London - any hope?

[Claudia]

I got my first bike when I was 3 - over 20 years loving those pretty things now. Back home, I never had a helmet, high vis jacket, lights... Nothing in regards of safety. Apart from when I wen to school, I never left home by foot. Later on, I was dragged to a 3rd world country, I lived in a city by the sea where at the time there were no traffic lights, zebra crosses and, the very few STOP signs didn't mean a thing. I've seen the most bizarre accidents over those 3 years. Yet, I still rode a bike, still no helmet, lights or high vis equipment and I made it without a scratch or scary situation.

Now, London. A semi expensive bike sitting at home, helmet, 2 sets of lights, high vis stuff and that's still not enough to get me riding to work. I just don't have the balls. Especially now that 8 people died within the ridiculous space of 8 days, all of them just next door. It terrifies me!

Then, when it should be time to stick together and try to get the ones who call the shots to make London safer to cyclists, shoot happens! The things I read through forums this week, just put me even more off than I already am. And pissed me off too! I thought some people would actually take it seriously but all I keep reading is "get your f***** bikes off the streets, London is not a place for cyclists." "You don't pay to use the road as I pay for my car so stay the f*** out of my way." "Go to the country side and ride your bike there." And more non sense. Some of them even suggested in blurred lines that all cyclists should just 'disappear'. Probably the same way the other 8 disappeared. This is revolting. I replied to some of them but hey, what do I change on my own? nothing.

I realise now how much most of this city hates cyclists...

It's 5.40 am and this is actually taking my sleep away.

What else needs to be done to make drivers* (any) sensible to this?

*especially lorry and taxi drivers!!!

 

[classic33]

We, cyclists have as much right as anyone else to the use of the roads.
By not cycling your letting the bully win. If they do somehow manage to force us(cyclists) off the roads, who'll be next. You see bad driving report it.
But don't let them put you off cycling. I was hit by a car driven by a drunk driver, who was driving the car with no licence or insurance. The car had no VED, insurance or MOT, so we are not the only ones on the roads without "road tax" or insurance.
Don't let the buggers grind you down. They know no other way, thats all.

 

[The Jogger]

Maybe we need to organise mass protests/go slows in the heart of London at peak times or even throughout the day.

Bristol is the cycling capital of the country without the problems we have in London, probably less congestion however they must be doing something right.

 

[Globalti]

We are all guilty of a fundamental and massive mistake in assuming that we can cycle as much as our neighbours in the Netherlands. There, visiting a city is like looking inside a superior mind; most cities are built on a sensible pattern, not rambling along medieval lines like British cities. There is plenty of space so all major roads also have a cycle path alongside. People have been cycling en masse for decades so an unspoken code of mutually-respectful conduct has grown up, in contrast the the "them and us" attitudes of British drivers and cyclists. The anarchic tendency doesn't exist amongst cyclists who obey traffic signals and accept that for the sake of their safety they need to conform and cruise along at the same speed as all the other cyclists. We have a long long way to go before we are as good as the Dutch at cycling.

 

[classic33]

Segregated cycle paths will have to meet the road at some stage. They'll also provide further "proof" that the motor vehicle is the only thing not only paying for the upkeep of the roads but now subsidising our cycling habits.

 

[Claudia]

We, cyclists have as much right as anyone else to the use of the roads.
By not cycling your letting the bully win. If they do somehow manage to force us(cyclists) off the roads, who'll be next. You see bad driving report it.
But don't let them put you off cycling. I was hit by a car driven by a drunk driver, who was driving the car with no licence or insurance. The car had no VED, insurance or MOT, so we are not the only ones on the roads without "road tax" or insurance.
Don't let the buggers grind you down. They know no other way, thats all.

I know you're right there and I love the fact you're still here to tell me that but others have gone and the bullies are still here, untouchable. Some do it for fun like that stupid woman that knocked a cyclist off his bike (or nearly) and posted it on twitter as if it was something to be proud of. What did the police do? Same as always - nothing.
But yes, all in all, your point is pretty much valid and that's what I should stand up for too but I can't feel confident enough right now.

 

[Claudia]

Maybe we need to organise mass protests/go slows in the heart of London at peak times or even throughout the day.

Bristol is the cycling capital of the country without the problems we have in London, probably less congestion however they must be doing something right.

That wouldn't make them love us any more than they do now... But would most likely prove the point. I can imagine the cab drivers fuming, standing still behind us...

 

[classic33]

Try cycling in/through those parks that allow you.

 

[the_mikey]

Maybe we need to organise mass protests/go slows in the heart of London at peak times or even throughout the day.

Bristol is the cycling capital of the country without the problems we have in London, probably less congestion however they must be doing something right.

Bristol is a lot smaller than London and many (but not all) journeys are shorter and on less busy roads. Also it has one of the most well used dedicated cycle paths in the country. It still has a lot of problems and a lot of pressure and lack of space in some areas.

 

[Claudia]

Saw this in France a couple of months ago, in Bordeaux on the way to the airport. Now have a guess at how many cyclists I've spotted cycling along...

Right thing in the wrong place.

 

[vickster]

It is awful, but in those 8 days how many pedestrians or motorists have been killed or injured? 8 million people live in and around London, accidents are inevitable and it is a small minority of people who are idiots. As there are idiot cyclists who rlj at busy junctions, ride on the pavement down Oxford street or whatever! We just have to seek to minimise risk as cyclists by riding defensively and making ourselves as visible as possible. I don't like riding in the dark, but as much as I can't see the rubbish roads clearly and every time I hit a pothole it hurts one of my limbs as the risk of being hit by a car.

Go out and ride quieter roads, at the weekend, in parks, along canals, there are plenty of ways to avoid the major roads as said I am going to cycle into Central London today and plan to enjoy it. Come and meet us

 

[vickster]

Wise words here

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/keep-calm-and-carry-on.143731/

 

[outlash]

I realise now how much most of this city hates cyclists...

It doesn't. Fact is London, like many cities can be a hostile place purely because the amount of people squashed into a small area. It's the same attitude that gives unwritten rules like not making eye contact with strangers on the tube, not using night buses unless you absolutely have to and so on.

The problem is unless you rip up the whole road network or completely change the entire culture of places like London, it's hard to see how things are going to radically change. You may well get piecemeal things done like segregated lanes in one or two places but essentially it's not a vote winner, and that's the long and short of it unfortunately.


Tony.

 

[Hill Wimp]

Up until a few months ago i was a cycle commuter in London for years. I now cycle for pleasure on the roads and lanes of Kent and i read recently that 17 cyclists have been killed or seriously injured this year on the roads in Kent. That's a lot more than London considering the amount of people in London.

I do agree it's a dreadful state of affairs and any death or serious injury to any person is awful but i do wish people would stop knocking London.

In all the years i cycled there i admit i had a few near misses but then i have had those here in the lanes of Kent too. In London traffic any driver of a motorised vehicle has got to look out for cyclists obeying the rules of the road plus the idiots that don't plus the thousands of pedestrians good and bad alike and other drivers. As a driver in London myself it is not easy.

I have only been a member on here since the Summer but i have lost count of the number of threads knocking London and it's driver attitude to cyclists. It's a huge city not built for cyclists and there has been a cycling explosion in the last few years. It is going to take time and one cannot expect it to just suddenly change drivers attitudes and it's infrastructure overnight. Most drivers in London don't even live there.London is lucky it has a very driven mayor who is pro cyclists and in the last few years has done massive amounts to help change things which is continuing.

It doesn't help when cyclists start massive generalisation against all lorry driver or all car drivers. It's not the all that's the problem it's the few. Cyclists that do this do not help the cause and just alienate cyclists as a group and i do resent that. I am a driver and a cyclist and drive and ride according to the rules of the road and as safely as i can.


Rant over.

 

[srw]

London is great for cycling! I've been doing it as my main way of getting for work for 17 years now. I've never felt particularly unloved or threatened. There is one road in central London I avoid - but that's a six-lane dual carriageway and there are plenty of decent alternatives. When I'm coming from home and crossing the North Circular I pick my junction carefully. I wouldn't use the handful of motorway-grade arterial routes. Other than that I'll use just about any road. A couple of weeks ago I went out to the Thames Barrier along the main road - a fantastically interesting ride passing hundreds of riders coming the other way.

I came to London from 8 years of cycling in Oxford. Narrower roads and no attempt to deter traffic meant it did sometimes feel like a conflict zone - but in all those 8 years there was only one really serious incident involving a cyclist. Likewise, in those 17 years of London cycling I've only seen the aftermath of one serious cycling incident and been involved in two very minor scrapes myself. I rarely get near misses.

Oh, and these days I don't bother with hi-viz and a helmet in London. The streets are so well lit that ordinary clothes and cheap LED lights are perfectly adequate.