Ming the Merciless
There is no mercy
- Location
- Inside my skull
Agree it rambles somewhat, goes off on tangents, and he has not really thought about his target audience.
Great article for beginners: An impassioned guide on why not to buy cheap bikes.
- Thread starter night cycler
- Start date
-
- Tags
- bikes
Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.
DCBassman
Guru
- Location
- The lumpy far South West
If this is a long read...you all need to practise reading some more. Ramble a bit, yes. Drag on for ages, not even slightly. It's a few minutes at most to get through it, and it makes good points. However...I only went to the end of the article which was interesting. Did anyone read the comments underneath, they were longer than the article. No? No wonder libraries are closing.
...this is the unfortunate truth. Those who need it most will likely never know of its existence.
SkipdiverJohn
Deplorable Brexiteer
- Location
- London
I've read the article previously, and whilst there is an element of truth in what he says, he goes and spoils it by effectively dismissing all cheap bikes as BSOs. The net result is it comes across as a disgruntled/elitist vested interest who simply has a problem with people buying low-cost bikes.
Profpointy
Legendary Member
Given he says you can get a perfectly Ok bike for £300 to £400 (brand new) I really can't see how that can remotely be construed as elitist
SkipdiverJohn
Deplorable Brexiteer
- Location
- London
It's the standard response that you need to spend a specific minimum amount, and all bikes below that amount must be BSO's. It's utter cobblers; I run some stuff that was very cheap when it was new, but all of mine are functional, maintainable bikes and none are BSO's. They just happen to be the sort of bikes that so-called "serious" cyclists won't be seen dead riding because of the name on the decals and the retailer who supplied it.
Reynard
Guru
- Location
- Cambridgeshire, UK
I ran across that article when I was doing the research before buying my road bike - which incidentally cost me around £360. Admittedly though, at my height, there's not a great deal of choice.
I think the point the author is trying to make, is that for under the £300 pound mark, you do start to slip into the realms of Caveat Emptor. That's not to say there aren't good, serviceable bikes below that price point, because there are, but that unless you know what you are looking for, the chances of buying a clunker increase significantly. That and the fact that people are often seduced by appearances as opposed to functionality - in other words, all show and no go...
I think the point the author is trying to make, is that for under the £300 pound mark, you do start to slip into the realms of Caveat Emptor. That's not to say there aren't good, serviceable bikes below that price point, because there are, but that unless you know what you are looking for, the chances of buying a clunker increase significantly. That and the fact that people are often seduced by appearances as opposed to functionality - in other words, all show and no go...
IanSmithCSE
Guru
- Location
- Worcester, Worcestershire
Good morning,
I read it awhile ago and I feel that it has dated quite a bit.
The term BSO did have a value at one point in time, it covered those bikes that could never be made to ride well for more than a few hundred miles, such bikes can still be found if you look hard for them, but nowadays you have to look for them.
Gone are the days when the supermarkets have them as a special offer all the time, they have learnt, customer returns mean that selling total rubbish isn't worth the effort.
You do still see bikes in supermarkets occasionally and yes they aren't carbon with electronic shifting but they are perfectly usable once you put the front forks on the right way and do up all the nuts. :-)
It is the same with Halford's Apollo range, they have found the cheapest point where they can sell bicycles that do what the customer wants and not get bombarded with returns, yes there are complaints and reviews about how badly setup they were but that is also true of the Boardman range.
At this price point gear changes are often not great but many of the riders of this type of bike rarely change gear anyway, the rider finds one that they like and stays in it, they aren't interested in one tooth increments on their cassettes.
I have a number of 20-30 miles rides where I stay in the same gear, peddle fast on the downhills and rest when I spin out and get a bit of resistance training on the hills.
It is the same with the brakes, if one breaks he simply uses the other for a year or two until it might get fixed, this bike will probably never get over 15mph and one brake works fine!
I recently rode a bike with those horrible butterfly gear levers that you get on the handlebars near the stem and they do actually work well.
Bottom of the range bikes for the non enthusiast definitely still exist but BSOs much less so, even our local Sports Direct mountain bikes had Shimano shifters and mechs the last time that I looked.
A specialist bike shop may need to charge £300 to make a decent margin, but there are plenty under £200 at Halfords that are adequate, although how you can make an aluminium framed bike as heavy as they manage is a bit of a mystery.
So I too think that there is a minimum price for a bike under which it is almost certain to be rubbish, but my minimum is closer to £150-£200.
If I were riding more than say 10 miles, which many people never want to do, I would want to spend more as the compromises at this price point are too great for me.
Bye
Ian
I read it awhile ago and I feel that it has dated quite a bit.
The term BSO did have a value at one point in time, it covered those bikes that could never be made to ride well for more than a few hundred miles, such bikes can still be found if you look hard for them, but nowadays you have to look for them.
Gone are the days when the supermarkets have them as a special offer all the time, they have learnt, customer returns mean that selling total rubbish isn't worth the effort.
You do still see bikes in supermarkets occasionally and yes they aren't carbon with electronic shifting but they are perfectly usable once you put the front forks on the right way and do up all the nuts. :-)
It is the same with Halford's Apollo range, they have found the cheapest point where they can sell bicycles that do what the customer wants and not get bombarded with returns, yes there are complaints and reviews about how badly setup they were but that is also true of the Boardman range.
At this price point gear changes are often not great but many of the riders of this type of bike rarely change gear anyway, the rider finds one that they like and stays in it, they aren't interested in one tooth increments on their cassettes.
I have a number of 20-30 miles rides where I stay in the same gear, peddle fast on the downhills and rest when I spin out and get a bit of resistance training on the hills.
It is the same with the brakes, if one breaks he simply uses the other for a year or two until it might get fixed, this bike will probably never get over 15mph and one brake works fine!
I recently rode a bike with those horrible butterfly gear levers that you get on the handlebars near the stem and they do actually work well.
Bottom of the range bikes for the non enthusiast definitely still exist but BSOs much less so, even our local Sports Direct mountain bikes had Shimano shifters and mechs the last time that I looked.
A specialist bike shop may need to charge £300 to make a decent margin, but there are plenty under £200 at Halfords that are adequate, although how you can make an aluminium framed bike as heavy as they manage is a bit of a mystery.
So I too think that there is a minimum price for a bike under which it is almost certain to be rubbish, but my minimum is closer to £150-£200.
If I were riding more than say 10 miles, which many people never want to do, I would want to spend more as the compromises at this price point are too great for me.
Bye
Ian
Last edited:
OP
OP
night cycler
Guru
- Location
- Rotherham (near town)
Quote: This bit
It is the same with Halford's Apollo range, they have found the cheapest point where they can sell bicycles that do what the customer wants and not get bombarded with returns, yes there are complaints and reviews about how badly setup they were but that is also true of the Boardman range.
Hi Ian,
When I started riding regularly 18 years ago, I would just buy second hand Appollo MTBs made from steel. I had a few and never paid more than £20. The least I paid was £12. They did what I wanted at the time.
The longest ride I ever cycled on one of these was 50 miles. I had set-off by myself from Rotherham to Bakewell in Derbyshire on a sunny day. It was tough on the hilly parts but I didn`t know any better. It still had MTB tyres on too. By the time I got back to Rotherham I had done 47 miles, so I did 3 laps of the town to round it up to 50.
Three & half years ago I bought my first new "proper" road bike with skinny tyres and Shimana 105 stuff. I now have two of these type of bikes.
It is interesting that you mention the Boadman range too, as I am hoping to buy a second hand one of these having tried it and liked it a lot. I don`t think this Halfords offering can be compared to the Apollo range, or indeed to my Shimano 105 type bikes. It will be second hand and mainly used for riding in the woods and going out in rain, snow or whatever-something I don`t do on the roadies. Getting it muddy will not lose me any sleep at the price. I intend using my simple 5Lt garden pump up pressure spray bottles to blast it clean in the crooks & crannies after the rides.
https://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/hybrid-bikes/boardman-hyb-8-6-hybrid-bike-grey
It is the same with Halford's Apollo range, they have found the cheapest point where they can sell bicycles that do what the customer wants and not get bombarded with returns, yes there are complaints and reviews about how badly setup they were but that is also true of the Boardman range.
Hi Ian,
When I started riding regularly 18 years ago, I would just buy second hand Appollo MTBs made from steel. I had a few and never paid more than £20. The least I paid was £12. They did what I wanted at the time.
The longest ride I ever cycled on one of these was 50 miles. I had set-off by myself from Rotherham to Bakewell in Derbyshire on a sunny day. It was tough on the hilly parts but I didn`t know any better. It still had MTB tyres on too. By the time I got back to Rotherham I had done 47 miles, so I did 3 laps of the town to round it up to 50.
Three & half years ago I bought my first new "proper" road bike with skinny tyres and Shimana 105 stuff. I now have two of these type of bikes.
It is interesting that you mention the Boadman range too, as I am hoping to buy a second hand one of these having tried it and liked it a lot. I don`t think this Halfords offering can be compared to the Apollo range, or indeed to my Shimano 105 type bikes. It will be second hand and mainly used for riding in the woods and going out in rain, snow or whatever-something I don`t do on the roadies. Getting it muddy will not lose me any sleep at the price. I intend using my simple 5Lt garden pump up pressure spray bottles to blast it clean in the crooks & crannies after the rides.
https://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/hybrid-bikes/boardman-hyb-8-6-hybrid-bike-grey
Reynard
Guru
- Location
- Cambridgeshire, UK
Have you tried *lifting* one of these bikes, @IanSmithCSE ? 
A brand new (cheap) junior hardtail mountain bike (I'm 4ft 11, so yeah, I'm always looking at junior bikes) weighed 21kg. That was 7kg more than the late 80s steel MTB I was riding at the time, and which I found a touch on the heavy side. Needless to say, I didn't bite... Cheap junior bikes can be ridiculously heavy and truly horrible to ride.
Actually, I think Halfords have thought out their ranges pretty well to be fair. Apollo for those want to stay in the £100 or under bracket (and who probably don't know much if anything about what makes a decent, rideable bike), Carrera for those who know a bit and want something reasonably decent or an innocuous-looking hack bike, then Wiggins and Boardman for those who know a good bit about bikes but want decent bang-for-buck. Pendleton probably falls into the latter category as well.
And as for components, any manufacturer can put their name to stuff ranging from bargain basement to ultra high end... A name is just that.
What's really odd though, is that the local recycling centre gets in loads of bikes. Yet it's the very cheap, blingy BSO type things that command premium resale prices and sell really quickly, whereas decent bikes (that might need a little bit of TLC) tend to stick around, sometimes for months at a time...
A brand new (cheap) junior hardtail mountain bike (I'm 4ft 11, so yeah, I'm always looking at junior bikes) weighed 21kg. That was 7kg more than the late 80s steel MTB I was riding at the time, and which I found a touch on the heavy side. Needless to say, I didn't bite... Cheap junior bikes can be ridiculously heavy and truly horrible to ride.
Actually, I think Halfords have thought out their ranges pretty well to be fair. Apollo for those want to stay in the £100 or under bracket (and who probably don't know much if anything about what makes a decent, rideable bike), Carrera for those who know a bit and want something reasonably decent or an innocuous-looking hack bike, then Wiggins and Boardman for those who know a good bit about bikes but want decent bang-for-buck. Pendleton probably falls into the latter category as well.
And as for components, any manufacturer can put their name to stuff ranging from bargain basement to ultra high end... A name is just that.
What's really odd though, is that the local recycling centre gets in loads of bikes. Yet it's the very cheap, blingy BSO type things that command premium resale prices and sell really quickly, whereas decent bikes (that might need a little bit of TLC) tend to stick around, sometimes for months at a time...
DCBassman
Guru
- Location
- The lumpy far South West
Reynard
Guru
- Location
- Cambridgeshire, UK
At my local one in Witchford, you can usually pick up a reasonable (e.g. Raleigh, Carrera) 26 inch wheel hybrid for between £25 and £50. Mostly all they need is a bit of chain lube and grease in the appropriate places and some new brake blocks and they're good to go. Some might need a little more work, but if you know how to do the basics, then it's no biggie.
They also get in some passable older steel stuff as well. At the moment, they have two roadies and a roadster, but all three bikes need a fair bit of work.
DCBassman
Guru
- Location
- The lumpy far South West
The Claud in my sig needed a good clean and a new rear tyre and tube. Initial outlay £7, total £24. When I return the Scott 209 roadie (initial cost to me £0) to proper road geariness, the Alivio transmission will be fitted to a new wheel as I did to the Trek to give it a freehub system and 8 speed, yet still using NOS Shimano parts to keep it looking like it should. Total outlay around £65 then, but it will actually be able to get up hills. With me pedalling, that is...
Reynard
Guru
- Location
- Cambridgeshire, UK
The Claud in my sig needed a good clean and a new rear tyre and tube. Initial outlay £7, total £24. When I return the Scott 209 roadie (initial cost to me £0) to proper road geariness, the Alivio transmission will be fitted to a new wheel as I did to the Trek to give it a freehub system and 8 speed, yet still using NOS Shimano parts to keep it looking like it should. Total outlay around £65 then, but it will actually be able to get up hills. With me pedalling, that is...
Neat
P.S. What are these hills that you talk about?
