Nissan Leaf - what do we think?

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Pale Rider

Legendary Member
The change won't happen. Theres only 40% of the neodymium required to replace every ICE car with a battery one, not to mention the lithium carbonate or hydroxide. It physically cannot ever happen as the dreamers wish.

This bold assertion has been made several times, but it's a dangerous one.

There's stuff on the BBC website about mining the materials from the deep seabed.

Those in favour say there's little else down there, so environmental impact is small, those against say different.

Either way, seabed mining may go the same way as most new battery technology - looks good at first blush but doesn't work in practice.

But it might not, so no one can correctly claim conversion to electric vehicles 'physically cannot ever happen as the dreamers wish'.
 

mustang1

Guru
Location
London, UK
When you put bikes on the roof rack of an electric car, it's a good idea to ensure they are all aero bikes. I wonder what those dumb bike companies will say about their "aero" claims then, save 50W at a constant 70mph etc...
 

Pale Rider

Legendary Member
We've sold our old Polo and replaced our contracted diesel SEAT Leon estate with a pre-reg e-hybrid Leon estate.

There are some fantastic pre-reg deals if you search for them- we got ours just under 4 months after registration with 2100 miles on it £10,400 cheaper than the cost of ordering a factory build new one. [Pentagon SEAT are running 3 hatchback Leons if you want to check them out on Autotrader.]

Our 'real-world' experience of the plug-in hybrid so far:

It's used just under 3 gallons of petrol to do 350 miles mostly used picking it up from the SEAT garage in Oldham... plugs into a socket in the garage overnight which costs up to £1.80 which gets us over 34 miles [most journeys are less than that so far] before the petrol engine starts to cut in depending on the outside temperature. When it was -1 degC one morning it managed 29 miles.

Once I get the 4G connected to the car it will be possible to programme any longer journeys so that the sat-nav saves electric mode for hold-ups and city centre driving where it's most effective. Looking into an Economy 7 type electric provider when the present provider deal runs out which will make overnight charging cheaper and we can run the heavy electric usage stuff overnight.

Just got approval for workplace charging points with a grant from HMRC so checking out our local registered electrician for cost of installation.

All looks very promising and, being a plug-in hybrid it's a VW DSG automatic which saves my dodgy left knee from all those gear changes on the heavy diesel clutch!

I had a squire at one of these online, not least because it might suit my motoring rather well.

The 'electric premium' is not as much as in some other cases - a comparable nearly new diesel auto Focus estate is about £18k-£19k.

That may be because the Seat has a relatively small battery.

Full electric cars have a 'fuel' cost of around 25% of a diesel.

Not sure where a hybrid stands.

I also wonder about servicing, having both petrol and electric systems to look after is likely to add to the cost.

@Archie_tect won't have had his car serviced yet, but he may be able to assist with the other queries.
 

mustang1

Guru
Location
London, UK
Don't give them ideas, I can see the next sales pitch.....

'Our new aero frame will improve range of your electric car by 2 miles at 100mph for 100 miles when going into a head wind compared to last year, that will be £15K please'
Or or or... better still, increase the capacity of your tesla by having riders on the bikes on the roofrack while you're driving at 100mph for 100 miles. How many can you fit up there, 3 or 4 I reckon. Say, do you use those suction cup roof rack thingies? ^_^
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Don't give them ideas, I can see the next sales pitch.....

'Our new aero frame will improve range of your electric car by 2 miles at 100mph for 100 miles when going into a head wind compared to last year, that will be £15K please'

Don't put 4 big trail bikes on your roof. Range halves ! :laugh:
 

Archie_tect

De Skieven Architek... aka Penfold + Horace
Location
Northumberland
I had a squire at one of these online, not least because it might suit my motoring rather well.

The 'electric premium' is not as much as in some other cases - a comparable nearly new diesel auto Focus estate is about £18k-£19k.

That may be because the Seat has a relatively small battery.

Full electric cars have a 'fuel' cost of around 25% of a diesel.

Not sure where a hybrid stands.

I also wonder about servicing, having both petrol and electric systems to look after is likely to add to the cost.

@Archie_tect won't have had his car serviced yet, but he may be able to assist with the other queries.
Within 35 miles of home we don't use any petrol at all which is the same across the whole VAG hybrid range [Audi is slightly lower at 29 for some reason] - we are still ridiculously happy about- it costs £1.80 including VAT to recharge the battery to 100% overnight, so only long runs will see any significant petrol use on motorways where it should be doing around 55-60mpg anyway on ECO mode when the engine cuts out coasting or going downhill when it also recharges the battery- offset by the electric motor cutting in in queues.

Having set up SEAST Connect the car will assess satnav journeys to save electric mode for when we start moving, hit hold-ups and in town centres. Averaged 108mpg combined so far including the run back from Oldham so as the local ECO miles build up that will significantly increase. The diesel car averaged 62mpg combined over the 3 years we had it, but our children said I did become a bit of an mpg trip computer obsessive!

Happy so far- we could take out a servicing plan for 2 services for £500+VAT [which I can claim back anyway], and given that they still make a decent profit on their plans to cover any and all situations, I expect servicing will be similar if not cheaper than the diesel overall. I probably won't take out a plan as it only needs an oil change after 10000 miles or a year whichever comes first, and then a service when the car ECU says it needs one- our last diesel only needed one service in 3 years at 23000 miles.

The hybrid was around £3000 more than an equivalent 1.5l TSI petrol Leon ST and £2000 more than a 2.0l diesel... but it was the only hybrid ST in the UK! It should work out £1000 a year cheaper to run if we start to do a similar mileage out of lockdown, and considerably cheaper if we don't!

The review of the Kia e-Niro concluded it was a fantastic car but they are £36000 which is silly money still- that put us off full electric- hoping that next time the R+D on battery manufacture, cost and range together with the fall in prices of full electric will make them a no-brainer choice within five years.
 
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I think the niro does have a fairly big battery. If you don't do long journeys much a smaller battery car would be a cheaper bet.

You can get a 2 year old leaf for 18k or so.
 
OP
OP
TheDoctor

TheDoctor

Europe Endless
Moderator
Location
The TerrorVortex
Now widened our scope to look at a Hyundai Ionic too. The full EV version.
We've had Hyundais before and liked them.
 

DRM

Guru
Location
West Yorks
Depends what you call "very far". Cybertruck will get you 500 miles. Possibly more with solar on board. The others between 300-400 miles.
I doubt you would get any useful range at all towing an unaerodynamic , 1.7-1.8 tonne twin axle caravan, it’s just not feasible
 

DRM

Guru
Location
West Yorks
Electric cars are not the silver bullet that we need.
It would be more environmentally friendly to just run our existing cars into the ground and then recycle the components, electric vehicles are ok for shorter journeys, but long regular business trips, forget it, you won't get any work done as you'll waste more time stopping to recharge the thing than working.
 
It would be more environmentally friendly to just run our existing cars into the ground and then recycle the components, electric vehicles are ok for shorter journeys, but long regular business trips, forget it, you won't get any work done as you'll waste more time stopping to recharge the thing than working.

The average car does 8700 miles a year. So the average person would need to charge a couple of times a week.


If you are a sales rep get a Tesla or similar and you can make your phonecalls and catch up on email as you charge.

It's true that they won't solve congestion. Walking, cycling and public transport should be our first choices.
 

DRM

Guru
Location
West Yorks
The average car does 8700 miles a year. So the average person would need to charge a couple of times a week.


If you are a sales rep get a Tesla or similar and you can make your phonecalls and catch up on email as you charge.

It's true that they won't solve congestion. Walking, cycling and public transport should be our first choices.
That's not what my work van has done, it's on 11,500 since coming back from new year, I don't think leasing firms would take too kindly to carrying old engine oil and toolboxes in a Tesla, never mind replacing the battery early, the list price is ridiculous too, I reckon I could kill an EV in under 5 years, the range for my job will be hopeless.
 

icowden

Veteran
Location
Surrey
I don't think leasing firms would take too kindly to carrying old engine oil and toolboxes in a Tesla, ..., I reckon I could kill an EV in under 5 years, the range for my job will be hopeless.
Sounds like you need a CyberTruck
 
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