Man who was paralysed sues Planet X for £10 million

[Bonefish Blues]

Typically 'just before' anyway chums

 

[mustang1]

It seems most brands have had carbon fork recalls but from what I remember reading the carbon fibre blades bonded to a aluminium steerer was a much more common failure than the full carbon fibre forks maybe 70% to 30% as an impression but the bonded forks often took time for the bonding to break down. Of course carbon fibre forks are hand made, layered etc so its something which can be great 98% of the time but then 2% fail which is enough to merit a recall. As a heavy chap I don't even consider carbon fibre but because of how forks fail and collapse the structure of the bike they are a lot more dangerous than carbon fibre frames. Personally I'm a huge fan of steel forks which have incredibly low failure rates and not bike weight obsessed so for peace of mind go steel.

There's a long history of lightweight performance bicycle forks causing injury and even death in fact there was a British manufacturer Viscount that used aluminium forks that were called death forks years ago with a steel frame.

The benefit of steel forks isn't just their strength and durability but they give good notice of when they are going to fail and if you get the fork design which has tapered tubes with a slight curve they offer good a level of flexing for comfort. Some modern steel forks are straight blade and don't really flex. They might be a bit lighter though.

Carbon fibre often has the cheapest nastiest manufacturing as its so labour intensive. Quest Composites who manufacture for Trek and Canyon and likely many other brands too have horrible cramped conditions and you can see clearly in this factory image from Quest themselves that the woman in the foreground is not wearing that protective hat properly and any dust or dirt that gets into the carbon fibres is like a cutting blade as the forks flex.

View attachment 714762

I see the lady does not have her hat on properly but tbf, all the people showing a reasonable amount of hair?

 

[the snail]

It seems most brands have had carbon fork recalls but from what I remember reading the carbon fibre blades bonded to a aluminium steerer was a much more common failure than the full carbon fibre forks maybe 70% to 30% as an impression but the bonded forks often took time for the bonding to break down. Of course carbon fibre forks are hand made, layered etc so its something which can be great 98% of the time but then 2% fail which is enough to merit a recall. As a heavy chap I don't even consider carbon fibre but because of how forks fail and collapse the structure of the bike they are a lot more dangerous than carbon fibre frames. Personally I'm a huge fan of steel forks which have incredibly low failure rates and not bike weight obsessed so for peace of mind go steel.

There's a long history of lightweight performance bicycle forks causing injury and even death in fact there was a British manufacturer Viscount that used aluminium forks that were called death forks years ago with a steel frame.

The benefit of steel forks isn't just their strength and durability but they give good notice of when they are going to fail and if you get the fork design which has tapered tubes with a slight curve they offer good a level of flexing for comfort. Some modern steel forks are straight blade and don't really flex. They might be a bit lighter though.

Carbon fibre often has the cheapest nastiest manufacturing as its so labour intensive. Quest Composites who manufacture for Trek and Canyon and likely many other brands too have horrible cramped conditions and you can see clearly in this factory image from Quest themselves that the woman in the foreground is not wearing that protective hat properly and any dust or dirt that gets into the carbon fibres is like a cutting blade as the forks flex.

View attachment 714762

lol If you think those are "horribly cramped conditions" I can only assume you've never seen the inside of a factory before.

 

[FishFright]

It seems most brands have had carbon fork recalls but from what I remember reading the carbon fibre blades bonded to a aluminium steerer was a much more common failure than the full carbon fibre forks maybe 70% to 30% as an impression but the bonded forks often took time for the bonding to break down. Of course carbon fibre forks are hand made, layered etc so its something which can be great 98% of the time but then 2% fail which is enough to merit a recall. As a heavy chap I don't even consider carbon fibre but because of how forks fail and collapse the structure of the bike they are a lot more dangerous than carbon fibre frames. Personally I'm a huge fan of steel forks which have incredibly low failure rates and not bike weight obsessed so for peace of mind go steel.

There's a long history of lightweight performance bicycle forks causing injury and even death in fact there was a British manufacturer Viscount that used aluminium forks that were called death forks years ago with a steel frame.

The benefit of steel forks isn't just their strength and durability but they give good notice of when they are going to fail and if you get the fork design which has tapered tubes with a slight curve they offer good a level of flexing for comfort. Some modern steel forks are straight blade and don't really flex. They might be a bit lighter though.

Carbon fibre often has the cheapest nastiest manufacturing as its so labour intensive. Quest Composites who manufacture for Trek and Canyon and likely many other brands too have horrible cramped conditions and you can see clearly in this factory image from Quest themselves that the woman in the foreground is not wearing that protective hat properly and any dust or dirt that gets into the carbon fibres is like a cutting blade as the forks flex.

View attachment 714762

It was going fairly well until you felt the need to add the 'dangerous foreigners' pic

 

[Yellow Saddle]

It was a new bike.

So what? I would do this test particularly thoroughly on a new bike.

 

[Fastpedaller]

I recall many years ago an acquaintance who bought a 2nd-hand bike and a few days later was launched over the bars. His teeth were damaged (changed colour), but thankfully the nerves re-established and they recovered (I believe this can happen sometimes). Some bright spark had 'repaired' the steerer by using part of the tube off another (I guess the original thread had been mashed), but had merely butt-brazed the two parts together

 

[Beebo]

Happened to George Hincapie a few years ago. Apparently it was an aluminium steerer bonded to a CF fork so the join was the weak point.

View: https://youtu.be/7ZiZy0pm2T0?si=Fyu0qu7z--V9asJ1

I suspect that in terms of the forces being exerted on the frame there is a big difference between a professional giving it full beans on the cobbles compared to a recreational cyclist on his first ever ride.

 

[Fastpedaller]

I suspect that in terms of the forces being exerted on the frame there is a big difference between a professional giving it full beans on the cobbles compared to a recreational cyclist on his first ever ride.

Maybe not - the 'muscle generated' forces may be minute compared to a bump in the road?

 

[Beebo]

completely irrelevant. They have public and product liability insurance, the claim being handled by the insurers, whose first course of action is always to deny liability, which they have done. it will either come to court in the fullness of time or more likely be settled before then.

From my reading of the situation their insurance sits with Chubb. They have very deep pockets ,
but their defence is that firstly the forks were not defective u less you can prove otherwise and secondly if they were defective, they were purchased from a third party supplier in china in good faith, so sue them not us.
Suing a Chinese firm would be all but impossible.

 

[Slick]

Typically 'just before' anyway chums

Just before is right. I was due my day in court when the measly offer came in which I instantly rejected out of hand. The opposition made their final offer on the morning of the court case and I've always regretted that decision ever since. I was on solid ground and should have seen it through.

 

[Bonefish Blues]

Just before is right. I was due my day in court when the measly offer came in which I instantly rejected out of hand. The opposition made their final offer on the morning of the court case and I've always regretted that decision ever since. I was on solid ground and should have seen it through.

I settled a Tribunal minutes before we walked in. Pressure of time on both parties.

 

[alicat]

So what? I would do this test particularly thoroughly on a new bike.

You originally said that tests needed to be done 'regularly'. Quite hard to comply with that advice on a new bike.

 

[cougie uk]

So what? I would do this test particularly thoroughly on a new bike

What is your test for forks ?

 

[Fastpedaller]

From my reading of the situation their insurance sits with Chubb. They have very deep pockets ,
but their defence is that firstly the forks were not defective u less you can prove otherwise and secondly if they were defective, they were purchased from a third party supplier in china in good faith, so sue them not us.
Suing a Chinese firm would be all but impossible.

From my reading of the situation their insurance sits with Chubb. They have very deep pockets ,
but their defence is that firstly the forks were not defective u less you can prove otherwise and secondly if they were defective, they were purchased from a third party supplier in china in good faith, so sue them not us.
Suing a Chinese firm would be all but impossible.

Doesn't the liability rest with the supplier? Customer claim off PX (or their insurance). PX or their insurance claim off the Chinese supplier?

 

[Fastpedaller]

These things aren't straightforward of course, and people will 'wriggle'
I had a dispute once relating to an electric hob. The manufacturer said it needed a special wire to install it. Supplier or Manufacturer couldn't supply wire. I got Trading Standards involved........ strangely they were quite dismissive saying I shouldn't have bought it from an online supplier (AO). Understandably AO referred me to the manufacturer. TS supported the manufacturer's claim that I could buy the wire from pretty much anywhere (I couldn't). I, am the electrician installing it tried every wholesaler etc. I dug my heals in, (despite TS saying AO were liable), on the basis the manufacturer (Electrolux) had presumably done testing to state this wire was needed, and only they were privy to that info!
I suspect it was a 'warranty avoidance scheme'.
Strangely Electrolux eventually produced 1m of said wire (but wouldn't pay for it to be fitted!