London Assembly Transport Committee's review of cycle schemes

[stowie]

there are many trips in London within that range, but, sadly, planners have encouraged car based shopping and allowed high streets to decay. Most Italian cities have thriving local economies that are within walking distance of people's dwellings. We have Tesco stores with 350 car spaces.

And that's the problem. It's not just about the design of streets, it's about urban form (sorry, but you hopefully know what I'm on about). Tax large car parks out of existence and you've got yourself a cycling city.

I understand exactly. Having been to one of these retail parks today (Edmonton Lee Valley - the one with the huge IKEA) I know how utterly unfriendly they are to anyone who dares decide not to use a car.

The story of our high streets is one of the tragedies of urban planning in the last 40 years. Not only has the retail park killed the high street, but the high street in many parts of London has been turned into an urban highway which also drives away custom.

The ongoing tragedy is that the shop owners in high streets cling to the belief that lowering parking fees and increasing the number of spaces is the answer. When in reality all that happens is that people using their car will still opt for the out of town shop as it will always be easier than navigating to, and parking in, the high street.

One day this trend will have to reverse, but I cannot see it happening any time soon.

 

[dellzeqq]

It's going to be tough. But it's do-able.

 

[dellzeqq]

Just cycled along the superhighway from Colliers Wood to Balham this evening, its more like a carpark there are at least 60 cars parked on the blue bits. Not another cyclist to be seen unsurprisingly.

Did discover a considerable stretch of wide cycle path along the A217 towards Morden which could do with resurfacing but apart from a couple of poor junctions was pretty decent.

I was in Balham last night. There was a hard frost. I'd have stayed at home as well. If you go back on a weekday morning you'd see bikes by the bundle.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Thanks Greg. I've just sent you an email.

Cheers. I've sent you our response to the local authorities transport plan consultation.

 

[dellzeqq]

I was in Balham last night. There was a hard frost. I'd have stayed at home as well. If you go back on a weekday morning you'd see bikes by the bundle.

...as there was at seven this morning

 

[stowie]

It's going to be tough. But it's do-able.

Tonight I had a car try to run me off the road because I had the temerity to be on the A10 cycling up Stamford Hill whilst he wanted to undertake the traffic on the outside lane (and then push in at the junction). And when I say run off the road, I mean the full beeping and shouting as he passed so close I felt the wing-mirror. Then I had a car speed towards me at a junction where the priority was mine, and slide (crappy corsa, no ABS) to a stop metres from me as my life flashed before me. Nothing I could realistically do about either, except not be on the road on a cycle at all.

I am really dispirited tonight - it feels a million miles from the environment we should be able to enjoy.

Then, we have the local council with "regeneration" plans falling through repeatedly, and taking no notice of local opinion. In central Walthamstow, the arcade site (a large area which used to be a shopping parade, got pulled down for regeneration but has stayed derelict for years) is nothing short of a local scandal. And when the council consulted the local residents, the overwhelming response (despite the survey being somewhat "rigged") was that people wanted a low rise development (4 / 5 storeys) in keeping with the surrounding buildings, and the old EMD cinema to be regenerated (a building which was stunning, and is now a wreck) as part of the scheme. What the council (and St Modwen) wanted was an 18 storey towerblock with some retail space. Now all those plans fell through because St Modwen has apparently no money - although the council has paid the company money for "feasilibility" studies. Now the council, with Solun, want to "regenerate" the station area with 14 storey tower blocks. At the same time, 60's high rise buildings such as the Beaumont Estate are being replaced with low rise housing and flats.

Very active local associations that are campaigning against these plans seem to only be able to halt progress, not make anyone involved in the planning actually change their minds.

How can things turn-around against these odds?

 

[dellzeqq]

on the other hand.....

Shoreditch gyratory system removed, bus and bike lane northwards
Brixton High Street, gyratory system removed
St. John's Street Clapham Junction, where prosperity has followed a ban on cars

(glosses over Vauxhall....)

and, actually, if I was drawing for St. Modwen's I'd draw it 38 storeys high (that being the maximum you can get out of flat slab construction) oversize the lifts and hallways to take bikes and suggest that having 200 new flats within walking distance of a market is no bad thing for the market. The more people you have living in a town centre the more the town centre will flourish. The secret of Italian town centres is that they're eight stories. Walking trade guarantees the shops at ground floor level.

 

[Dan B]

Every time I set wheel on the a10 I am reminded that the standard of driving on that road is uniquely awful in london, and I don't know why. It's the only road I use on which I've ever wanted an airzound.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

The secret of Italian town centres is that they're eight stories.

and the parking is dreadful, so you only drive when you have to and walk/cycle everywhere otherwise. Lots of old town centres in France are the same.

 

[ozzage]

Sorry I've been away from the forum for a while (not that you mind I'm sure!) but I was amused to see pages of discussion about my "virtually nobody" cycles comment. I'm sorry, but 2% modal share IS virtually nobody in my view.

Let's try another analogy: if you came from another country to the UK (or even London) and found that only 2% of the adult population had a job it would be perfectly reasonable to say "virtually nobody here works!".

It's all relative of course and if you're comparing with the UK ten years then you probably think everything's going great. I've noticed that many people here seem to aim extremely low with what they want to see in terms of cyclist numbers which I find a bit of a shame.

It is sadly indicative of the level of debate in this thread that people choose THAT to fixate on this one statement anyway, rather than on anything concrete.

I will try to respond later to some other points made earlier, since some people went to the trouble of actually trying to articulate arguments with real points! I'm sure you all can't wait

 

[CopperBrompton]

a cycle ride of 350 people. That's about two and a half bendy buses, four double deckers, or, if you prefer, five half full bendy buses and eight double deckers. That ride had a police escort and caused almighty traffic jams at half past twelve at night.

That's an absurd comparison.

First, those buses will, for most of the day, be mostly empty.

Second, if you want to keep 350 people together as a single group, and give them a police escort, of course it will cause a traffic jam. I'll hazard that any road into central London has more than 350 cyclists every half an hour and causes no traffic jams at all.

 

[ozzage]

I don't think that anyone here has suggested that 2% is sufficient, or that they have low expectations or ambitions for cyclist numbers. In fact I can see some of them being quite offended by your implicit suggestion that to fail to share your utopic vision can be equated to a lack of any vision for cycling as a transport choice.


Edit:

To resurrect an earlier question "Do you cycle here in the UK? What do you do about roads and that?"

In response to your first point, people raised arguments directly against my statement pointing to what they saw as massive numbers of cyclists on London's roads, so I don't think my suggestion or implication is at all unfair. Apparently some think that there are already a lot of cyclists in London, or that's certainly suggested by their choice of evidence against my claim of virtually nobody cycling.

Sorry I did miss your other question. Yes I cycle in London every day either on my own bike or on Boris Bikes. Quite obviously, I cycle mostly on the roads because I have little choice!

However, I often find it unpleasant and am frequently reminded of how dangerous it feels almost being clipped by taxis or being stuck with a choice of waiting in the fumes or squeezing between a bus and curb/bus and lorry/bus and oncoming traffic. I'm also frequently reminded of how different it was cycling in the Netherlands and how I would never expect mothers with kids, grandparents etc to cycle in the conditions that we face here.

Don't get me wrong, it's not always terrible and I still love going by bike. I like cycling on my Boris Bike through the City after work. The traffic is sparse on the roads I use and it's great. However as soon as I want to get somewhere further away I'm on the Strand/Fleet Street or High Holborn stuck between buses and taxis again. Or I'm going via Lincoln Inn Fields on the quiet route which is fine (but indirect) but rapidly stops at Covent Garden with nowhere to go once I hit Seven Dials. Alternatively, when I commute the whole way on my own bike (from west London) I go through the parks as much as possible and then up via Bloomsbury (and the Tavistock route) which isn't too bad, but only in comparison to other places, and is hardly the most direct route.

 

[dellzeqq]

In response to your first point, people raised arguments directly against my statement pointing to what they saw as massive numbers of cyclists on London's roads, so I don't think my suggestion or implication is at all unfair. Apparently some think that there are already a lot of cyclists in London, or that's certainly suggested by their choice of evidence against my claim of virtually nobody cycling.

just false. Show us the drawing

 

[srw]

Ozzage, next time you're in the Holborn peleton, quit worrying and just enjoy it. Look around you at the fixie gladiators, the Chelsea girls on Pashleys, the massed ranks of Borisers and Bromptoneers. Do we look worried about being clipped by cabs or bonked by buses?

No! Because it very rarely happens.

 

[slowmotion]

I could be wrong, but maybe the reliance on motor transport in Britain is partly a consequence of our love of suburbs rather than city centres as places to live. I suppose it's a bit chicken and egg.