Planning! Every last detail or not?

[HobbesOnTour]

I enjoy getting a bit 'lost'.

Sometimes that's the most fun! So long as you're not rushing for a train, plane or boat!

i love marmite

To see it all on google earth first, sounds like opening your christmas presents before the day.

That's a great way of putting it!

So long as you've got a reasonable map, a tent, and sleeping and cooking kit, food for a couple of days, then the open road is yours go with the prevailing wind - or mood.

That's very true. But there's a lot of people who would baulk at the weight. It's all horses for courses.
But, I would like to hear from those who travel without the extra gear, for example cooking kit & food and do they feel that they are losing out on opportunities?

Work and home life is overscheduled enough, with 'to do' lists , and goals , and targets to be achieved - why make your holidays like that?

I think we're in danger of turning our recreational time into a competitive list of tasks to tick off, peaks to be climbed, kms to be munched.

That's very true. I'd say that cycle touring gave me the time and space to reassess my life and remove some of the unnecessary stresses.

So many serendipitous 'Very good luck' when travelling stories as would fill a book - but most of it comes down to the fact that the majority of humans are helpful, and friendly enough, if you approach them with an open and pleasant attitude.

Again, very true and backed up by my own experience.

Prior planning and preparation prevents pith poor performance.

I'd be a firm believer in the "Fail to prepare, prepare to fail" school of thought. The question though is in the degree of preparation. Then following on from that, how easy is it for someone to drop a plan when circumstances change or different opportunities present themselves. I wonder does being a slave to a plan reduces the mentality to take advantage of serendipity.

I know someone who thought he'd covered everything for his family's first, and only, cycling trip. The one thing he failed to plan for was the unseasonal rain. Just shy of three inches in less than an hour.

They were soaked, bikes were ditched & car hired for the rest of their trip.

If the rain was only for the first day would that be backing up the idea that the very prepared find it difficult to deal with enforced change in a plan? Of course, if the rain was going to be constant day after day, then a car was a wise choice.
I met 2 Germans on their first day of the Camino de Santiago. It was a little after lunch time and the rain had been pouring down for a few hours. They were waiting for a taxi/bus to pick them up and their bikes to bring them to Pamplona. From there they were going by train to Santiago and then home. On their first day! And they were surprised that I was continuing on.

* joining Horlicks, Ovaltine and Farley's Rusks on the "prohibited items" list!

Wonder what the fine would be.

My panniers are full enough without adding else!

Anything you absolutely want to do without fail, if humanly possibly, you should plan for.

If nothing is set in stone, you'd quite like to see this or do that but it won't be a lifelong regret if you miss it entirely, then take it day by day.

Set your objective and plan backwards from that, not the other way around.

That's almost militaristic in its approach. And it makes sense. But the fact remains that travelling by bike, especially if camping is open to a lot of outside influences that can't be planned for. How does one react if their goal is removed due to a factor outside of our control? And there is also the question of opportunities that pop up along the way that might be more enjoyable than the original goal? Does the fact that so much planning went into the original goal make it more difficult to drop it?

My number one objective when I go off on my bike is to enjoy myself. I have places I'd like to visit/see but each day it's a case of weighing up what's on offer.
I think it's important to appreciate where I am, right now. I've met more than a few people who are so busy rushing off to the next place on their route that they don't seem to appreciate the current place on their route.
I'm not saying it's wrong - it's just at odds with my way of thinking. And I wonder if the level and detail of planning plays a part in that?

 

[snorri]

Set your objective and plan backwards from that, not the other way around.

Setting the objective sounds rather onerous, unless your objective is simply to enjoy the tour?

 

[Blue Hills]

An intention of mine to explore Cornwall and Devon after taking the train to Penzance ended in John O' Groats after a chance encounter with a cyclist in Cornwall .

First thought: wonderful/heroic improvisation.

Second rather worrying thought - you decided to stalk this other cyclist for reasons unknown.

 

[Blue Hills]

Thanks to not planning too much/bad planning I have rediscovered my inter-railing youth experience that you will always find somewhere to sleep.

 

[Drago]

Setting the objective sounds rather onerous, unless your objective is simply to enjoy the tour?

That very zen!

 

[snorri]

First thought: wonderful/heroic improvisation.
Second rather worrying thought - you decided to stalk this other cyclist for reasons unknown.

No stalking, he was still "in training" when we met but he headed north a few weeks after me and completed the course. We spoke on the phone later and he had found it quite challenging mainly due to having to meet up with local dignitaries along the way who presented him with money for the charity he was supporting.
He was accompanied by a mobile home and transported to and from these presentations (too much planning) when he would have preferred to be resting after a day of cycling.

 

[Edwardoka]

It depends, if there are other people involved a plan is often necessary to get them on board and show that you've done due diligence. Conversely you lose some of the flexibility and it takes some convincing to get people to agree to deviate from the route in the event of new information.

On my own European tour I had some concrete long term objectives but short-term the extent of my planning would often be "what's the next big town and how far is it"
Touring is best when you see a road and say "I wonder what's up there" and indulge yourself without time pressure, although the standout day for me was a combination of planned and unscripted; I booked into a hotel for a rest day in Girona (with a cut-off time for check-in), and I got routed along a scarcely traversible trail through the gorgeous Guilleries-Savassona nature preserve - a place I'd never have visited without the time limit ruling out the longer routes. Challenging and alarming at the time but man, what an adventure.

 

[mjr]

Now that makes a lot of sense. Obviously one or two cyclists is a far different proposition than a group of 10 or more. And as for unplanned changes (such as the broken down ferry) I'm presuming that there's a certain calmness that comes from being part of a group? Not something that may be as comfortable for a solo or duo travellers

Not sure about the calmness coming from being a group. It was pretty calm, like it usually is. We just deal with stuff that sends us off plan. I admit, for the bit of this year's tour that is tricky/fragile, I do have plans B, C and D drafted as far as GPX files because we've had at least twice as many ideas for that bit that probably won't work and leave some or all of us stranded.

 

[mjr]

To see it all on google earth first, sounds like opening your christmas presents before the day.

Nah, it's pretty bad for touring. It can help you see the exit from a train station so you set off in the right direction, but images of many of the roads you'll want to ride on are 5-10 years old and many cycleways and most of Germany isn't there at all.

 

[classic33]

If the rain was only for the first day would that be backing up the idea that the very prepared find it difficult to deal with enforced change in a plan? Of course, if the rain was going to be constant day after day, then a car was a wise choice.
I met 2 Germans on their first day of the Camino de Santiago. It was a little after lunch time and the rain had been pouring down for a few hours. They were waiting for a taxi/bus to pick them up and their bikes to bring them to Pamplona. From there they were going by train to Santiago and then home. On their first day! And they were surprised that I was continuing on.

My panniers are full enough without adding else!



That's almost militaristic in its approach. And it makes sense. But the fact remains that travelling by bike, especially if camping is open to a lot of outside influences that can't be planned for. How does one react if their goal is removed due to a factor outside of our control? And there is also the question of opportunities that pop up along the way that might be more enjoyable than the original goal? Does the fact that so much planning went into the original goal make it more difficult to drop it?

My number one objective when I go off on my bike is to enjoy myself. I have places I'd like to visit/see but each day it's a case of weighing up what's on offer.
I think it's important to appreciate where I am, right now. I've met more than a few people who are so busy rushing off to the next place on their route that they don't seem to appreciate the current place on their route.
I'm not saying it's wrong - it's just at odds with my way of thinking. And I wonder if the level and detail of planning plays a part in that?

The rain was falling for just under an hour. They could have stopped, but this would have thrown out the carefully planned timetable.

Villages/towns they passed through all had a scheduled time. No allowance for nature having a laugh. Which given they'd planned on travelling on back country lanes, at the height of summer, was overplanning.

The amount of time in the saddle was based on riding an unladen bike locallly first. Not the best way of working the timing out.

The rain was the last straw, in an afternoon when they'd multiple holdups on-route. Five people decided that cycling wasn't for them, and ditched the bikes.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I spent 19 months touring the world.

I landed in South America with a 1:4,000,000 scale map and 4.5 months for that leg. I would decide which direction and roughly how long I wanted to travel. Head down the bus station and find a bus going the right direction. Get off in interesting terrain or looking places.

I ended up entering Paraguay after seeing a sign for the country when on a bus in Argentina. I was the only Gringo on the bus and border guards had me get off and find out why I was at their border. After a chat they stamped my passport and let me in. I visited the Jesuits ruins and had locals (who passed round a "herbal" drink ) on the buses I was on invite me into their houses when I found nowhere to stay where I got off. I got a lift with gun runners into Brazil. I sneaked over the border whilst customs dealt with the gun runners. This caused a problem exiting Brazil so I had to return to where I had entered explain myself, get an entry stamp then make a dash to the other border I wanted to exit at. I made it to the southern tip and managed to get a lift on a supply ship to Antarctica. I also found myself near one of the big telescopes up high in the Andes and was able to gaze at close up of Saturns rings. No cost as the person I was staying with worked there.

So you can certainly have adventure if you are flexible. But if I am touring in the Lakes in summer and not camping, then I will want my accommodation booked.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Google Earth, and, streetview are terrible things for Georgraphy nerds.

I'm currently streetviewing possible rides in Japan, just because I enjoy it and it's the dead of winter and I'm fed up with not being able to ride a bike. I'm finding some fantastic places well off the tourist trails that we can explore.

The knowledge that I'm hopefully taking the Elder son with me and I don't want him disappointed by getting hopelessly lost on the first day is also a factor, partly because one peculiarity in Japan is an almost complete lack of street signs.

I have a similar habit in Germany although here streetview is far more limited so I have to restrict myself to endlessly looking at satellite views. I find it helps me find interesting things I wouldn't otherwise know about, which become the focus/destination/motivation for the ride. If I don't have a destination I feel like I'm riding aimlessly and don't really get anywhere. This year I've got a few places in mind, a castle no-one has heard of, a couple of old towns hidden away in the hills, and a few railway stations with a distinctive type of station building I want to make a model of.

Told you I was a nerd. I would have probably missed all of these if I hadn't found them online.

On the other hand, my reaction to any festivals I accidentally come across is to run/ride away as fast as I can...

 

[Milkfloat]

For those of you wanting more streetview style data in Germany then try the crowdsourced www.mapillary.com. I don’t use it and streetview to plan entire tours, but I do use it to have a tiny peek at routes where the desire would be massive. Most of the time I don’t even look at the actual image, I just confirm that a vehicle of some sort has been along the sticky part of the route.

Myself, I like a small bit of planning, mainly to make sure I am not missing out on fun things along the way. In my early days of touring I rode past so many great things that I could have done without knowing they existed.

 

[mudsticks]

Having said I don't plan so much, I think I will be doing a bit more for Northern Spain, particularly brushing up my Spanish so I can understand any helpful advice.

Plus their maps are a ittle less straightforward than OS, and it may be useful to see the kind of road surfaces, and gradients I'm committing to.

 

[mudsticks]

I spent 19 months touring the world.

I landed in South America with a 1:4,000,000 scale map and 4.5 months for that leg. I would decide which direction and roughly how long I wanted to travel. Head down the bus station and find a bus going the right direction. Get off in interesting terrain or looking places.

I ended up entering Paraguay after seeing a sign for the country when on a bus in Argentina. I was the only Gringo on the bus and border guards had me get off and find out why I was at their border. After a chat they stamped my passport and let me in. I visited the Jesuits ruins and had locals (who passed round a "herbal" drink ) on the buses I was on invite me into their houses when I found nowhere to stay where I got off. I got a lift with gun runners into Brazil. I sneaked over the border whilst customs dealt with the gun runners. This caused a problem exiting Brazil so I had to return to where I had entered explain myself, get an entry stamp then make a dash to the other border I wanted to exit at. I made it to the southern tip and managed to get a lift on a supply ship to Antarctica. I also found myself near one of the big telescopes up high in the Andes and was able to gaze at close up of Saturns rings. No cost as the person I was staying with worked there.

So you can certainly have adventure if you are flexible. But if I am touring in the Lakes in summer and not camping, then I will want my accommodation booked.

That sounds great, with a sprinkling of scarey bits, I dream of having that much time and freedom to b*gger off on my bike - one day maybe..