sniff. Why should she be denied that - along with the millions of other harmless dogs in the country - because of the occasional freak incident? And does anyone suppose that such draconian measures would prevent future Freddies? Because they wouldn't. All they'd do is make life significantly less enjoyable for millions of dogs and owners who are no threat to anyone.

 

[Profpointy]

I don't suppose for a moment she deliberately set the dog on a baby seal, and in any case, judging by appearances, it doesn't really look like the sort of dog you'd deliberatley set on anything. Though they're cute, seals aren't particularly rare, and I wouldn't be surprised if they're deliberately persecuted by certain interests associated with fishing. Would anyone really have been bothered if the dog had caught a squirrel or pigeon? If the mother seal had been around there'd doubtless be a call for a seal massacre after the vicous beast had drowned the poor defenceless dog.

This is all a bit silly frankly