Secondhand Raleigh Junior Rigid MTB: lemon or worth a punt?

[Reynard]

Could just use a bit of advice / reassurance to make sure I'm not potentially ending up with a lemon...

Local recycling place has a Raleigh Max 24 junior MTB up for grabs for a pony. Seems to be a smaller version of the adult bike as far as I can tell. I think it's my size (or at least in the ballpark) and am of a mind that with a little tweaking, it'll make a nice knockaround / bad weather / crappy road condition / go anywhere bike. To be honest, I'm really in the market for a hardtail frame and forks as a project, but right now that's not an option thanks to the current situation. This would be (if things go to plan) a reasonable stopgap in the meantime.

Spec is as follows, as best I can tell:

15 inch frame, 24 inch wheels (I'm 4ft 11 btw)
15 speed (3x5)
Twist shifters
Centre pull brakes

I'd guess the bike to be about 15 to 20 years old, maybe a bit older. It doesn't look *too* shabby.

Maybe some of you who are familiar with Raleigh bikes could give me a bit of a heads up? @SkipdiverJohn ? @Gunk ?

Other than basic fettling, the eventual plan is to upgrade the drivetrain a bit, fit trigger shifters, a more suitable saddle and pedals, ergon grips, mudguards etc. Although I don't want to buy the bike or put in any outlay for parts if it started out as a BSO. I don't think it is a BSO, but...

 

[DRM]

it doesn't look too shabby, I'd be tempted to get it, try it out & see what needs doing, if it's not for you, sell it on, I doubt you'd be out of pocket

 

[raleighnut]

^^^^^^ +1

I'd go for it

 

[Reynard]

Well, for better or for worse, I've reserved it.

I now have till Friday evening to make up my mind without worrying whether someone else will get to it first.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

From the appearance of the frame, I would say it is not a Nottingham fabricated one, so most likely made after 1999. I have several old Raleighs, albeit in much larger sizes than the one you are contemplating. Given it seems pretty tidy and is not silly money, I would take a chance. It may be basic, but it won't be a BSO.
Generally, my approach is to buy the sort of bike I'm after to begin with, and then not mess around with it apart from normal maintenance and tyre fitting etc. There's nothing inherently wrong with the 3 x 5 transmission, I've got a MTB from 1989 still running this set up. If in good condition I would not make any changes to it. Likewise if the gear shifters work as they should I would keep them until such time one fails before changing to anything else. Saddles are a personal thing and either you will be lucky with the saddle it comes with and it will be comfortable, or you don't get on with it and you might want to try something else.

 

[Reynard]

From the appearance of the frame, I would say it is not a Nottingham fabricated one, so most likely made after 1999. I have several old Raleighs, albeit in much larger sizes than the one you are contemplating. Given it seems pretty tidy and is not silly money, I would take a chance. It may be basic, but it won't be a BSO.
Generally, my approach is to buy the sort of bike I'm after to begin with, and then not mess around with it apart from normal maintenance and tyre fitting etc. There's nothing inherently wrong with the 3 x 5 transmission, I've got a MTB from 1989 still running this set up. If in good condition I would not make any changes to it. Likewise if the gear shifters work as they should I would keep them until such time one fails before changing to anything else. Saddles are a personal thing and either you will be lucky with the saddle it comes with and it will be comfortable, or you don't get on with it and you might want to try something else.

Ah, thanks for the heads up.

My problem is that I'm short, and at the budget that I have if I were buying new, I find myself in an awkward gap where the adult bikes are too big and most junior ones are too cramped and / or don't have gearing I'm comfortable with. And for a bike that will likely get the least mileage out of my little fleet, it's no point spending silly money. Hence the second hand route in the search for a donor frame and forks to build up a bike I'd be happy to ride.

I'm well sorted for road bike and hybrid, but not for "mucky" riding. Out here in the fens, things do get very mucky at sugar beet and potato lifting times, and, to quote a forum member who rode out my way last week, the roads in places are biblically bad...

There's nothing wrong with 3 x 5 gearing. It's not so much about upgrading the gearing, but getting comfortable gearing. I doubt I'd be able to get anything bigger than a 5 speed cassette / freewheel (am assuming it's the latter) on it anyway, maybe a 6 at a pinch... It's very flat out here, and I don't want to be spinning furiously and not really going anywhere...

Of course, assuming it fits, and assuming I'll buy it, I won't know until I ride the thing whether any changes are needed there - it's still all pretty hypothetical.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

There's nothing wrong with 3 x 5 gearing. It's not so much about upgrading the gearing, but getting comfortable gearing. I doubt I'd be able to get anything bigger than a 5 speed cassette / freewheel (am assuming it's the latter) on it anyway, maybe a 6 at a pinch... It's very flat out here, and I don't want to be spinning furiously and not really going anywhere...

I don't generally ever find myself wishing I had a higher top gear on any of my bikes, irrespective of the number of ratios I have to choose from.
My flat bar bikes are mostly 28/38/48 triples with 14-28T freewheels. That gives me a high gear of 93" on 27" road wheels and 89" on 26" MTB. If you had a 48T/14T combo on the Raleigh, you would have a high gear of 82" on a 24" wheel. That might be low by road bike standards, but on flat bars and MTB tyres, you don't have the same speed potential anyway. In reality, I very rarely actually use my highest available gear. The one that does tend to get used quite a bit is the highest but one, so on a 3 x 5 set up, I will often be riding a 48T/17T or 48T/16T combo on 26" MTB wheels, or a 48T/16T combo on a 700c hybrid which means ratios of 73", 78" and 81" respectively. In practice, I simply don't have much need for gears much more than about 80", when you factor in the aerodynamic drag of flat bar riding plus knobbly tyres when on an MTB.
If your potential Raleigh purchase was found to have a 24/34/42T triple then I agree it might be a bit low geared, but I'm sure it could be swapped for a triple with a higher tooth count at minimal cost and hassle. I'm sure it would be simpler than trying to alter the gearing at the back, given there won't be much choice of 5 speed freewheels.

 

[fossyant]

Go for it. My daughter is 17 and still rides her 24" wheeled MTB - we even lent it to my son's friend for an afternoon. My wife is 5.-4ish, but she has an XS suspension MTB - only just small enough to fit the 100mm dropper post, and she even has to lower the dropper to get on it due to suspension bikes being 'higher' when unweighted.

 

[Reynard]

Well, I'm heading off after lunch to have a poke and prod.

@SkipdiverJohn - the gearing on my roadie and hybrid are pretty well much bang on for my needs, but having tried out a number of junior mountain bikes over the last year or so, I've found that typically, they're pretty low geared compared to the other two. Fine if you live somewhere hilly, but I don't. I still have the 5 speed freewheel off my old MTB, which looks to have bigger sprockets than what's fitted to the Raleigh, (that bike was a 10-speed) so I can always swap it over, assuming the fittings are the same. Tinkering with the chainrings was always an option as well. Oh, and I plan on fitting some semi-slick tyres.

FWIW, my hybrid (26 inch wheels) runs 44-32-22 on the front and 11-34 on the back, and my roadie (650c wheels) runs 46-34 on the front and 11-30 on the back.

@fossyant - I rode a 24 inch wheel MTB (late 80s vintage) for many years. It was just a fraction too big though, with a horizontal top bar rather than compact frame. With inevitable (painful) consequences if I didn't plan junctions well in advance. Shame really, as it *rode* really nicely once I was up and running, even though it wasn't anything terribly special.

 

[Reynard]

Well, for better or for worse, N+1 is in the house...

The good bits: frame, forks and wheels are in good order, seat post and stem aren't stuck, there's only a few minor scuffs on the paint, it has eyes to take mudguards and it has bosses for a bottle cage.

The bad bits: tyres are completely perished, cable outers are cracked, the saddle and pedals are junk, the drivetrain looks worn and something's not quite right with the shifters. But seeing I was going to tinker with / swap out those bits anyway, it's no biggie.

The unexpected: it *is* a Nottingham-made bike. It has "Made in England to BS-can't-remember-the-number" and "Raleigh Nottingham" stickers on it plus the one from the bike shop that originally sold it.

Looks like it's been gathering dust and cobwebs in the back of someone's shed for years. Plan is to give it a good clean, put on one of my spare saddles and the tyres off my old Emmelle, take it for a spin and see where that takes me. Then I'll know what to tackle next.

 

[raleighnut]

Well, for better or for worse, N+1 is in the house...

The good bits: frame, forks and wheels are in good order, seat post and stem aren't stuck, there's only a few minor scuffs on the paint, it has eyes to take mudguards and it has bosses for a bottle cage.

The bad bits: tyres are completely perished, cable outers are cracked, the saddle and pedals are junk, the drivetrain looks worn and something's not quite right with the shifters. But seeing I was going to tinker with / swap out those bits anyway, it's no biggie.

The unexpected: it *is* a Nottingham-made bike. It has "Made in England to BS-can't-remember-the-number" and "Raleigh Nottingham" stickers on it plus the one from the bike shop that originally sold it.

Looks like it's been gathering dust and cobwebs in the back of someone's shed for years. Plan is to give it a good clean, put on one of my spare saddles and the tyres off my old Emmelle, take it for a spin and see where that takes me. Then I'll know what to tackle next.

There was always 'something wrong' with those cacky shifters even when the bike was new.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

The unexpected: it *is* a Nottingham-made bike. It has "Made in England to BS-can't-remember-the-number" and "Raleigh Nottingham" stickers on it plus the one from the bike shop that originally sold it.

Have you been able to identify the year it was made from the frame number? I own a 1999 Raleigh, one of the very last UK built frames, and your frame looks a lot different to mine, even allowing for the fact mine resembles a field gate in size and has a horizontal top tube.

 

[Reynard]

There was always 'something wrong' with those cacky shifters even when the bike was new.

The plan is to fit trigger shifters, assuming I can find some that will work with a 5 speed. Or maybe go back to friction thumb shifters.

 

[Reynard]

Have you been able to identify the year it was made from the frame number? I own a 1999 Raleigh, one of the very last UK built frames, and your frame looks a lot different to mine, even allowing for the fact mine resembles a field gate in size and has a horizontal top tube.

Not yet. I haven't made a note of the frame number. The bike is in my garage sitting out it's quarantine, but I'll have a look tomorrow. Though it's definitely pre-April 2000, as the sticker from the dealer has an 0181 phone number.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

Assuming the dealer didn't have a stock of out of date stickers to use up of course.....
I believe Raleigh got their knuckles rapped by Trading Standards over the use of the word "Nottingham" on their headbadges after they stopped full in-house manufacture and had to change the design.