Giant Road E+ 1

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Pale Rider

Legendary Member
Thanks for those insights.

Whilst future-proofing does concern me, I'm hoping the size and status of Giant/Yamaha will indeed mean ongoing supportability. Now to find somewhere with stock and test-riding capability.....

Hope that goes well.

From what I read, the bike bowls along very nicely.

Most ebikes are hybrid/mountain style and don't go as well in comparison.

That makes sense, because it is the difference between riding a road bike against a hybrid, only assisted in each case.

The guy on the ebike forum - mentioned upthread - has a Giant Road E and a Scott eMTB, and he reckons the Giant goes a great deal better.

Which also translates to more mileage from the battery - never a bad thing.

I'm sure a few roadies on here will be interested to hear how you get on.
 
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Foghat

Foghat

Freight-train-groove-rider
Cheers! I'll report on progress....
 
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Foghat

Foghat

Freight-train-groove-rider
Well that has got to be the most inspired cycling acquisition for years!

I've commuted on it for two weeks now, and wish I'd got it a year ago when Giant launched the Road E+. I could have had a whole year's extra Saturday riding - something that has been pretty much impossible with such a high commuting workload. Now, I can guarantee getting there in 1hr 06m, even with a strong headwind and however knackered I'm feeling, and if I want to take it really easy, I only lose a couple of minutes. To do it in 1hr 06m on the non-e-bike is a major effort (impossible into a strong headwind); and taking it really easy on that bike means about 1hr 25m even on a benign wind day. So not only am I saving effort, but also time most days. Yes, it's too heavy to ride any faster, so with a tailwind I can ride faster on the non-e-bike (0hr 55m is the record), but that obviously still takes a lot of effort on a 16kg bike, and tailwinds are very rare anyway.

Impressions of the bike itself. Well, as I say, it's very heavy - 22kg before adding any mudguards/rack/lights etc. Not a problem when the motor is assisting you, but on level and gently descending roads it is pretty sluggish and there is a constant desire to drop back to a speed where the assist cuts in. Fortunately, the cut-off limit at 15.5mph is not a cliff edge - the assist fades out up to about 17/18mph, and fades back in too. It's worst when reaching the bottom of a descent and you're trying to keep momentum for the climb up the other side - in short, you can't; the boat anchor effect of the bike is too great, and you have to slow to the fade-in speed, at which point you achieve zoom-up-hill capability, and promptly scale the heights with impressive ease and speed.

This all means you ride very differently from an unassisted road bike, and it would probably make riding with unassisted companions slightly awkward if you're aiming to keep close together on the road. You'd be faster on the climbs, they'd be faster on the flats, wind-assisted gentle rises and less steep downhills, and you'd really get out of synch when going from fast descent to climbing up the other side, or accelerating away from junctions etc.

The Road E+ rides pretty well, though, and is very easy to keep straight - gliding smoothly uphill, dead straight, is a very satisfying sensation. When cornering sharply or at speed, you're very aware of the hefty battery at the front, and the motor, which create an odd weight distribution that influences cornering forces; nothing very alarming, though. Talking of the motor, it has three levels of power assist - eco, normal and sport. Eco has minimal effect, and while it may save battery life is not much use in a commuting scenario. Normal is much better, and uses a higher torque to get you to 15.5mph reasonably quickly. Having experimented with levels and recharging for my 40-mile round trip, I only use Sport mode, which gives a very satisfying shove on the hills and in stiff headwinds. I can get 2.5 commutes out of one charge using Sport - i.e. 100 miles to empty - on the hillyish route. In practical terms, that means I recharge every second commuting day (i.e. after 80 miles), to give a bit of contingency for belting headwinds in both directions. If I take the stonkingly hilly route home, that drastically reduces battery life, and only one (one-way) extra-hilly commute is possible if keeping to the two-day charging regime. The battery takes about 8 hours to charge from low.

Other points to note. Well, the Q-factor on the cranks is wider than the Amazon delta - I was rather dubious when I first saw this, but in practice, after fitting SPD pedals, I barely notice it when riding. If I think about it, there is a vague sensation of cycling like John Wayne walks after getting off his horse to drink his milk, but it's not too bad; certainly doesn't feel uncomfortable or cause any problems. The hydraulic Shimano RS685/RS785 brakes work most excellently, and are needed on such a heavy bike. The Schwalbe Durano 32mm tyres are good in terms of grip and comfort. The shop had pumped them up to about 5 million PSI, but I quickly corrected that. I certainly won't be going narrower than 32mm, as the frame is fairly stiff. For winter use, I expect I'll get some extra wheelsets so I can have different winter tyre options ready and waiting to swap in as required, just like my non-e commuter; will need to be consistent with hub/rotor models of course to reduce the risk of having to mess around moving calipers to prevent rubbing.

It's been fairly easy to achieve my usual riding position - but the seat angle is a bit steep, meaning the saddle is jammed as far back in the (decent layback) seatpost as it'll go. I much prefer drop handlebars of course, and would not have enjoyed e-bike riding with flat bars for 40 miles a day before these Giants came along (a conversion of a drop-bar bike could have worked, I suppose). The large battery, designed into the down tube, does make the bike look slightly odd, but it's fine and other than that appears reasonably normal. You can recharge the battery on or off the bike, and it unlocks with a key for security.

There are a few design flaws. For instance, the single pair of bottle cage bosses (on the seat tube) should be lower to allow fitting larger 750ml bottles, and there should be another set on the top tube so one can fit a tool case or second bottle, or bottle battery for lights. The rack fitment holes on the seatstays near the dropouts are a daft design, requiring a rather Heath Robinson arrangement of bolts and multiple washers/spacers to get working satisfactorily. The seatstay bridge has its mudguard-and-rack-fitting hole on the underside, rather than the more sensible traditional position; this means you need to fashion a special bracket to attach a rack, or even drill a hole in the mudguard - it all could have been so much easier if some common sense had been applied (i.e. dedicated upper rack bosses and usual bridge hole position). The seat tube takes a 30.9mm seatpost - given the sh*tness of road surfaces, frame designs should all be reverting to 27.2mm for a bit less rigidity. The electronic display is not quick-release, so could be vandalised or stolen (although it would take several minutes to get off). The standard 32-tooth cassette seems a somewhat non-optimal selection - with assist on (and you'd never choose to ride with it off), I can't see me (or anyone) ever needing much lower than a 23, even on the 1-in-4s of the Cotswolds. I prefer to have more ratios that are deployed in the general assist zone (i.e. 10-18mph), and so eschewed the 32 for a 25. I suppose the 32 would be worthwhile if you ran out of power in an area of very steep hills......

So, I won't be using it outside my commuting. And at the moment, it's getting rolled out on every commute because of how much easier it is to get to work at a guaranteed speed (AND less knackered) whatever the wind direction or my level of sleep deprivation and fatigue. When the novelty has worn off, and the sleep bank is more full, and the weather is warmer, I'm sure I'll revert to the 'normal' commuter for some days a week, but currently I'm more fixated on how I can actually get out on Saturdays now. Brilliant!!

In summary, if your cycle-commuting workload is so high that it restricts your capacity to ride at the weekends, and you have secure storage at work, the Giant E+ Road is a great choice. If you want to keep up with fitter/stronger riders, but it's not imperative that you stay very close to each other, and the stronger riders are happy to take it easier on the flat, then again it could be a good choice - but compromises will be needed to stay in proximity to each other. It is at its most useful on hilly terrain, where the effect of its assist on hills is most apparent, and its weight helps on descents, and where its limitations on the flat are least......but hills do reduce battery life, so 100 miles on a charge would be pushing it.

Will post some pictures in due course....after I've sorted the rack-fitting business and a couple of other things out.

By the way, having now experienced how electric-assist can deliver power to one's riding, and how it can facilitate almost effortless and smooth powerful accelerations, I'm even more convinced than I was already that Cancellara's ridiculous acceleration in the 2010 Paris-Roubaix was done with the benefit of mechanical power assistance.
 
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Pale Rider

Legendary Member
Pleased the bike is working well.

Your case is unusual, coming at ebikes as a strong cyclist whereas most new ebike riders get one because they can't manage more than a few miles on a push bike.

Very few ebikers could get close to the range you are getting - I couldn't - so you must still be putting in a fair amount of effort.

That's good as you want to continue push biking.

I know a couple of ebikers who lost a lot of their cycling fitness when they took to ebiking, disheartening when they get on the push bike and find they can't do what they used to be able to do.
 
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keithmac

Guru
Great review!, very jealous of your new steed..

I bought an ebike for similar reasons, commuting takes some of the fun out of cycling especially if there's a belting headwind against you on the way home..
 
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Foghat

Foghat

Freight-train-groove-rider
You're right, @Pale Rider. I do still get to work sweating and having put some decent effort in. The key thing, though, as you'll know, is that even so, it is still a considerably lower level of effort than unassisted (if I want), and the option is always there to make very low effort and still achieve an acceptable journey time (e.g. rest days on a Friday before the Saturday ride, or a Monday after a hard Sunday ride) - the timings I posted about should be useful evidence for anyone considering doing likewise.

Good stuff, @keithmac. I just wish I'd thought of this solution to my commuting workload sooner. Can't recommend it enough.....!
 

TyrannosaurusTreks

Formerly known as Giantbadge
Location
Somerset
Hi foghat, new to this forum but I have just purchased the 2016 Giant road E + 1 bike last week & I managed to get a good deal on it as the 2017 model is now out.
I understand the new one has LCD & switch update, I found your review very interesting.
I've got back into cycling just to try & keep fit, I brought a defy 4 a couple years ago which I love but after years of rugby & back problems I thought the ebike would suit me.
It's rather hilly in Somerset & I try to get out weekends & a couple times in the week.
I find the most annoying part of the bike 25kph limit as the bike seems most happy at 33kph on the flat, it is heavy but once the wheels are turning you don't notice the weight.
I'm a keen motorcyclist as well but find I see a bit more on the ebike
 
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Foghat

Foghat

Freight-train-groove-rider
Glad you found it interesting, @Giantbadge. Hopefully others will find it useful.

I note Cycling Plus has reviewed the 2017 Road E+ 1 in the current issue (June) which came out this week, comparing how it rides with Giant's TCR Advanced Pro Disc non-e-bike, and discussing the practicalities of riding with un-assisted companions. Much of the review echoes a lot of the points I've made. Rival magazine Bikes Etc also has a cursory 'review' (more of an extended listing) in its E-bikes Guide accompanying the June 2017 issue. I find it faintly ridiculous, though, that both magazines illustrate their features with 'action shots' of riders riding the Road E+ 1 out of the saddle - the bikes are so heavy, and the handling out of the saddle is so awkward/cumbersome, that you only ever get out of the saddle to relieve the (considerable) pressure on the a*se arising from lengthy periods continuously seated. A comfortable saddle is of paramount importance with e-bikes because of this.

Yes, searching out the remaining 2016 models makes sense, as I did too, since the £600 rise in price, as far as I can tell, only gets you i) a different display/controller (that apparently can be switched between miles and km - 2016 is km only) and ii) a walk-assist mode. Enjoy your 2016 bike!

I agree that the 25kph (15.5mph) assist limit is annoyingly low. Whilst it is appropriate for bikes suited predominantly for use on cycle/shared paths, it is too low for most road riding. The USA's limit seems to be 32kph/20mph, which is far more sensible. Maybe after Brexit the UK can escape this daft shackle. Cycling Plus also commented on the bike being 'hobbled' by this. Nevertheless, the Road E+ 1 still makes eminent sense for my commuting, for the various reasons in my review.

Anyway, the next stage of my e-bike initiation will be washing the thing. Giant's user manual includes an apocalyptic proclamation about not using water to clean the plastic covers protecting the motor and associated electrics ("do not wash these plastic components with water", "use a soft cloth with neutral solution", it says, but elsewhere it says "it is forbidden to use excessive water to wash the plastic"). Hmmm - given that it has the same covers for its e-mountain bikes, and these things get used in downpours when commuting (yet don't come with mudguards), it is not helpful to have conflicting guidance like this. During British winters, commuting extensively on lanes knee-deep in mud (with mudguards), I will be washing the bike regularly, including I expect the plastic covers. @Pale Rider - as the forum's obvious e-bike guru, do you have any comments on this aspect of e-bike maintenance?
 
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jonny jeez

Legendary Member
Why not fit a kit to your existing commuter, the front wheel kits are designed to 'freewheel' above the legal assistance limit.

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...-page/&usg=AFQjCNHEGPQ9qroe-xNDxsrXtSsG8lmRwg
Can work well and can be a dog.

My understanding of ebikes tend to point me towards purpose built bikes that set the power pack low in the frame for a good centre of gravity and not in the rear rack. Also the delivery of power on a purpose built bike can be much better than on a conversion like a Copenhagen wheel or such.

That's what the kalkhoff sales guy said to me at least...or something along those lines.
 

Pale Rider

Legendary Member
Glad you found it interesting, @Giantbadge. Hopefully others will find it useful.

I note Cycling Plus has reviewed the 2017 Road E+ 1 in the current issue (June) which came out this week, comparing how it rides with Giant's TCR Advanced Pro Disc non-e-bike, and discussing the practicalities of riding with un-assisted companions. Much of the review echoes a lot of the points I've made. Rival magazine Bikes Etc also has a cursory 'review' (more of an extended listing) in its E-bikes Guide accompanying the June 2017 issue. I find it faintly ridiculous, though, that both magazines illustrate their features with 'action shots' of riders riding the Road E+ 1 out of the saddle - the bikes are so heavy, and the handling out of the saddle is so awkward/cumbersome, that you only ever get out of the saddle to relieve the (considerable) pressure on the a*se arising from lengthy periods continuously seated. A comfortable saddle is of paramount importance with e-bikes because of this.

Yes, searching out the remaining 2016 models makes sense, as I did too, since the £600 rise in price, as far as I can tell, only gets you i) a different display/controller (that apparently can be switched between miles and km - 2016 is km only) and ii) a walk-assist mode. Enjoy your 2016 bike!

I agree that the 25kph (15.5mph) assist limit is annoyingly low. Whilst it is appropriate for bikes suited predominantly for use on cycle/shared paths, it is too low for most road riding. The USA's limit seems to be 32kph/20mph, which is far more sensible. Maybe after Brexit the UK can escape this daft shackle. Cycling Plus also commented on the bike being 'hobbled' by this. Nevertheless, the Road E+ 1 still makes eminent sense for my commuting, for the various reasons in my review.

Anyway, the next stage of my e-bike initiation will be washing the thing. Giant's user manual includes an apocalyptic proclamation about not using water to clean the plastic covers protecting the motor and associated electrics ("do not wash these plastic components with water", "use a soft cloth with neutral solution", it says, but elsewhere it says "it is forbidden to use excessive water to wash the plastic"). Hmmm - given that it has the same covers for its e-mountain bikes, and these things get used in downpours when commuting (yet don't come with mudguards), it is not helpful to have conflicting guidance like this. During British winters, commuting extensively on lanes knee-deep in mud (with mudguards), I will be washing the bike regularly, including I expect the plastic covers. @Pale Rider - as the forum's obvious e-bike guru, do you have any comments on this aspect of e-bike maintenance?

Electrics and water don't mix, and there's no doubt some of the Chinese ebike kits don't like bad weather.

The Yamaha will be much better designed and made, so I wouldn't expect any problems provided you are sensible.

I wash my Bosch bikes pretty much as a normal bike, hot soapy water applied with a brush or rag, then wipe off.

Probably wise to avoid sloshing water where the battery terminals plug into the frame, and remove the battery to check none is collecting.

Condensation is the enemy, so putting the bike in a shed wet is to be avoided.

The Yamaha motor has been around a few years, albeit not on road bikes, but I think we would have heard by now of any problems caused by washing or weather.
 

raleighnut

Legendary Member
Can work well and can be a dog.

My understanding of ebikes tend to point me towards purpose built bikes that set the power pack low in the frame for a good centre of gravity and not in the rear rack. Also the delivery of power on a purpose built bike can be much better than on a conversion like a Copenhagen wheel or such.

That's what the kalkhoff sales guy said to me at least...or something along those lines.
Only because Kalkhoff don't make a kit and he was trying to sell you something :laugh:

TBH you do need a fair bit of mechanical expertise to successfully (and neatly) fit a kit but both of ours look and work fine. The motor, controller, battery are identical to those fitted to front wheel e-bikes in the shops.
 
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