Was this bus driver bad?
- Thread starter nethalus
- Start date
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BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
Taking it personally? No, and I'll bet the only reason Nethalus has agreed with your point of view is just to get you to stop posting.
So you say, but that's just adopting an inflexible attitude. It's quite easy to imagine how not stopping a bus in front of another road user with inferior brakes is quite a good idea. I think it would depend on all sorts of factors, such as how far in front the bus was. Regardless, neither of us were there, so it seems quite lacking for you to be so certain of what was right and wrong.
Cab said:
So you say, but that's just adopting an inflexible attitude. It's quite easy to imagine how not stopping a bus in front of another road user with inferior brakes is quite a good idea. I think it would depend on all sorts of factors, such as how far in front the bus was. Regardless, neither of us were there, so it seems quite lacking for you to be so certain of what was right and wrong.
BentMikey said:
You mean, you're not taking it personally, you're just intent on making lots of rather snide, rather insulting comments is because some unknown rational stance you're holding dictates that this is appropriate? I don't buy it.
The highway code is quite clear on this. And, really, there isn't much scope for out-accelerating a vehicle thats pulling past you. Its a dangerous manoevre at almost any time, and you know that to be true.
Look back at what Nethalus said, look back at her descriptions of what happened, and she has admitted what she did. And she knows, and has accepted, that she was in error on those things. I'm okay with that, she's okay with that. You have the problem; explain why you believe it is safe to out-accelerate a vehicle that has drawn level with you, thus depriving that road user of safe space to move back in, and potentially forcing them to remain out of position for longer than they had bargained for.
col said:Even after numerous mirror checks,and doing everything she was supposed to,you still wont give an inch on it ,will you cab?Even though the bike may be at fault here.incredible
The bike may be at fault. The bus driver still made a mistake in not spotting the bike. Happens though, its a genuine, innocent mistake and not one I'd string someone up for! The serious error is in then out-accelerating a vehicle that is overtaking you; she's accepted that error now. You don't?
col said:If the cycle had been in sight and had started to pass before she pulled off,i would agree with you.
Neither matters. She'd failed to spot the cyclist, the cyclist may or may not have been 'in sight', the truth is that the cyclist was there and she didn't see it. And then on spotting she tried to get by it by out accelerating it as it was overtaking. Against the specific advice of the highway code, dangerous, and probably illegal. I asked Nethalus not to do it again for those reasons, she's agreed, which tells me that she's not alltogether as bad as I'd first thought.
I still don't get why this is controversial; its highway code by the book and good road craft. What don't you accept?
Tynan said:
Check the highway code. Specifically:
Of course, often doing something contrary to what is advised by the highway code isn't enough to get you arrested. But if you have good safety advice in there, and in going against it you're doing something thats actually unsafe, then it ain't unlikely that it would be adjudged to be dangerous driving. You'll most likely never get done for it, but that doesn't really change anything. Woe betide you if you do have an accident attributable to this though, it'll be used as evidence against that you were behaving dangerously.
If someone is overtaking you, keep at your own speed. Don't accelerate. If you do that, you're increasing your own risk, risk for the overtaking vehicle, and risk for anyone on the other side of the road.
Nethalus was pulling out by the time she saw the cyclist, she then accelerated out as the cyclist was looking to overtake. She accelerated out of an overtaking manoevre. Its dangerous, contrary to the advice in the highway code and as I hope I've now explained, probably illegal.
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
You can't blame Nethalus if an overtaker chose to stay in the blind spot behind her bus. That would be the overtaker's fault, and yet you're assuming that the cyclist was in view and that Nethalus simply didn't spot her. Why can't you accept the possibility that your imagination of the possible incident might be wrong?
The bit of rule 168 you quote specifically applies to drivers. Why can't you accept that it might be safer for the bus to accelerate in this case and more quickly leave a safe space for the cyclist to go back into? Again you're making assumptions you shouldn't be.
You've failed to prove that Nethalus's actions were illegal.
Of course I accept that there are possible situations in which your assumptions might be right, but it's easy to see ones where you would be wrong. The problem is that you just want to be right, so you roundly dismiss any other possibility.
The bit of rule 168 you quote specifically applies to drivers. Why can't you accept that it might be safer for the bus to accelerate in this case and more quickly leave a safe space for the cyclist to go back into? Again you're making assumptions you shouldn't be.
You've failed to prove that Nethalus's actions were illegal.
Of course I accept that there are possible situations in which your assumptions might be right, but it's easy to see ones where you would be wrong. The problem is that you just want to be right, so you roundly dismiss any other possibility.
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
col said:Even after numerous mirror checks,and doing everything she was supposed to,you still wont give an inch on it ,will you cab?Even though the bike may be at fault here.incredible
Yes, Cab simply can't accept being wrong, ever. Do you remember that one on C+ where he complained about riding on the pavement, and simply wouldn't accept that he'd done anything wrong?
BentMikey said:
I wouldn't...
It would...
No I'm not.
Look, I'm bored with you not understanding what I'm saying, and I shan't explain again. Its there in front of you, in black and white, so if you're not going to deal with what I've actually said thats your own problem now.
domd1979
Veteran
- Location
- Staffordshire
Checking the mirrors properly and seeing that it is clear to pull out isn't "failed to spot". You can't expect the driver of a large vehicle to see everywhere at once. A responsible cyclist would be aware of that for their own safety - most sensible cyclists wouldn't go up the inside of an HGV, so I don't see why its seen as OK to try and overtake a bus which is moving out when you could well be in a blind spot on starting to attempt an overtake.
It would have been obvious to the cyclist from some distance that the bus was about to pull out, or was in the process of pulling out, and it would have been extremely easy for them just to ease off pedalling slightly and let the bus out without any difficulty. I don't want a lecture on it being the "cyclists decision" either...
If you had a proper appreciation of driving a large vehicle or had experience of it, I think you may well view the whole situation in a slightly different light - i.e. a realistic one.
It would have been obvious to the cyclist from some distance that the bus was about to pull out, or was in the process of pulling out, and it would have been extremely easy for them just to ease off pedalling slightly and let the bus out without any difficulty. I don't want a lecture on it being the "cyclists decision" either...
If you had a proper appreciation of driving a large vehicle or had experience of it, I think you may well view the whole situation in a slightly different light - i.e. a realistic one.
Cab said:
