Truing road wheels - risk?

[Sittingduck]

Hi

I have Campagnolo Khamsin wheels that have just 27 spokes on the rear (see pic)

The rear one went out of true during a long overnight ride on Fri/Sat and I was forced to ride something like 45 miles with the brake slackened right off! To begin with the "buckle" was fairly slight but by the time I reached my destination it was pretty bad (no thanks to a very bumpy path). I resisted the temptation to try and true it on the fly, as I thought this might not be a good idea dellzeqq advised me that it is not something to be messed with in such circumstances.

Anyway I got the old spoke key out this afternoon and had a good go at it. By no means 100% perfect but not bad now - close enough to true. My question is this: Are there any risks in having a go at sorting it out yourself on these type of wheels - are they more prone to fail spectacularly than the old fashioned 36 spoke type ones, after they have had this happen once? I am pretty heavy, so the chances of such things happening on rear wheels are increased for me I suppose

 

[Gerry Attrick]

IMHO the reason for the wheel going out of true is important. If it gradually moved, then this is usually easily rectified using a good (I stress good) spoke key and very gradual tightening/slackening (1/4 turn at a time) of the spokes involved.

However, if the wheel has been damaged by impact of a pothole for instance, then it may be that the rim has been damaged beyond repair and replacement is necessary.

From what you say, and the fact you have got it nearly true, it is maybe the former, and a little more tinkering could well sort it.

If you go along this line, then after adjustment, ping each spoke with a screwdriver to see if the notes you get on each side of the wheel are approximately the same. If they are, then you should be ok. Bear in mind though that the notes you get from the drive side will be higher than the non-drive side due to their shorter length.

Best of luck!

 

[Sittingduck]

Yeah - that's kind of what I thought Lee. The pitches of the spoke twangs are not all the same now. I adjusted it a 2nd time to make them sound more similar but then it threw the shape out again

Had to go around it a 3rd time to re-straighten the rim but the twangs are out now! I really don't fancy having to commute tomorrow on my hybrid I should probably do so though and take the wheel along to Brixton Cycles after I get home from work.

Thx

 

[Gerry Attrick]

Yeah - that's kind of what I thought Lee. The pitches of the spoke twangs are not all the same now. I adjusted it a 2nd time to make them sound more similar but then it threw the shape out again

Had to go around it a 3rd time to re-straighten the rim but the twangs are out now! I really don't fancy having to commute tomorrow on my hybrid I should probably do so though and take the wheel along to Brixton Cycles after I get home from work.

Thx

You replied to this whilst I was typing. I would seriously consider replacement from what you have just reported.

 

[Sittingduck]

IMHO the reason for the wheel going out of true is important. If it gradually moved, then this is usually eaily rectified using a good (Istress good) spoke key and very gradual tightening/slackening of the spokes involved.

However, if the wheel has been damaged by impact of a pothole for instance, then it may be that the rim has been damaged beyond repair and replacement is necessary.

From what you say, and the fact you have got it nearly true, it is maybe the former, and a little more tinkering could well sort it.

If you go along this line, then after adjustment, ping each spoke with a screwdriver to see if the notes you get on each side of the wheel are approximately the same. If they are, then you should be ok. Bear in mind though that the notes you get from the drive side will be higher than the non-drive side due to their shorter length.

Best of luck!

I cross-posted GA while you were typing

I don't recall hitting any potholes but could hear something rubbing a bit and it just didn't feel right. During the next stop my fears were confirmed when span it to see the rim brushing against the brake blocks

 

[Sittingduck]

Indeed^ I have already been considering swapping out the wheels, as I had some problems with the freehub that I managed to sort out but involved some open-heart surgery on it and it just isn't the same since

Got my eye on a nice set of Eastons but again they have a lower spoke count. These are a slightly cheaper option (but only 24 spokes on the rear).

I was chatting to "O" (the artist formally known as Origamist) on the train home from the ride and he suggsted a set of hand built Mavics, which is something that appeals, since I have one of these on my hybrid and have been very impressed. Did a bit of research and quite like the look of the Mavic Open Pro rims. Can anybody suggest a place I can get a set of these puppies hand built with maybe 32 spokes on the front and 36 on the rear - must be Campag compatible

 

[dodgy]

Don't get too focused on even spoke tension, although obvsiously it is somewhat desirable, a well trued and tensioned wheel will not always have completely even tension all the way around the wheel.

All spokes even tension
Perfectly true
Strong

Choose 2

The same concept applies to truing your khamsin wheels as it does for a standard 32 or 36 hole rim. Personally I'd have had a go at truing it while out on it, but appreciate that's not for everyone. Almost certainly you would have had to tighten one or two spokes up, as spokes loosen with age and seldom if ever tighten on their own unless you've had a big knock and the rim is pulled one way.

 

[Will1985]

IME G3s should be done at an LBS, and even more so for the higher end models (Zonda-Eurus-Shamal-Bora) with straight pull spokes.

 

[Sittingduck]

Thx for the replies. Given that I have had a go at it myself, would I be okay to take it into an LBS and ask them to correct / check it or might I have screwed it up already?

 

[Gerry Attrick]

Thx for the replies. Given that I have had a go at it myself, would I be okay to take it into an LBS and ask them to correct / check it or might I have screwed it up already?

They won't know that! Take 'em in.

 

[Sittingduck]

They won't know that! Take 'em in.

Hmm but if it is almost true now - there's a chance they might hardly touch it and charge me anyway isn't there? If I don't fess up that I gave it a go myself any underlying damage I may have done might go undetected

 

[mattsccm]

If you are worried that they might do nowt but charge you I suggest you try another shop!
Keep trying if you are so inclined. No real harm will come as long as you do things a bit at a time.
I must admit I am a great believer in conventional wheels as they are always mch easier to have a go at

 

[Sittingduck]

Roger that - will take it down to Brixton Cycles sometime this week.

 

[02GF74]

don't assume the LBS can do the fancy low spoke wheels - I had a set of rolf vector - spoke got damaged in delivery that I took to LBS for trueing - they said they can;t do it and sent them away to be done.

 

[Sittingduck]

Finally got chance to take it down to Brixton Cycles this afternoon. Had a bit of a chat with the guy in there but the upshot is that I need to take it in (and wait) one morning to their "Bike Surgery" so they can check it all over and service the hub (I had mentioned the previous problems with a broken pawl spring etc I had with it to him).

The wheel truing is a different matter really, as he took a look and said I had done a good job of truing it up myself, so nothing for them to do really. He checked the latteral movement and tested the tension in the spokes with his hand just quickly. He suggested it might not be worth throwing a lot of money at this wheel and I'm inclined to agree, so it looks like either a cheap and cheerful hub overhaul for £12 if I take it down Saturday morning. Or a new set of wheels...