New cycling infrastructure - a noteworthy obstacle is cyclists themselves, apparently.

[All uphill]

I'm feeling uncharacteristically pessimistic about the chances of walking and cycling getting a fair chance in the UK; that's probably because my cycling is very limited for the foreseeable.

We are a society based on and around the privately owned car, and it's horrible imho. Enclosed in expensive mobile living rooms, trapped in traffic jams getting to destinations that are jammed with other equally unhealthy people. Regarding eating and drinking as recreation.

Pah! Humbug!

 

[ren531]

I'm sure if a ped was hit or injured by a cyclist on our local disused railway tracks, the keyboard warriors would be all over the local FB groups... but i can't recall a single incident.

Only the Lancaster-Morecambe track has a segregation line, the others don't and work just as well. It's just a case of cyclists giving way to peds which so far as I can tell, is working.

Been using the Lancaster to Morecambe Greenway for many years and never witnessed any collisions between anyone, I did see 2 cyclists knocking 7 bells out of eachother near Sainsbury's a few years ago but no idea how it started.

 

[mustang1]

Car drivers should all just bugger off, drive slower, stay off the phone, wait for pedestrians and cyclists to get across.

I rather dislike riding on bike lanes, overtaking all the cars stuck in traffic, only then having to wait at a traffic signal timed for PEDESTRIANS, seeing all the car traffic go (that I just overtook previously). Pedestrians have to wait for ages for pelican crossings and road junction traffic lights to change to a green man so that they can cross. Very annoying. And even more so as a cyclist.

So, to get around that, I ride in the bike lane and when I see traffic lights coming up, I join the road; that way, I get to be safe on the bike lane and keep my average speed up when negotiating traffic lights.

A silly, ill-thought, system. I hope it improves for future generations....

 

[Drago]

Car drivers should all just bugger off, drive slower, stay off the phone, wait for pedestrians and cyclists to get across.

I rather dislike riding on bike lanes, overtaking all the cars stuck in traffic, only then having to wait at a traffic signal timed for PEDESTRIANS, seeing all the car traffic go (that I just overtook previously). Pedestrians have to wait for ages for pelican crossings and road junction traffic lights to change to a green man so that they can cross. Very annoying. And even more so as a cyclist.

So, to get around that, I ride in the bike lane and when I see traffic lights coming up, I join the road; that way, I get to be safe on the bike lane and keep my average speed up when negotiating traffic lights.

A silly, ill-thought, system. I hope it improves for future generations....

I walk Mini D to school and at 13 she's already figured out for herself the ridiculous situation where human beings are a lower form of life with a lesser priority than metal boxes.

 

[lazybloke]

Car drivers should all just bugger off, drive slower, stay off the phone, wait for pedestrians and cyclists to get across.

I rather dislike riding on bike lanes, overtaking all the cars stuck in traffic, only then having to wait at a traffic signal timed for PEDESTRIANS, seeing all the car traffic go (that I just overtook previously). Pedestrians have to wait for ages for pelican crossings and road junction traffic lights to change to a green man so that they can cross. Very annoying. And even more so as a cyclist.

So, to get around that, I ride in the bike lane and when I see traffic lights coming up, I join the road; that way, I get to be safe on the bike lane and keep my average speed up when negotiating traffic lights.

Hmm, traffic lights for bike lanes in London seem to leave cyclists waiting for AGES.
Particularly turning off the embankment onto Westminster Bridge or the other way into Parliament Square.
Parliament Square itself can be quite annoying too.

Switching between bike/car lanes can make a massive difference.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I walk Mini D to school and at 13 she's already figured out for herself the ridiculous situation where human beings are a lower form of life with a lesser priority than metal boxes.

I'm sure you attitude and general demeanour is teaching her a lot as well

It is amazing how much kids pick up from us that we never say!

 

[mjr]

Hmm, traffic lights for bike lanes in London seem to leave cyclists waiting for AGES.
Particularly turning off the embankment onto Westminster Bridge or the other way into Parliament Square.
Parliament Square itself can be quite annoying too.

Switching between bike/car lanes can make a massive difference.

Parliament Square is indeed a mess and the lights seem to prioritise keeping the all-traffic entry lanes clear over speed of cycle traffic. A redesign to put the cycleway on the outside of the square instead of the inside, and so the other side of Westminster Bridge's approach road, might help, but I doubt it will happen soon.

I often switch between cycleway and carriageway on the approaches to traffic lights based on my prediction of what colours will be shown by the time I arrive at them, but it's worth remembering that moving from cycleway to carriageway at an acute angle (merging into another lane) is one of the top five causes of cyclist road casualties, and I think it's the top one where cyclists are thought to be at fault (but I've not checked right now), so look back carefully and only change if you're pretty sure there's a gap you can use.

Relatedly, it's also worth remembering if there's a red man (so it's a so-called Toucan or Puffin crossing), then the crossing is legally a give-way and you can go if it's clear and you won't cause motorists to take avoiding action, unlike if it's a red circle or red bike alone (either alone or as part of a signalised parallel crossing) which are compulsory stops. My local highway authority used to deny requests to change signal timings to favour cycleways by arguing that we weren't really delayed unnecessarily because we didn't have to stop, even though this isn't widely known.

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

Local traffic situations aside it's also a mentality problem, from how crossing are approached here for example for uk car drivers the common way seems ''always drive at the maximum(allowed) speed, up until you approach the crossing then slam the brakes'' where the ''dutch approach is much more release the accelerator as soon as you approach a crossing so you can gently slow down for any situations that may arise.

 

[mjr]

Local traffic situations aside it's also a mentality problem, from how crossing are approached here for example for uk car drivers the common way seems ''always drive at the maximum(allowed) speed, up until you approach the crossing then slam the brakes'' where the ''dutch approach is much more release the accelerator as soon as you approach a crossing so you can gently slow down for any situations that may arise.

Yes, if you take that Dutch approach when learning to drive in the UK, you will usually fail the practical driving test for "not making progress". It will take either a generation or some retesting to change that completely.

 

[Alex321]

Yes, if you take that Dutch approach when learning to drive in the UK, you will usually fail the practical driving test for "not making progress". It will take either a generation or some retesting to change that completely.

Have they changed the test in that respect?

Because I was certainly taught to ease down in plenty of time rather than braking hard at the last minute, and passed my test that way. And I know that even then, you could be failed for "not making progress".

 

[mjr]

Have they changed the test in that respect?

Because I was certainly taught to ease down in plenty of time rather than braking hard at the last minute, and passed my test that way. And I know that even then, you could be failed for "not making progress".

I cannot speak to changes since about 2000. I don't think there's a published changelog.

One test I failed, it was for three instances of braking and decelerating before it was certain to be necessary (but it was, every time, and I was sure it would be, from having cycled those roads through residential areas many times and knowing how drivers behaved before they make the tight turns).

The test I passed, I went over the speed limit (according to the instruments, but little enough that maybe not in reality), but that's generally acceptable in this country, which is ridiculous.

That's the culture our road infrastructure needs to deal with.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I cannot speak to changes since about 2000. I don't think there's a published changelog.

One test I failed, it was for three instances of braking and decelerating before it was certain to be necessary (but it was, every time, and I was sure it would be, from having cycled those roads through residential areas many times and knowing how drivers behaved before they make the tight turns).

The test I passed, I went over the speed limit (according to the instruments, but little enough that maybe not in reality), but that's generally acceptable in this country, which is ridiculous.

That's the culture our road infrastructure needs to deal with.

When I took my Advanced test I was told that going even 1 mph over the speed limit was a big problem

not because ti was illegal - it probably wasn't because most speedos read low

but because it relates to the level of control you have over the car
if you can;t keep an eye on the speed then you are not as in control of everything as you should be

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Although BITD we were expected to firmly know our place as cyclists, ie, officially in the gutter.

We had 40ft wide gutters where I cycled as a kid

 

[Drago]

but because it relates to the level of control you have over the car
if you can;t keep an eye on the speed then you are not as in control of everything as you should be

This in spades.

Regulating a motor vehicles speed is just about the simplest driving task there is - anyone too incapable/negligent/entitled/lazy to handle such a simple piece of foot-eye coordination should really be questioning their fitness to handle the steering, brakes, anticipate hazards, or even be on the road ar all.

 

[mjr]

When I took my Advanced test I was told that going even 1 mph over the speed limit was a big problem

not because ti was illegal - it probably wasn't because most speedos read low

I think you mean they read high, for it not to be illegal. Last time I checked against a more precise test, my speedo displayed about 107% of the actual speed.

but because it relates to the level of control you have over the car
if you can;t keep an eye on the speed then you are not as in control of everything as you should be

I agree entirely and to be clear for another poster, my decision to risk the speedometer showing a bit over the limit at that point was deliberate, on advice from my instructor (who was a former Army instructor) that I must absolutely not be seen to be under the limit on certain stretches of A road near that test centre. Of course, it could have just been that one test centre around that time, but I've read and heard things from other people since which make me doubt that. Bottom line: the UK driving test was more subjective (and I believe harsher) about driving slower than the legal maximum than it was about having the speedometer show over the limit... and that entrenched "above all else, keep up with traffic" attitude will take a long time to change.