This Wiggins incident has brought the numpties out...

[psmiffy]

However, I wonder if registration might have a positive effect on cyclists' behaviour too, the obverse side of your point 2 seems to be that not insuring/registering a car does appear to have an effect on people's driving:

'These uninsured drivers are 10 times more likely to have been convicted of drink driving, and are five times more likely to have been involved in road collisions, to fail to comply with other road traffic requirements and to be engaged in other criminal activity.'

The only reason that the majority (and thankfully that is a relatively small percentage of the overall driver population) of uninsured/unlicensed drivers are unlicensed is because they were bad drivers in the first place - measures to modify their behavior were simply not effective on the first, second, n+1 time.

Does the driving test really teach people to drive safely or is it just a chore to be done to get a licence - people need to know that if they drive badly in an unsafe manner that there will be consequences - an outcome that will only come about if there is a properly funded effective traffic police and effective sanctions in the courts - It should not be like that but unless what may seem to be harsh measures are taken peoples behavior will not change for the better.

 

[Bromptonaut]

All the pullava around car ownership (registration, licences and mandatory insurance) are a direct result of people dying in thousands. Not now, in today's traffic, but 70-80 years ago. They were a response to a real problem.

Less than two people a year are killed by pedal cycles and 100-120 cyclists die in accidents - mostly caused by motor vehicles.

It's simply not worth the effort to try and treat bikes like cars. And that's before the practical problem like where do you put a registration plate? - presumably it needs to be clearly visible by both eye and camera. How about bikes owned by kids, what's the minimum age to ride/own?

 

[benb]

Fair enough - at what point does it become worth it though? London in particular seems to have seen a real rise in the numbers of people cycling, so is it something that should be monitored?

Yes, it's certainly something we should consider from time to time. I personally don't think it's likely that bicycles will ever be involved in so many hit and runs that such a system will be worthwhile.

 

[Bromptonaut]

What's the ballpark cost of 3rd party insurance for a push bike? I should get some myself to be honest...

You might find it's covered by your house insurance. Otherwise most obtain it as part of package of being in CTC, London Cycling Campaign or similar. Annual cost for whole package £20-£50.

 

[Alun]

Maybe another option is to have more police on the streets who are actually willing to pull people over for bad cycling?

What duties would you take the officers off, so that they could manage this?

 

[dodd82]

All the pullava around car ownership (registration, licences and mandatory insurance) are a direct result of people dying in thousands. Not now, in today's traffic, but 70-80 years ago. They were a response to a real problem.

Less than two people a year are killed by pedal cycles and 100-120 cyclists die in accidents - mostly caused by motor vehicles.

A fair point indeed.

 

[Davidsw8]

What duties would you take the officers off, so that they could manage this?

Just asking that they do their existing job. I've seen (the rare) policeman on the street, stand by and watch cyclists run red lights and pavement cycle. As far as I can see, if he's patrolling the street anyway and someone breaks the law, it's his job to act. Or have I misunderstood the point of what the police do?

 

[Nigel-YZ1]

I notice the BBC site Have Your Say was closed pretty quickly.

 

[psmiffy]

What duties would you take the officers off, so that they could manage this?

I would make traffic policing self funding - supply and demand- People parking wiily niilly was clogging up the town I live in - years ago the council took over the parking control duties - the number of traffic wardens went up from around 2 to over 140 - very profitable and self funding - over a relatively short time peoples parking habits changed for the better and there is now not a parking problem in the town- became unprofitable for the council to run the service and has now been outsourced

 

[Davidsw8]

All the pullava around car ownership (registration, licences and mandatory insurance) are a direct result of people dying in thousands. Not now, in today's traffic, but 70-80 years ago. They were a response to a real problem.

Less than two people a year are killed by pedal cycles and 100-120 cyclists die in accidents - mostly caused by motor vehicles.

It's simply not worth the effort to try and treat bikes like cars. And that's before the practical problem like where do you put a registration plate? - presumably it needs to be clearly visible by both eye and camera. How about bikes owned by kids, what's the minimum age to ride/own?

That's people being killed though, is that what it takes for a change to happen? How about the people injured or even those people knocked over and aren't hurt that much or who have their car damaged? There must be tons of incidents that go unreported because the victims know nothing can be done without any way of ID'ing the cyclist.

Re: the minimum age thing, I'd say if they're old enough to ride on the road, they're old enough to be registered

 

[Davidsw8]

I would make traffic policing self funding - supply and demand- People parking wiily niilly was clogging up the town I live in - years ago the council took over the parking control duties - the number of traffic wardens went up from around 2 to over 140 - very profitable and self funding - over a relatively short time peoples parking habits changed for the better and there is now not a parking problem in the town- became unprofitable for the council to run the service and has now been outsourced

You've just reminded me of a conversation I had with a police officer a couple of months ago when he was security marking my bike for me.

We were talking about the problem of RLJ'ing cyclists and he said the police are looking in to doing more and it is possible for this to be entirely self-funding. Put a policeman next to a set of traffic lights for the day and they'll more than earn their days' wage back in fines issued...

 

[subaqua]

From Metro this morning: http://www.metro.co.uk/news/917393-...dley-wiggins-and-shane-sutton-hurt-in-crashes

"Chris Peck, from cycling campaign group CTC, said such accidents were far too common with drivers admitting they had not seen cyclists."

I'd change 'not seen' to either 'saw you and didnt care' or 'didnt bother looking'.

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/wiggins-down.117226/post-2142839

 

[Alun]

Just asking that they do their existing job. I've seen (the rare) policeman on the street, stand by and watch cyclists run red lights and pavement cycle. As far as I can see, if he's patrolling the street anyway and someone breaks the law, it's his job to act. Or have I misunderstood the point of what the police do?

The police have to prioritise their work, and whilst it might be satisfying to see an officer chasing a cyclist down the street shouting "Oi, you stop !" I don't think that it would be very effective.
They would have to have dedicated support from other officers in strategic places, maybe a car or motorcycle waiting to assist in apprehending the offender.
They would then be criticised for not catching "real" criminals like bank robbers, drug dealers etc.

 

[Davidsw8]

The police have to prioritise their work, and whilst it might be satisfying to see an officer chasing a cyclist down the street shouting "Oi, you stop !" I don't think that it would be very effective.
They would have to have dedicated support from other officers in strategic places, maybe a car or motorcycle waiting to assist in apprehending the offender.
They would then be criticised for not catching "real" criminals like bank robbers, drug dealers etc.

How about the police sometimes sat on motorbikes at the Trafalgar Sq end of The Mall? I reckon they could catch up with a cyclist in heavy London traffic

To be honest though, I'm really not sure what the point is in having legislation if it's not enforced, why not just wipe those laws from the books and save everyone the hassle of having to think about it.

Apparently, none of these misdemeanors cause any harm anyway...

 

[martint235]

The police have to prioritise their work, and whilst it might be satisfying to see an officer chasing a cyclist down the street shouting "Oi, you stop !" I don't think that it would be very effective.
They would have to have dedicated support from other officers in strategic places, maybe a car or motorcycle waiting to assist in apprehending the offender.
They would then be criticised for not catching "real" criminals like bank robbers, drug dealers etc.

At the crossroads of Waterloo Bridge Road and The Cut in London, they stationed bike officers at each corner. I saw a roadie go through a red, the shout went up and the copper I was near saw he obviously wasn't going to catch said roadie on a low geared MTB so he just threw the bike in front of the roadie who stopped. Bloke nicked, fined, job done.