Keto Diet

[Ming the Merciless]

MCT is an intercellular transport protein involved in transporting lactate across cell membranes. The amount of MCT can be increased through training and is why elites have exceptionally low lactate levels at high intensities.

See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2805372/

 

[Bill Gates]

Please don’t be impressed, I copied and pasted the bit about traditional societies, fasting for weight control etc. onwards....

I have already explained what I thought. His attempt to dismiss the law of thermodynamics is nonsense and the rest about the impact of Insulin I know and understand.

Now, why don’t you explain to me the benefit of MCT?
I reckon as it’s a fat, when it’s if taken- up by the body then it’s either burned which means it’s calories or it’s used to synthesise other molecules such as membranes, hormones etc (which one might argue contributes to mass). As a fat it will have little impact on Insulin response like other fats.

So what’s the deal with MCT?

Hi there again.

My understanding of MCT (Medium Chain Triglyceride) is that it is a fat that is made up of strings of carbon atoms that have a linear link of 6 -8 carbon atoms. When this is ingested it is absorbed like other essential nutrients through the portal vein and then straight into the liver. Within minutes the fat is converted into ketones and transported by the blood to the muscles (mitochondria) for energy. (my science might not be spot on here but should be close enough for this purpose)

I do know that for Coconut Oil 15% is a MCT and the rest is made of Long chain Triglycerides (10/12 atoms) that are treated as normal fat like olive oil. None of it has any impact on insulin as you would know.

 

[Bill Gates]

It's a supplement, and he doesn't do supplements.


"MCT oil is a dietary supplement that is made up of MCT fats, which are fats that can be found in coconut oil, palm kernel oil, and dairy products."

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/320251.php

Coconut oil isn't a supplement. And I do do supplements. As mentioned in one of my first posts I take Omega 3 oil with vitamin D.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I’m referring to monocarboxylate) transport protein (MCT) so confusingly different based on what you are describing.

 

[Fab Foodie]

I’m referring to monocarboxylate) transport protein (MCT) so confusingly different based on what you are describing.

Actually more interesting from a quick read!

 

[Bill Gates]

MCT is an intercellular transport protein involved in transporting lactate across cell membranes. The amount of MCT can be increased through training and is why elites have exceptionally low lactate levels at high intensities.

See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2805372/

I don't understand any of that link. Above my pay grade

edit: See its an error. Thank God for that I was worried for a minute

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Taken from the summary of another peer reviewed scientific article.

“It is now known that lactate traverses the plasma membrane of many tissues, including heart and muscle, via a stereo-specific, pH-dependent monocarboxylate transport (MCT) system. In the past few years a family of MCTs (MCT1–MCT7) has been cloned.

Transcripts of MCT1 and MCT4 are detectable in rat and human skeletal muscle and in the heart. However, only skeletal muscle expresses both the MCT1 and MCT4 proteins, whereas rat heart expresses the MCT1, but not the MCT4 protein. The kinetic activities of MCT1(K m=3.5 mM) and MCT4 (K m=17–34 mM) are quite different.

Among rat muscles, MCT1 expression is highly correlated with the oxidative fiber composition of the muscle, and other indices of oxidative metabolism.

Lactate uptake from the circulation is also highly correlated with the MCT1 content of muscles. MCT4 is confined to fast-twitch (fast glycolytic and fast oxidative glycolytic) muscle fibers, in which MCT4 content is correlated with indices of anaerobic metabolism. Collectively, these data suggest that MCT1 and MCT4 are primarily responsible for lactate uptake from the circulation and lactate extrusion out of muscle, respectively.

Exercise training can increase the expression of both MCT1 and MCT4 in human muscle, although the extent of this up-regulation may be related to the intensity of training. In the rat heart, MCT1 expression is induced more easily by exercise training than in rat skeletal muscle.

It appears that MCT1 and MCT4 expression are regulated in a tissue-specific and isoform-specific manner. Therefore, skeletal muscle lactate concentrations are not only regulated by the rate of glycolysis, but also by the efficiency of trans-sarcolemmal lactate transport, a process that is regulated by the quantity of available MCT proteins.”

 

[Bill Gates]

It is now known that lactate traverses the plasma membrane of many tissues, including heart and muscle, via a stereo-specific, pH-dependent monocarboxylate transport (MCT) system. In the past few years a family of MCTs (MCT1–MCT7) has been cloned.

Transcripts of MCT1 and MCT4 are detectable in rat and human skeletal muscle and in the heart. However, only skeletal muscle expresses both the MCT1 and MCT4 proteins, whereas rat heart expresses the MCT1, but not the MCT4 protein. The kinetic activities of MCT1(K m=3.5 mM) and MCT4 (K m=17–34 mM) are quite different.

Among rat muscles, MCT1 expression is highly correlated with the oxidative fiber composition of the muscle, and other indices of oxidative metabolism.

Lactate uptake from the circulation is also highly correlated with the MCT1 content of muscles. MCT4 is confined to fast-twitch (fast glycolytic and fast oxidative glycolytic) muscle fibers, in which MCT4 content is correlated with indices of anaerobic metabolism. Collectively, these data suggest that MCT1 and MCT4 are primarily responsible for lactate uptake from the circulation and lactate extrusion out of muscle, respectively.

Exercise training can increase the expression of both MCT1 and MCT4 in human muscle, although the extent of this up-regulation may be related to the intensity of training. In the rat heart, MCT1 expression is induced more easily by exercise training than in rat skeletal muscle.

It appears that MCT1 and MCT4 expression are regulated in a tissue-specific and isoform-specific manner. Therefore, skeletal muscle lactate concentrations are not only regulated by the rate of glycolysis, but also by the efficiency of trans-sarcolemmal lactate transport, a process that is regulated by the quantity of available MCT proteins.

All very interesting I'm sure. I think that you might be a tad off topic with this.

So what does it mean in Layman terms?

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Actually more interesting from a quick read!

It is I discovered it when looking at what changes in physiology different training emphasises and why. It’s quite fascinating what is going on particularly with Glycosis arising from burning glucose and what the full cycle is.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

All very interesting I'm sure. I think that you might be a tad off topic with this.

So what does it mean in Layman terms?

It is core to physiology of fat vs. carb burning and what is going on including ketones. So I know science isn’t your strong point but give them a read.

There is some interesting discussion and real measurement on what is happening when you train such that your physiology is better able to utilise fats as fuel. All without changing your diet.

 

[Fab Foodie]

It is I discovered it when looking at what changes in physiology different training emphasises and why. It’s quite fascinating what is going on particularly with Glycosis arising from burning glucose and what the full cycle is.

It’s all a bit beyond me these days! The closest I got to Biochemistry greatness was meeting Hans Krebbs grandaughter :-)

 

[Ming the Merciless]

It’s all a bit beyond me these days! The closest I got to Biochemistry greatness was meeting Hans Krebbs grandaughter :-)

Was she on her cycle made by her grandad?

 

[Fab Foodie]

Was she on her cycle made by her grandad?

Ha! She was a Science teacher at Didcot School for girls....

 

[HMS_Dave]

If i may. I have been on a weight loss journey for 6 months. I didn't really look too much into Keto, Juicing, Soup or Pillock diets... I just cut out breads, starch and refined breakfast cereals. I eat porridge with a spoon of honey and sultanas every morning and only occasionally eat pasta and increased veggie intake. I never even considered this a fad diet, just i though it was a common sense approach due to what others eat on diets. I first picked up on this thread a few weeks back and i did some reading and wondered. I since ordered some pee sticks that measure Ketones and it turns out there is slight colour on the stick indicating mild Ketosis. Im very surprised at this. I don't eat high fat at all, the opposite in fact. I don't snack at all, i will simple eat a piece of fruit straight after my meal and then gulp a a load of water which fills me up. Having lots of weight to lose im assuming is the reason why im inadvertently in ketosis but i feel alright, saying that i can't necessarily say i have been in Ketosis for 6 months, im probably dipping in and out of it but i will monitor it from now on purely out of interest...

 

[Fab Foodie]

If i may. I have been on a weight loss journey for 6 months. I didn't really look too much into Keto, Juicing, Soup or Pillock diets... I just cut out breads, starch and refined breakfast cereals. I eat porridge with a spoon of honey and sultanas every morning and only occasionally eat pasta and increased veggie intake. I never even considered this a fad diet, just i though it was a common sense approach due to what others eat on diets. I first picked up on this thread a few weeks back and i did some reading and wondered. I since ordered some pee sticks that measure Ketones and it turns out there is slight colour on the stick indicating mild Ketosis. Im very surprised at this. I don't eat high fat at all, the opposite in fact. I don't snack at all, i will simple eat a piece of fruit straight after my meal and then gulp a a load of water which fills me up. Having lots of weight to lose im assuming is the reason why im inadvertently in ketosis but i feel alright, saying that i can't necessarily say i have been in Ketosis for 6 months, im probably dipping in and out of it but i will monitor it from now on purely out of interest...

I think that is a very practical and sustainable way forward.
It still allows you to enjoy a wide range of foodstuffs (for the pleasure of eating) and replacing refined foods with more veggies is a very good thing. I’m not convinced that high fat is a requirement at all, though it does aid satiety and dampens the rate of sugar uptake by the body which reduces insulin spikes -a good thing which everybody agrees.
How is the weight loss going?
How do you feel?