Red Arrows to Fly Foreign Built / Designed Aircraft?
- Thread starter Illaveago
- Start date
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OP
OP
Illaveago
Guru
- Location
- Chippenham,Wiltshire.
It looks like BAE are going for the Boeing Saab option. What a sell out by BAE management! They will just assemble parts made elsewhere. So what does this country get out of it? 
DaveReading
Don't suffer fools gladly (must try harder!)
- Location
- Reading, obvs
The Leonardo 346 is still in the race, too, although the T-7 seems to be the favourite. There's no way it's going to be a British designed/built aircraft as, given the timescale, only existing programmes are being considered rather than anything that exists only on paper.It looks like BAE are going for the Boeing Saab option. What a sell out by BAE management! They will just assemble parts made elsewhere. So what does this country get out of it?
Jameshow
Guru
It looks like BAE are going for the Boeing Saab option. What a sell out by BAE management! They will just assemble parts made elsewhere. So what does this country get out of it?
If BAE designed the hawk why in the world were they not designing the replacement a decade ago.
It's like VW saying sorry folks we forgot to design the new golf your just going to have to buy another brand of car. Corporate suicide imho.
Surely when you sell a plane to a customer you build in a slice of R+D.
You buy a apple phone and a percentage of that price is future phone design....
OP
OP
Illaveago
Guru
- Location
- Chippenham,Wiltshire.
Yes! It seems more like a management admission that they are hopeless and can only assemble things in future.
OP
OP
Illaveago
Guru
- Location
- Chippenham,Wiltshire.
It seems as though management have been trained to scrap things before replacements have been put in place. This happened years ago with coal fired power stations. They announced that the stations had been fazed out ahead of schedule only to say later that we lacked generating capacity.
I think that the Hawk training aircraft have or will soon be fazed out just leaving the Red Arrows. Just plain stupid!
I think that the Hawk training aircraft have or will soon be fazed out just leaving the Red Arrows. Just plain stupid!
DaveReading
Don't suffer fools gladly (must try harder!)
- Location
- Reading, obvs
Pretty well all major new aircraft programmes nowadays, both civil and military, are multi-national.
BAE doesn't have the resources to launch a new trainer on its own, and there aren't any immediately obvious partner candidates out there.
figbat
Former slippery scientist
- Location
- South Oxfordshire, UK
Because military aircraft manufacturers don’t just build aircraft and assume someone will buy them. They are usually designed and built to meet a specific brief or requirement, often in competition with other manufacturers. The selected aircraft gets built, the losers don’t. There’s no guarantee that the incumbent supplier will get the contract for its replacement. Nor that they will even pitch for it.
Jameshow
Guru
Sirb
Airbus?
If they can design the A400m then the hawk isn't too big a job. Every sovereign nation needs a fast jet trainer?
Make it a little more powerful and it becomes a light attack craft for developing nations too.
Airbus?
If they can design the A400m then the hawk isn't too big a job. Every sovereign nation needs a fast jet trainer?
Make it a little more powerful and it becomes a light attack craft for developing nations too.
Jameshow
Guru
Surely they know the brief... They know the aircraft being trained for - Typhoon / f35 and therefore they can work back the design parameters from there.
DaveReading
Don't suffer fools gladly (must try harder!)
- Location
- Reading, obvs
That's already a very crowded market, which Airbus have presumably decided to stay out of.
OP
OP
Illaveago
Guru
- Location
- Chippenham,Wiltshire.
The Americans had a modified and upgraded Hawk, the Goshawk so I would have thought it possible to upgrade the Hawk. There must be a market out there as you say for a fast jet trainer. Boing and Saab are looking for customers as well as Leonardo. Securing a deal with the RAF would be a very good advertisement for them.
figbat
Former slippery scientist
- Location
- South Oxfordshire, UK
That’s naive logic. Just because Airbus can build large aircraft for civilian and military use doesn’t mean they can do a small fighter trainer. I’m not saying they can’t, but to assume they can because they can do the A400M is a bit of a stretch.
mickle
innit
- Location
- 53.933606, -1.076131
The world, and warfare, has profoundly changed since the Red Arrows were founded. No more so than in the last three years of Ukraine conflict.
Replace them with drones.
Replace them with drones.
Ian H
Ancient randonneur
It looks like BAE are going for the Boeing Saab option. What a sell out by BAE management! They will just assemble parts made elsewhere. So what does this country get out of it?
Coloured smoke, same as before.
