StuAff
Silencing his legs regularly
- Location
- Portsmouth
FNRttC The Fridays tour 2014
- Thread starter mmmmartin
- Start date
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DooDah
Veteran
- Location
- France, now Northamptonshire
Fair enough, understood. June is a lottery in these parts, it can be pushing 40 degrees or low 20s and a lot of rain. Personally, I prefer the later for cycling. Bon courage.
Mice
Guru
StuAff
Silencing his legs regularly
- Location
- Portsmouth
OP
OP
mmmmartin
Random geezer
Not yet Stu, before I as co-ordinator of arrangements, not Leader, can ask you as my friends which dates you wish to go on, I need to talk to Our Friendly And Efficient Van Driver to confirm when he is free, and would like to chat about dates for the recce to Gordon, who I am seeing on Sunday week. But it may well be we will opt that the date will be in June and won't start on June 6 because that is the anniversary of D Day and I expect the ferries and hotels to be full and expensive then. Perhaps June 15, but there will be a need for you all to ccone to a collective decision on a definite date before October 22 because that is the day I go off to ride Madrid-Bordeaux and I am aware that peeps need to know by November for the purpose of holiday rotas.
On a matter of no importance to some but of great magnitude for others: obviously we are all chums on this trip and going as a group of friends and all decisions will be made as a group of friends, rather than as a group of sheep being led by a leader. So it is fortunate then, that we will all be members of the CTC and have its third party liability insurance in case we as individuals do something stupid. Our bikes, when put in the van at the end of the trip, will not be insured by the van driver or the van insurance - and because there is no "leader" , merely a co-ordinater, not insured by the non-existent leader, either. It'll be just like LonJog in that respect.
This is because the CTC insurance does not cover a leader of an Affiliated group such as the Fridays when abroad. I hope I have made myself clear. Any questions, just post them on here and I'm sure someone will answer them......
On a matter of no importance to some but of great magnitude for others: obviously we are all chums on this trip and going as a group of friends and all decisions will be made as a group of friends, rather than as a group of sheep being led by a leader. So it is fortunate then, that we will all be members of the CTC and have its third party liability insurance in case we as individuals do something stupid. Our bikes, when put in the van at the end of the trip, will not be insured by the van driver or the van insurance - and because there is no "leader" , merely a co-ordinater, not insured by the non-existent leader, either. It'll be just like LonJog in that respect.
This is because the CTC insurance does not cover a leader of an Affiliated group such as the Fridays when abroad. I hope I have made myself clear. Any questions, just post them on here and I'm sure someone will answer them......
StuAff
Silencing his legs regularly
- Location
- Portsmouth
Clear enough. Might be an idea to make yourself Leader for the purpose of date selection (after consulting with Friendly & Efficient Van Driver) & let everyone else sort it after that.
StuAff
Silencing his legs regularly
- Location
- Portsmouth
June 13-21 sounds about right to me...
lilolee
Veteran
- Location
- Maidenhead
2nd'ed and that'll give me 2 weeks back before I go Up North for the start of the TdF
Andrew Br
Still part of the team !
- Location
- Chorlton Cum Hardy
No, you need at least a couple of 11s on there.2700071 said:
.
Andrew Br
Still part of the team !
- Location
- Chorlton Cum Hardy
This is the Fridays that we're talking about.
.
.
srw
It's a bit more complicated than that...
But that would make it a package holiday and be caught by tour operator regulations.
OP
OP
mmmmartin
Random geezer
This is a very important point, into which I have put a lot of research.
After my chat with CTC holidays, I think there is no chance of us offering a "package", which would be illegal under UK law - a criminal offence, no less
But we are going as a group of friends and there is no "package" on offer. Each person books their own ferry, accommodation and food. Each person is free to ride with their friends, or not, each day. The only money changing hands is a contribution towards the hire of the van. There is no profit being made from that. And to underline the point that there Is no package, there is no group insurance for our luggage while it is in the van and no group insurance for the bikes when they are being carried back to Caen. Each of us will need to ensure that we are happy with our own individual insurance for those sections of our holiday.
We are also OK on the question of whether we are "employing" the van driver and therefore have an obligation to him as employers, under, for instance, health and safety legislation. (For instance, expecting him to work unreasonable hours without a lunch break or driving when tired.) We are not paying him, and his transport and accommodation can't be seen as "payment in kind" either.
And we are OK on the issue of whether he is "providing a service" and therefore needs third party liability (remember we have CTC third party liability as CTC members but he will be driving a van so his CTC membership will not cover him for that.) The van insurance will cover him for while he is driving the van.
Various emails and phone conversations have taken up a lot of time and I have had to explain how we operate as a club of individuals rather than as a group. The end result is summarised in my earlier post about going as a group of friends not as an organised group going on a package.
After my chat with CTC holidays, I think there is no chance of us offering a "package", which would be illegal under UK law - a criminal offence, no less
But we are going as a group of friends and there is no "package" on offer. Each person books their own ferry, accommodation and food. Each person is free to ride with their friends, or not, each day. The only money changing hands is a contribution towards the hire of the van. There is no profit being made from that. And to underline the point that there Is no package, there is no group insurance for our luggage while it is in the van and no group insurance for the bikes when they are being carried back to Caen. Each of us will need to ensure that we are happy with our own individual insurance for those sections of our holiday.
We are also OK on the question of whether we are "employing" the van driver and therefore have an obligation to him as employers, under, for instance, health and safety legislation. (For instance, expecting him to work unreasonable hours without a lunch break or driving when tired.) We are not paying him, and his transport and accommodation can't be seen as "payment in kind" either.
And we are OK on the issue of whether he is "providing a service" and therefore needs third party liability (remember we have CTC third party liability as CTC members but he will be driving a van so his CTC membership will not cover him for that.) The van insurance will cover him for while he is driving the van.
Various emails and phone conversations have taken up a lot of time and I have had to explain how we operate as a club of individuals rather than as a group. The end result is summarised in my earlier post about going as a group of friends not as an organised group going on a package.
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