Olympic RR course

[Aravis]

Watching both races, I was genuinely fearful for the riders' lives. I've never felt like that before.

In some ways it brought back the world of 1960s and 70s motor racing, when the death of competitors in each event was very much on the cards. It can't be denied that this was exciting, but I never want to see it again.

Yesterday could have been a tragedy, all for the lack of someone stopping and giving immediate first aid.

It's very easy to imagine a consequence of that fall which would have made first aid irrelevant.

 

[iandg]

They did the lap 3 times and there were 63 finisher

Probably without those deep gutters & foot high rock kerbs (backed with rocks into which the unfortunate will be flung by a crash).

Take a look at a video of the descent - there are high walls, low walls, barriers, fences, big drops at the side of the road, wheelie bins, gutters and in places poor road surfaces.

We want to watch these guys drop like bats out of hell off mountain cols in the major tours (where riders have killed themselves) and in classics such as Paris Roubaix, Strade Bianche, Tour of Flanders (usually a good head count of crashes) - but when 4 big names crash in an Olympic RR (in which there were 63 finishers who made the descent 3x each) it's all suddenly too dangerous.

 

[brommers]

Watching both races, I was genuinely fearful for the riders' lives. I've never felt like that before.

Was it the Giro or Dauphiné? where they were hurtling downhill round a bend and straight on to a bridge. Even the commentator was wincing. I was sure someone would go over the top.

 

[brommers]

guys drop like bats out of hell off mountain cols in the major tours (where riders have killed themselves

I normally go and make a cup of coffee when these mountainside descents are on and come back in hoping not to hear any bad news.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

We want to watch these guys drop like bats out of hell off mountain cols in the major tours (where riders have killed themselves) and in classics such as Paris Roubaix, Strade Bianche, Tour of Flanders (usually a good head count of crashes) - but when 4 big names crash in an Olympic RR (in which there were 63 finishers who made the descent 3x each) it's all suddenly too dangerous.

Actually, it is different. You have people racing who don't normally race in these groupings (and some who don't usually ride at this level), no race radio and local course designers who are not the people involved in World Tour or even Pro-Continental racing. In the men's race in particular, the race was also unusally long - only MSR is longer, and people have frequently complained about the conditions in that race - and coupled with the heat, fatigue is going to make a steep, technical descent at that stage of the race more dangerous than even suggested by its phsical characteristics. It's not just that people can crash, it's whether crashes are likely in particular places and what can be done to mitigate that risk, and what might happen if (when) crashes occur and at those places where it is likely and mitigate the risk of serious injury. There should have been, at the least large and visible protective barriers on the edges of those narrow roads, that would have served both to warn as well as to protect.

 

[iandg]

Actually, it is different. You have people racing who don't normally race in these groupings (and some who don't usually ride at this level), no race radio and local course designers who are not the people involved in World Tour or even Pro-Continental racing. In the men's race in particular, the race was also unusally long - only MSR is longer, and people have frequently complained about the conditions in that race - and coupled with the heat, fatigue is going to make a steep, technical descent at that stage of the race more dangerous than even suggested by its phsical characteristics. It's not just that people can crash, it's whether crashes are likely in particular places and what can be done to mitigate that risk, and what might happen if (when) crashes occur and at those places where it is likely and mitigate the risk of serious injury. There should have been, at the least large and visible protective barriers on the edges of those narrow roads, that would have served both to warn as well as to protect.

Olympic RR unusually long and only MSR longer?

The Olympic RR was 237.5km

Tour of Flanders 255km

Paris Roubaix 257.5km

The longest stage of the Tour de France 237.5km

The riders not used to riding at that level were no where near when the selection/crashes happened.

There was a big net that stopped Porte being catapulted into oblivion and yes I agree there probably should have been more 'warning' equipment on the descent but where is there evidence of this in continental classics or in the big Tours?

 

[Guyincognito76]

As most of the crashes happened on the final decent, and amongst the leaders, then we can only conclude that it was fatigued riders riding on, or beyond, the limit. I'm sure a 20km flat finish would have limited the danger. A longer flat finish would've suited the sprinters rather than the breakaways that made the actual racing so exciting though.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

The riders not used to riding at that level were no where near when the selection/crashes happened.

That's simply hindsight. It's not how you decide safety issues.

There was a big net that stopped Porte being catapulted into oblivion and yes I agree there probably should have been more 'warning' equipment

That's really all that needs to be said.

And there has been a lot of discussion of rider safety recently in races. Have you not been paying attention the last two seasons? I even started a thread about it here: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/rider-safety-time-to-act.177799/

 

[iandg]

That's simply hindsight. It's not how you decide safety issues.



That's really all that needs to be said.

And there has been a lot of discussion of rider safety recently in races. Have you not been paying attention the last two seasons? I even started a thread about it here: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/rider-safety-time-to-act.177799/

You're right, I haven't been paying attention over the last few years. I had no knowledge of posts at the side of the road with bollards on the top but I am aware of the issues with following vehicles and fans on cols at the TdF. I've also seen the stupid risks that riders take such as passing closed barriers at level crossings during Paris Roubaix. I have no satellite, buy no magazines and only catch up with the odd classic via streaming or race report o Cyclingnews. I admit to only watched about 4 stages of the tour as well, but how's that relevant to the race that's being discussed that I have watched?

I do however, know what it's like to be in race winning position (albeit some years ago and in amateur racing) and have some idea how caution to the wind is blown away and any care for personal safety can bypass the brain when you're pushing yourself in that situation.

As mentioned in many places the crashes were amongst leaders in the closing stages - and these were big names such as Nibali who's known for kamikazee attitude to descending - and the injuries were generally 'normal' cycling crash fractures that could happen during a crash on straight roads with smooth tarmac.

Edit: Past experience doesn't make me an expert of course, but it does mean I can have a point of view and express it.

 

[iandg]

Oh.... I also know what it feels like to hit a 12" high wall/perimeter fence at 35+mph when you lose concentration whilst sitting behind a derny on Halesowen track

 

[mjr]

The Olympic RR was 237.5km

Tour of Flanders 255km

Paris Roubaix 257.5km

The longest stage of the Tour de France 237.5km

Ahh, so you think all those long, tricky, hazardous descents from the mountains of Flanders, northern France and the southern bank of the Loire will have prepared them for a difficult potentially-race-winning descent after that sort of distance, eh?

There was a big net that stopped Porte being catapulted into oblivion and yes I agree there probably should have been more 'warning' equipment on the descent but where is there evidence of this in continental classics or in the big Tours?

There was a big net, but it wasn't actually sufficient to stop Porte, who broke his shoulder by hitting a tree through it! (edit: so says Porte) Even the "warning" equipment looked dangerous to me, with big unprotected poles holding the nets up.

 

[iandg]

Ahh, so you think all those long, tricky, hazardous descents from the mountains of Flanders, northern France and the southern bank of the Loire will have prepared them for a difficult potentially-race-winning descent after that sort of distance, eh?

No I don't, I was replying to a quote from FM above that stated only Milan-San Remo was longer than the Olympic RR - the original post edited so that you can see it in context

But the likes of Nibali, Henao, Thomas and Porte (all professional riders) coming from the Tour should be properly prepared don't you think?

 

[User169]

I don't think Mr Cookson gets involved at a detail level like course design - that would be like suggesting the BC president is responsible for every aspect of organisation of every championship. I do think that UCI need to be asking some very hard questions of their road commission though. Which of course might come from the president via the management chain. Then, what do I know? Just happy that I never faced a plain dangerous descent as bad as that, ever.

UCI still defending the parcours.

 

[smutchin]

And there has been a lot of discussion of rider safety recently in races. Have you not been paying attention the last two seasons? I even started a thread about it here: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/rider-safety-time-to-act.177799/

Funnily enough, I was thinking about the Stetina crash earlier as an example that showed how dodgy routes aren't the exclusive preserve of backwards South Americans.

And lest we forget, it was ruddy great sharp-edged lumps of concrete lining the side of the road in the world's biggest bike race that did for Fabio Casartelli.

 

[iandg]

Funnily enough, I was thinking about the Stetina crash earlier as an example that showed how dodgy routes aren't the exclusive preserve of backwards South Americans.

And lest we forget, it was ruddy great sharp-edged lumps of concrete lining the side of the road in the world's biggest bike race that did for Fabio Casartelli.

...and the Col de Port d'Aspet has been used 13 times since (but not necessarily in the same direction).