FNRttC Friday Night Ride to the Coast - Cardiff to Swansea 20th May 2011

[frank9755]

they can't tag him with "Simon, 56, from Blaen Y Maes", and have never heard of Streatham Hill, they didn't know what to make of the opportunity...

Surely 'Simon, 56, from London' would be sufficient degree of precision...?


I quietly enjoyed the title of the article - riding from the capital; some of us obviously having ridden from a different capital!

 

[Aperitif]

My mum was interviewed by a paper recently, she was very pleased as they knocked 10 years off her age. And her eldest kid was 40, that's my older brother that is

I read that. She said something about her younger son having progeria or summat

 

[Aperitif]

Surely 'Simon, and others aged about 56, from London' would be sufficient degree of precision...?


I quietly enjoyed the title of the article - riding from the capital; some of us obviously having ridden from a different capital!

Ha ha! I would have liked a similar sort of thing: "Ah! But are we in Abertawe?"

 

[Aperitif]

(gutted I couldn't get organised to go to Wales)

Do we (we? who's this we, white man?) need to look at handling of Big Roads? The exit from the layby on top of Reigate Hill onto the A217 was similarly chaotic.

Just, as User10571 puts it, sayin...

Good point. I wish the cop van had made more of the issue in front of him at the time though! An advisory slow down person, stationed a bit further behind the start point might help cars etc slow down a bit?

As this is the serious bit of the thread, one thing that is guaranteed to wind up the spring of despair to 'boinging' point, (cf Adam after a testing day) - is to shunt the slower riders into the front of the group and get them under way first of all. Variable pace can be absorbed, and (as we were trying to do during the day) a collective effort can bring a more even pace, rather than the same one being last. Of course that is going to happen, but there is no point in that/those person/people starting off in last place every time.
Maybe there could be a 'first to arrive at a regroup - last to set off' advisory, to help and encourage a collective togetherness and groupmanship?
Then Adam and I will find something else to gripe about (And, to be fair - it's only me that grimbles, not Adam.)

 

[Little yellow Brompton]

(gutted I couldn't get organised to go to Wales)

And I wore my flashing necker especially!


It was commented on as "Trippy" and "Scouts has moved on since i was in it!"

 

[Little yellow Brompton]

It was a worrying sight. I don't know what it was like at the front of the ride, but where I was near the back we could have handled that road a bit better, had we done more to stay together in larger groups rather than being strung out along the road.

+1

I was feeling guilty at one stage of wheel sucking some of the ladies and pulled in front, but then noticed that they had dropped back and I wasn't being as gallant as I thought! A bunch would have made that stretch a lit easier for some of the weaker/slower riders such as myself.

 

[Little yellow Brompton]

I hope that nobody missed the view of the moon over the sea, because it was all that ‘Teef’s picture says it was, and then some.

Me! I missed it!

 

[clivedb]

Interestingly, they were instantly at ease when Clive told his story about his S&M holidays in Albi... which I'm sure he would be happy to expand upon in future posts

Apparently Martin has friends in Albi and I mentioned that I had been there many years ago. Martin was intrigued by the Albigensian heresy but seemed to think that it referred to a manoeuvre that had been missed out of the Kama Sutra. I think his head may have been turned the day before and he was imagining lithesome young women on wings. Here he is trying to sort it all out:

It was indeed a great ride and many thanks to Claudine for setting it up. I have many memories - in particular the sight of the moon and the sea.

A few more pics here:
Wales

See you all soon.

 

[Flying Dodo]

Good point. I wish the cop van had made more of the issue in front of him at the time though! An advisory slow down person, stationed a bit further behind the start point might help cars etc slow down a bit?

As this is the serious bit of the thread, one thing that is guaranteed to wind up the spring of despair to 'boinging' point, (cf Adam after a testing day) - is to shunt the slower riders into the front of the group and get them under way first of all. Variable pace can be absorbed, and (as we were trying to do during the day) a collective effort can bring a more even pace, rather than the same one being last. Of course that is going to happen, but there is no point in that/those person/people starting off in last place every time.
Maybe there could be a 'first to arrive at a regroup - last to set off' advisory, to help and encourage a collective togetherness and groupmanship?
Then Adam and I will find something else to gripe about (And, to be fair - it's only me that grimbles, not Adam.)

It is a difficult situation. In the past we've both suggested to people to make sure they leave near the front, so that they then get pulled along a bit, and so take some time to end up at the back again. However in practice, I have noticed that they do this for the first 1 or 2 re-groups then don't bother. I didn't do that this time which is another error I made, as I've noticed those at the back also tended to be the ones who faff around with their stuff, and so then they're really the last to leave.

This isn't meant to be a general criticism, as it's more me speaking out aloud so that I'm aware of things to consider next time*. For instance poor McWobble getting left behind which I think must have been due to me drifting in front of 4 or 5 people, so it could have been a new rider at the very back. Even though this was a smaller ride, there were a lot of people unused to the routine whilst for the last Brighton ride, 130 riders clearly brings other issues. It's all a positive learning curve.


*[sub] For example, I tend to have a look around after a stop to check nothing has been left behind, but after the last Southend run, I definitely take a more careful look!
[/sub]

 

[Flying Dodo]

I can understand why the slowest riders would prefer not to set off at near the front. Being passed by everyone until back at the back might be quite dispiriting.

I can also understand why it would appear that they are more prone to faffing about. They get less time at the catch ups than everyone else.

Yes there is that, although it can also an issue after a long stop. Although to be fair, even DavyWalnuts faffs around.

 

[dellzeqq]

(gutted I couldn't get organised to go to Wales)

Do we (we? who's this we, white man?) need to look at handling of Big Roads? The exit from the layby on top of Reigate Hill onto the A217 was similarly chaotic.

Just, as User10571 puts it, sayin...

there's a point at which you have to trust people. We've done the rolling road block thing on the A23 underneath Gatwick when one lane was coned off and it involved me at the back yelling at people to keep up because a rolling road block is no use if it's 100 metres behind the bulk of the group. Despite briefing the riders at the front it just about held together for about three quarters of a mile........ Four miles down a lightly used dual carriageway is beyond anybody's ability to organise, given the range of speeds.

I can illustrate this without too much difficulty. Twenty or thirty miles from the beginning of the ride (there are variations, but, in general, just about any ride) we get in to a set routine. Stop and wait for the tail-enders to catch up. I set off at a moderate speed, trying to keep the ride bunched. This works for about two miles. Then some of the faster riders go past, then some more, but they don't break away - for another couple of miles. Then they simply go for it, and, after a while, I think 'they'll miss the turn' engage the big gear, get to the front, and call a halt. Six miles for the entire cycle. give or take. What I try and do is to call the stops at points where I think I can control the ride a little - Lindfield is a good example, and one that happens now almost automatically. The T-junction at Wivelsfield is heaven-sent, but the days when we all gathered at the greenhouses are long gone. And, on the roads east of Gravesend we sometimes get very strung out, and people will sail past the left turn.......but, then I think that if they look over their shoulders after a mile or so and don't see any lights, they'll return just as the tail end comes in to view.

As for the take-off at the top of Reigate Hill - it's far better to have the speedier riders at the front. The greatest risk (and I think we've done exceptionally well never to have a crash, other than the one which I am not going to dwell on) is bike-to-bike. The less overtaking you have the better. I know I make a speech about keeping the speed down to 25mph - but I know that you lot are beyond listening. What does give me some comfort is that the speed merchants are all at the front, and unlikely to be taken out by a slower ride moving right to overtake an even slower rider. And, for what it's worth, when you gather at the layby you're all at a standstill, all able to look to your right, and all able to make a decision. My worry is that somebody will go left after the roundabout and wind up in Merstham....

Where we did have to improvise last Friday was on the Wayfinding side. I found myself surrounded by people who didn't know the system, and didn't give the impression of being able to work it out (but then again......) so poor Charlie got picked on time and time again (apologies), and, on one occasion, asked to do one roundabout moments before he was hauled off to do another roundabout, me reasoning that, since the first roundabout was a straight ahead, we'd be unlikely to lose anybody.....then, a bit further down the road, not spotting anybody practiced in the system I started going round and round the roundabout to compress the front end!

In a general way it doesn't matter that the slower riders are slow away. It only matters that the slowest rider gets away in good time. You'll see me checking the slowest rider, seeing if he or she is fit to continue (and taking advice from the TECs and then resuming when they're in shape. If some people are dragging their heels the TECS can shepherd them along, and, in time, they'll overtake the slowest rider.

The whole thing can be summed up this way - we have a system that is perfect but doomed to fail. It's all about how one copes with the failure.......

 

[Aperitif]

It is a difficult situation. In the past we've both suggested to people to make sure they leave near the front, so that they then get pulled along a bit, and so take some time to end up at the back again. However in practice, I have noticed that they do this for the first 1 or 2 re-groups then don't bother. I didn't do that this time which is another error I made, as I've noticed those at the back also tended to be the ones who faff around with their stuff, and so then they're really the last to leave.

This isn't meant to be a general criticism, as it's more me speaking out aloud so that I'm aware of things to consider next time*. For instance poor McWobble getting left behind which I think must have been due to me drifting in front of 4 or 5 people, so it could have been a new rider at the very back. Even though this was a smaller ride, there were a lot of people unused to the routine whilst for the last Brighton ride, 130 riders clearly brings other issues. It's all a positive learning curve.


*[sub] For example, I tend to have a look around after a stop to check nothings been left behind, but after the last Southend run, I definitely take a more careful look!
[/sub]

No, I insist - it was my fault Adam! And, it's always a 'two way street' for those that have been on rides regularly. Seeing you, Adrian, Des, me perhaps... the indications are there for the tail of the ride. It is weird to be left behind sure, but it happens.

Adrian's point about not having any time is a good one. I am a big faffer abouter if there is a 30 second window - I just sort it out in motion. Others need to be static. Good point. (Another reason for last to arrive being the first to set off ie: don't race to the regroup point and expect to set off immediately the all up is announced!)

 

[dellzeqq]

No, I insist - it was my fault Adam! And, it's always a 'two way street' for those that have been on rides regularly. Seeing you, Adrian, Des, me perhaps... the indications are there for the tail of the ride. It is weird to be left behind sure, but it happens.

let's not worry about it too much. McW took it all in his lengthy stride, and we were back with the rest of you in time for sarnies. I may have missed something, but the last time that happened was on the way to Cuckmere Haven in (I think) 2007. And Adam, Dr. John and I had a fab time careering through the night...

 

[Flying Dodo]

The whole thing can be summed up this way - we have a system that is perfect but doomed to fail. It's all about how one copes with the failure.......

I think that's inspired! Poetry in motion.

 

[Tim Hall]

there's a point at which you have to trust people. We've done the rolling road block thing on the A23 underneath Gatwick when one lane was coned off and it involved me at the back yelling at people to keep up because a rolling road block is no use if it's 100 metres behind the bulk of the group. Despite briefing the riders at the front it just about held together for about three quarters of a mile........ Four miles down a lightly used dual carriageway is beyond anybody's ability to organise, given the range of speeds.

I think for a rolling block to work over any sort of distance you'll need comunication between the front and the back ,with the back calling the shots.

And, for what it's worth, when you gather at the layby you're all at a standstill, all able to look to your right, and all able to make a decision.

I don't think people did look to their right though. From my viewpoint all I saw was a gaggle of people drifting out of the layby with not much sense of urgency, while a quarter of a mile back, chummy was giving it all in his van.

My worry is that somebody will go left after the roundabout and wind up in Merstham....

Once we nearly lost a few down the turn to the M25. Now that would have been interesting.

The whole thing can be summed up this way - we have a system that is perfect but doomed to fail. It's all about how one copes with the failure.......

And how we learn from the failure for the next time.