PlanetX - calls in the administrators

[Spiderweb]

Looks as though the future of Planet X is secure with sale agreed.
https://road.cc/content/news/future-planet-x-secured-cycling-retailer-sold-301801

 

[bonzobanana]

But that's part of my point. 3 of 5 most unreliable cars have a failure rate of below 3% - meaning 97% of cars made by those unrealible manufacturers don't have engine failures.
Figures from the article you quoted.

That's on a yearly basis I think not the full lifetime of the vehicle. It's data derived from warranty direct's yearly warranties. So you would have to know the lifespan of the vehicle I guess and times it by that many years to get the real figures. So a 3% yearly failure rate would be 21% over 7 years or just over 1 in 5. That's why a significant chunk of these type of cars don't last. Honda with their 1 in 344 engine failure means over lets say 12 years of their lifespan only one in 29 cars has engine failure despite being used for much longer. Warranty direct wouldn't know the full lifespan of a vehicle of course they just warranty per year you have to extrapolate from their data.

 

[Jameshow]

I wouldn't call those premium. Small basic cars tend to be more reliable. The cars with poor reliability tend to be more complicated. Lots of options added, complicated engines and automatic gearboxes, lots of electronics. A typical £40-50k German rep mobile is quite unreliable and makes sense to lease to avoid big surprises. They are also the most likely to have engine and transmission failures which sometimes can make a car uneconomic to repair. There's an old report below but if anything things have got worse as emission standards keep getting stricter so meeting those emission standards has become more difficult. The Bosch dieselgate situation is perhaps a indicator of how much pressure manufacturers are under to meet difficult emission's standards. I believe 3 cylinder engines in smaller cars have reduced their reliability somewhat compared to 4 cylinder engines. They typically would have a turbo too that adds to the complexity. So long term reliability is compromised. As we become a much poorer country people are keeping cars longer or buying cheaper older cars but some new cars are not lasting that long these again tend to be the more complicated designs which become uneconomic to repair. No one wants to spend £4k repairing a car only worth £3k. On the old warranty direct site you had some cars that cost on average £200 to repair and others over £2k and that is just the average and the cars with £2k plus repairs often had a much greater frequency of faults too which was even more painful.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-news/62383/german-cars-among-worst-engine-failures

https://web.archive.org/web/20210430103028/https://www.reliabilityindex.com/manufacturer

Agreed 3 cylinders must be less smooth and therefore less reliable than a 4 and esp a 6....

 

[kingrollo]

That's on a yearly basis I think not the full lifetime of the vehicle. It's data derived from warranty direct's yearly warranties. So you would have to know the lifespan of the vehicle I guess and times it by that many years to get the real figures. So a 3% yearly failure rate would be 21% over 7 years or just over 1 in 5. That's why a significant chunk of these type of cars don't last. Honda with their 1 in 344 engine failure means over lets say 12 years of their lifespan only one in 29 cars has engine failure despite being used for much longer. Warranty direct wouldn't know the full lifespan of a vehicle of course they just warranty per year you have to extrapolate from their data.

Depends on how much you want to dig into the stats. And of course that's the worse case scenario buying the most unreliable cars.

I couldn't find where it said the 3% relates to failures in the first year of ownership?

Imo totting the % like you have gives an overly gloomy stat -the first year for example example maybe factory faults -those that don't have the fault may gone to be fine in years 3,4 and 5...

A bit like computer drives -if they don't fail in the first year then generally run for ever.

 

[figbat]

Agreed 3 cylinders must be less smooth and therefore less reliable than a 4 and esp a 6....

Why would 3 cylinders automatically be less reliable? Various vibrations can be countered with balancer shafts and damping (4-cylinder engines are not naturally balanced either), and there will be fewer moving parts in terms of pistons, valves, conrods etc.

 

[Cycleops]

What has unreliable cars got to do with Planet X?

 

[biggs682]

What has unreliable cars got to do with Planet X?

Who knows this is cycle chat

 

[bonzobanana]

Depends on how much you want to dig into the stats. And of course that's the worse case scenario buying the most unreliable cars.

I couldn't find where it said the 3% relates to failures in the first year of ownership?

Imo totting the % like you have gives an overly gloomy stat -the first year for example example maybe factory faults -those that don't have the fault may gone to be fine in years 3,4 and 5...

A bit like computer drives -if they don't fail in the first year then generally run for ever.

Warranty direct wouldn't ever be first year of ownership. That would be the manufacturer's own warranty. Their data is from after the manufacturer's warranty when someone has bought their yearly warranty.

 

[bonzobanana]

Why would 3 cylinders automatically be less reliable? Various vibrations can be countered with balancer shafts and damping (4-cylinder engines are not naturally balanced either), and there will be fewer moving parts in terms of pistons, valves, conrods etc.

I think its because they are worked hard to create similar output to a 4 cylinder engine so are typically at higher revs with a turbo. They benefit from being a lighter engine. The Dacia Jogger is a large car with a 1000cc 3 cylinder engine with Turbo.

 

[Jameshow]

Why would 3 cylinders automatically be less reliable? Various vibrations can be countered with balancer shafts and damping (4-cylinder engines are not naturally balanced either), and there will be fewer moving parts in terms of pistons, valves, conrods etc.

2 up one down isn't balanced to me!!

 

[FishFright]

2 up one down isn't balanced to me!!

Which is why they use a balance shaft.
Which was invented in 1907 ...

 

[Jody]

I think its because they are worked hard to create similar output to a 4 cylinder engine so are typically at higher revs with a turbo.

Turbos are added for low down torque which aids fuel economy as you don't need to rev the engine too hard

 

[Deleted member 1258]

What has unreliable cars got to do with Planet X?

Exactly, we've wandered a bit off topic.

 

[rogerzilla]

Which is why they use a balance shaft.
Which was invented in 1907 ...

Except most production 3-cyl engines don't use a balance shaft, because they're expensive, heavy, and sap some power. VW just ignore the vibrations (I test drove a Citigo and it was like a coffee grinder) and Ford use an unbalanced flywheel to (sort of) compensate.

3-cyl engines have perfect secondary balance but a terrible rocking couple, which is one form of primary imbalance.

4-cyl engines also benefit from (two, smaller) balance shafts because they have poor secondary balance, but this only becomes an issue above 2 litres. For instance, Mazda use balance shafts on the 2.5 litre SkyActiv engine but not on the 2.0.

The only common engines that are perfectly balanced are the straight six, V12, and some types of V8.

 

[BrumJim]

Flat 6?