A lesson from a coach driver...

[Crankarm]

Oh, stop pussyfooting around and just tell me I'm a to$$er!

Seriously though, yes I understand that it will irritate some road users, and I am certainly not out to do that. But that isn't my fault. That is the fault of the council who saw fit to put the poor quality lane there. If it wasn't there, there would be fewer problems on that road for all cyclists.

Why don't you approach your local council to see if they can send a road sweeper up it? It's got to be safer than continuing to ride as you are?

I think the coach might have pulled in prematurely because of oncoming traffic. The traffic looked to be moving quite quickly in both directions. I would be inclined to duck into the cycle lane if I saw a large vehicle such as a truck or coach approaching from behind. You are not going to win in any confrontation with a large vehicle or any vehicle for that matter at speed. You are not David to a Goliath.

Anyway perhaps you will consider contacting your LA to get the cycle lane cleared up so you can cycle in it safely which has got to better than sticking yourself out into fast moving traffic.

 

[hillrep]

Crankarm said

Why don't you approach your local council to see if they can send a road sweeper up it? It's got to be safer than continuing to ride as you are?

and

Anyway perhaps you will consider contacting your LA to get the cycle lane cleared up so you can cycle in it safely which has got to better than sticking yourself out into fast moving traffic.

Even if the cycle lane was cleaned it would still be too narrow, potholed and like cycling on a rumble strip (yes, I have cycled on it). The phrase "polishing a t*rd" comes to mind for some reason :-).

I have approached this particular LA to ask questions like:

why is the cycle lane on the opposite side of this road directly in the "door zone" beside parking bays

or

why is it too narrow

or

why have they put in dangerous pinch points

The answer is at best a polite variation on "_we_ think it is a good idea so its staying".

Interesting how this has drifted into the sport of mag-baiting and well away from the original incident in which a coach driver demonstrated how not to drive a coach!

 

[stowie]

I think the debate on whether Mags was correct in cycling slightly out from the cycle lane is immaterial (anyway - the lane looks narrow and crap, and he was only slightly out from the line). The first bad pass could be construed as poor driving, but the driver virtually admits he did it because mags was "in his way", and then proceeds to box him in and cut him off later on. All from a "professional" driver in charge of a large vehicle. Surely this is unacceptable, no matter whether a cyclist is doing something daft or not. A trained driver shouldn't use his vehicle as an intimidation tool, no matter what the more vulnerable user is up to.

Having said this, I suspect the driver was irritated because he couldn't barrel past Mags without moving position - something I think he would have done had Mags been in the cycle lane. Thus indicating the fact that even some "professional" drivers have scant regard for overtaking space, and that cycle lanes that are too narrow such as this one puts a cyclist in more danger, not less.

Mags- I would report him. If he hadn't carried on the intimidating driving after the poor pass, I would put it down to a poor overtake and probably forget it, but it appears the driver was more than willing to make his point with a large vehicle. Unacceptable in my book.

 

[Sheffield_Tiger]

As I stated on YT, at least with such an overtake, being outside the CL gves the CL as an option to escape into. Rather than being stuck between a vehicle and the kerb.

 

[PK99]

My reasons for not using the cycle lane in this video are contained within the video itself.

The driver of this coach disagrees with them and decided to teach me where I should be by trying to force me left with the end of his coach.

I initially though the overtake from this coach was going to be fine, but he slowed as he passed me and swung his rear end towards me. I could easily have placed my palm on the back of his coach.

I think a wee e-mail will be heading to the coach company.

I take issue with you positioning - if you are not going to use the cycle lane then surely, you should be in primary or secondary position for the lane you occupy. the video show you "in the gutter" for the traffic lane you are in (38s in shows your exact position)

 

[Cab]

I take issue with you positioning - if you are not going to use the cycle lane then surely, you should be in primary or secondary position for the lane you occupy. the video show you "in the gutter" for the traffic lane you are in (38s in shows your exact position)

That might be a fair cricitism; its a tough call, where to be if you're not using a cycle lane. You can argue that primary position on the road doesn't change, or you an instead argue that the cycle lane creates a new 'gutter' and to be most visible you need to be in primary in the main lane. Tough judgement call, that one.

Either way, cyclist in primary, secondary or right on the gutter, its still the responsibility of the overtaking vehicle to pass safely, regardless of the cyclists position. And therefore to a great extent discussing the cyclists position in relation to a dangerous overtake is always a little bit of a red herring. Yes, you can be more noticeable, more in a position to make careless motorists more likely go around you properly, but all of that said it remains the fault of the overtaker if the pass is too close.

Here, the bus passed too close. Its his fault.

 

[Cab]

So without trying to troll or flame or whatever the techno expression is (perhaps "doing a Bruce" is more vogue), I think your position (justified or not) will cause a negative reaction from many road users.

The problem here is that while we all know that there are many reasons why we may choose (validly) to not use the cycle lane, the moton (here I'm referring to the idiots behind the wheels of cars, not the average motorist) does not. This is why a bad cycle lane is worse than no cycle lane at all.

When the choice becomes one of 'use a bad cycle facility or face increased aggression from a sizeable minority of motorists', there isn't a right answer. Either choice will make your journey less safe than it should be.

 

[Origamist]

The problem here is that while we all know that there are many reasons why we may choose (validly) to not use the cycle lane, the moton (here I'm referring to the idiots behind the wheels of cars, not the average motorist) does not. This is why a bad cycle lane is worse than no cycle lane at all.

When the choice becomes one of 'use a bad cycle facility or face increased aggression from a sizeable minority of motorists', there isn't a right answer. Either choice will make your journey less safe than it should be.

All true. What I would add is that you need to understand the potential consequences of adopting different positions on the road relative to a cycle lane. For example, if you're riding to the right of the lane and a large vehicle is approaching from behind, you'd do well to defer to the left (assuming there was not a serious impediment) as it's often going to be a squeeze. If you're riding in the cycle lane you may well have to suck up closer overtakes as many drivers will use the cycle lane marking as a guide to how much passing space you'll be allocated etc.

 

[jonny jeez]

Oh, stop pussyfooting around and just tell me I'm a to$$er!

I would never call you a tosser Mags.

However, if your guilty conscience requires a little personal flagellation, then try this on for size.

....you have, without doubt, the highest pitch, most girliest "Angry" voice of any scotsman I have ever come across.

 

[magnatom]

i just don't see it, sorry mags. there is at least another 2 foot of useable road to the left. if you used it, you would of had a nicer day. are you one of the blokes who drives down the middle lane of motorways because its what the hc calls the fast lane?

Yet another wild claim about me. I don't think it is my cycling you don't like, I think it is me.

Why don't you do a search on cyclechat to see what my view are on middle lane driving. I'm sure I've made a comment before.

I've intentionally not linked to another thread I posted a while back, until now. I thought I would let this run on its own merits first. However, let me now point you to this thread. It would seem that someone on the local community council agrees with me about the cycle lane as well!

 

[magnatom]

I cycled along the same section today taking the same line. The road was actually busier. I had no problems whatsoever.

I paid attention to my positioning and I considered why I chose that position. The road is actually quite wide here and if i take a position outside the lane cars etc can pass me with a good margin of safety whilst only just touching the white line with their right wheels. This is what the majority of cars do. It means that they aren't held up at all by me (or only by a few seconds), and they don't seriously interfere with oncoming traffic (nice wide lane on the other side as well).

Everyone is happy. Sure an HGV or a bus has to take a bit more care and wait for a gap in oncoming traffic, but there are plenty of gaps and they are never held up for more than 10 seconds or so.

If I get a chance I'll post a video of today with some commentary. My camera yesterday had a smudge on it, so the picture wasn't as clear as normal. Hopefully todays footage will be clearer.

 

[magnatom]

I've just had a look at the footage. Here is a picture from the cycle path at the same place as yesterdays incident. Does this look like a path in good condition to you?

 

[Cab]

It looks like detritus from some rather nasty pot holes. Has the road recently been patched up?

 

[magnatom]

It looks like detritus from some rather nasty pot holes. Has the road recently been patched up?

That's the funny thing. This road isn't too bad with potholes.

 

[beastie]

Here's the cycle lane on my commute, would you use this one? It's about 2 feet wide.



http://http://maps.google.co.uk/?ie...=WxLy1dZ8cT5cu2gNJQsIAg&cbp=12,74.51,,0,19.06