Modern classics

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Cycleops

Cycleops

Legendary Member
Location
Accra, Ghana
Wonderful. In this day and age when people often judge on price and much of the stuff we buy is mass produced in the Far East it’s great that craftsmanship like this valued and bought.
 
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woodbutcher

woodbutcher

Veteran
Location
S W France
Cycleops said:
Wonderful. In this day and age when people often judge on price and much of the stuff we buy is mass produced in the Far East it’s great that craftsmanship like this valued and bought.
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You are so right, It is a mad world when marketing hype, association with a famous or successful individual etc. determines demand for, and price of a product rather than the value of the product itself. I'll get off my soapbox now:smile:
 
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woodbutcher

woodbutcher

Veteran
Location
S W France
biggs682 said:
It is good , but the vast majority of us cant afford to ride one of these tailor made bikes if buying new
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It is true that most of us , me included would not be able to afford a new custom made bike but that applies to lots of products not just bikes . One positive thing is that even though the market is small, it is still a market and ensures that these type of skills don't die out. I would be a total hypocrite if or argued any other way since l made my living designing and producing "hand made"traditional furniture . Also as you imply, new by definition will one day be second hand then maybe we stand a chance.:smile:
 
Pumpkin the robot

Pumpkin the robot

Guru
I did an apprenticeship as a toolmaker in the late 80s. The company I worked for wanted to take on 2 a year, but were lucky if 1 person applied. That was probably the last decade when there were companies training people to do that work.The last 10 years has slowly seen the pay go up, as the older generation retire and there are no longer replaced by apprentices.
I have been at a few firms in the last decade that are trying to take on apprentices, but they do not come out of the scheme with the levels of skill that used to be taught. Part of this is down to cnc machining taking over a lot of the work. I still believe that you need to be able to work manual machines before you can use cnc machines. There is also the skill in using hand tools. I still see people in an engineering enviroment that cannot use a saw or file correctly.
I guess I was fortunate that I was at a good company, that gave me a good, solid engineering background that I could build more skills on as I progressed. Many firms now take apprentices on as cheap labour and are not really bothered about teaching them as long as they are making them money.
I have often thought my skill base would make a transistion in to frame building quite easily, but it is taking the plunge that makes it difficult. Maybe when I get my compensation for my accident I can look at this as a viable alternative to what I do now. I look at the work that goes into it and know I can do very good job of it, attention to detail is second nature to good toolmakers.
 
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woodbutcher

woodbutcher

Veteran
Location
S W France
Martin Archer said:
I did an apprenticeship as a toolmaker in the late 80s. The company I worked for wanted to take on 2 a year, but were lucky if 1 person applied. That was probably the last decade when there were companies training people to do that work.The last 10 years has slowly seen the pay go up, as the older generation retire and there are no longer replaced by apprentices.
I have been at a few firms in the last decade that are trying to take on apprentices, but they do not come out of the scheme with the levels of skill that used to be taught. Part of this is down to cnc machining taking over a lot of the work. I still believe that you need to be able to work manual machines before you can use cnc machines. There is also the skill in using hand tools. I still see people in an engineering enviroment that cannot use a saw or file correctly.
I guess I was fortunate that I was at a good company, that gave me a good, solid engineering background that I could build more skills on as I progressed. Many firms now take apprentices on as cheap labour and are not really bothered about teaching them as long as they are making them money.
I have often thought my skill base would make a transistion in to frame building quite easily, but it is taking the plunge that makes it difficult. Maybe when I get my compensation for my accident I can look at this as a viable alternative to what I do now. I look at the work that goes into it and know I can do very good job of it, attention to detail is second nature to good toolmakers.
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When the time is right for you and you can get set up, give it a go. Hell man think how good it would be to take that first ride on a bike you had designed and built yourself. Very best of luck !!
 
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SkipdiverJohn

Deplorable Brexiteer
Location
London
There are many companies in this country that are heavily reliant on older, proper apprentice-trained staff, to hold together the technical side of their operations. My employer copes on a wing and a prayer, and in a few years time they could be completely crippled, as they will probably have 10 long-srvice retirements by then to every 1 new apprentice they have taken on - and they aren't even being trained in some of the areas with the worst skill shortages timebomb. Meanwhile know-nothing managers are busy manipulating pointless computer-generated stats to make themselves look good and receive their bonuses.
 
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woodbutcher

woodbutcher

Veteran
Location
S W France
SkipdiverJohn said:
There are many companies in this country that are heavily reliant on older, proper apprentice-trained staff, to hold together the technical side of their operations. My employer copes on a wing and a prayer, and in a few years time they could be completely crippled, as they will probably have 10 long-srvice retirements by then to every 1 new apprentice they have taken on - and they aren't even being trained in some of the areas with the worst skill shortages timebomb. Meanwhile know-nothing managers are busy manipulating pointless computer-generated stats to make themselves look good and receive their bonuses.
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It is a crazy and complex situation that we in the West find ourselves in. I think we are witnessing the death throes of skill based industries to be replaced by an unstoppable technological revolution . This has meant that in order to deal with the transition between traditional manufacture and computer designed and generated manufacture, we have opted to export production to Asia where there is still a massive, by western standards, a cheap traditional skill base.
It is a fools paradise because by doing so we have kept the true cost of production artificially low. So we can all go to whichever high street store and buy products at a fraction of their true cost, if they were to have been made in the west. The next problem will happen when the home markets in China for example grow to the extent that they don't need to export quite as much, so the price to the west will rise. Good old fashioned supply and demand !!
 
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