A Worrying & Serious Near Incident!

[benb]

Hi Ben,

Not the case at all. As mentioned previously, I am totally aware of the 'safe' maximum speed a bend can be taken at and how to calculate it.

Please read my post above yours.

Best regards

Chris

Hi

In that case I'm confused. You say that if you were going at 40 you would have hit the cyclist, yet the bend is safe to negotiate at 40. One of those is wrong.

 

[oldfatfool]

Now try posting the same OP on Pistonheads where there are non cyclist drivers as opposed to non driving cyclists.

Both groups in my humble opinion are equally bigoted and that is without bothering to read the 7 pages here. Until we get an infrastructure where cyclists and cars don't share the same space then this will not change

 

[G2EWS]

Hi

In that case I'm confused. You say that if you were going at 40 you would have hit the cyclist, yet the bend is safe to negotiate at 40. One of those is wrong.

Hi Ben,

Sorry to say it again but read my post above yours where the answer will become clear!! Honest!!

Best regards

Chris

 

[Scruffmonster]

Hi Jamie,

Having been taught by the man who wrote the Police chase manual to drive round a bend, I can confirm that I was well within the 'safe' speed for the bend.

But I think you are right, any vehicle that has stopped becomes a danger. If you broke down on a bend, the first and safe thing you would surely do, is let oncoming motorists know by alerting them before the bend.

A conundrum for sure!

Regards

Chris

No. You were not. If you cannot stop in the space that you can see, you're going too fast.

 

[Scruffmonster]

Look guys, stop making this a personal attack on me.

I am opening this up for debate. I have no doubt in my mind that there is not one amongst you who would have travelled round that bend at 20 mph. So lets cut to the chase and debate the issue rather than making it about me.

The issue is, what do we need to do to make it safe for cyclists and motorists alike. Should we be enforcing a speed limit around a bend that is much slower than we originally thought was correct?

I don't have an issue with discussing the possible solutions.

As suggested, when you are next out in the car and perhaps on roads like I have shown, that you use on a regular basis, check and be honest with yourself, did you travel around the bend at a speed that could avoid ANY possible eventuality?

Best regards

Chris

It's a MAXIMUM speed limit, not a minimum.

Link your speed to vision and you won't go far wrong. Police yourself. Someo wont, but you're only in charge of you.

 

[benb]

Hi Ben,

Sorry to say it again but read my post above yours where the answer will become clear!! Honest!!

Best regards

Chris

OK. I think you are saying that in normal circumstances you can negotiate the bend at 40, and still stop in the road you can see. Is that right?

Therefore in the original incident you were going to fast for those specific circumstances, would you agree?

 

[Dan_h]

Hi All,

Since being a born again cyclist once again I have been enjoying my commutes and weekend rides when I get the chance.

Having cycled into the office today, I had to pop down to Fordingbridge from my office in Market Lavington. So I took the Land Rover which my Wife had driven to work.

I went from Market Lavington into West Lavington and turned left (South) towards Salisbury on the A360. As you come out of West Lavington and into the unrestricted 60 mph zone you approach a left hand bend:

West Lavington, Wiltshire SN10

I drove round this bend at about 45 mph which in my opinion was a sensible speed.

As I got round, in front of me and riding sensibly and close to the side in secondary position was one of two cyclists. The 2nd being about 10 - 15 M further on.

I reacted very quickly and slammed on the brakes allowing the ABS to take over. I missed the Woman by no more than 1 M!

If she had been 10 M further back, there is no question in my mind that I would have hit her. Swerving was not an option, nor overtaking as the road is narrow and there was a stream of vehicles coming the other way.

For the rest of my journey and return I pondered over what I might have done differently or indeed the cyclist could have done to make her life safer.

As I say, she was cycling well and up a steep hill. No undue wobble and quite obviously in the correct gear as was her male partner.

I have travelled that road faster and considered myself to be driving safely. Indeed, if I had been in my Wife's BMW 6 series, I would almost certainly have been travelling nearer to 60 mph.

As far as I can see the only quantifiable change would be for me to have been travelling around the bend at no more than 30 mph and possibly slower. But how practical could it be to travel on roads like this and slow down to 30 mph or slower for every bend? It just would not work.

I remember in the 70's an advert of a car travelling around country lanes and around every bend there was a space ship on the middle of the road. They then re run the same route and instead of a spaceship they had a herd of cows, a broken down car and a cyclist.

It has certainly got me thinking of how we as motorists and cyclists should travel on our roads!

Best regards

Chris

I have to say, after reading this whole thread I am unsure what you want to debate exactly. You wan't to discuss how motorists and cyclists can live together safely? Slow down!!! all of your points above would be fixed by that.

Think about it...

(1) I reacted very quickly and slammed on the brakes allowing the ABS to take over. I missed the Woman by no more than 1 M! - If you were going slower you would have had time to react and not have to rely on the technology built into your vehicle to get you out of your mess.

(2) If she had been 10 M further back, there is no question in my mind that I would have hit her. Swerving was not an option, nor overtaking as the road is narrow and there was a stream of vehicles coming the other way.- There is a way you could have avoided hitting her, you could have been travelling slower.

(3) As I say, she was cycling well and up a steep hill. No undue wobble and quite obviously in the correct gear as was her male partner.- So she was doing everything correctly, the fault is not hers.

(4) I have travelled that road faster and considered myself to be driving safely. Indeed, if I had been in my Wife's BMW 6 series, I would almost certainly have been travelling nearer to 60 mph. - It would seem like you need to reconsider that you were driving safely, the evidence would seem to suggest otherwise. Now you know this you do have an opportunity to change the way you travel on this and other similar roads.

(5) As far as I can see the only quantifiable change would be for me to have been travelling around the bend at no more than 30 mph and possibly slower. But how practical could it be to travel on roads like this and slow down to 30 mph or slower for every bend? It just would not work. - If that is the speed at which it is safe to take that bend then that is what you must do. Dont give me any bollocks about I would be hit from behind, even a car doing 60 behind you would only be closing at 30 mph, which in your estimation is safe.

Seriously, you had a near miss and thought about it, at least you thought about it! But the takeaway from this is that if the cyclist was doing nothing wrong and you still nearly hit her then you need to look at what you were doing. By the fact that you had to stamp on the brakes and hope for the best the answer is clear, you were travelling too fast for that part of the road. The fact that you can take the corner faster does not mean that you were travelling at the right speed this time, it means that you take the corner way to fast the other times!

I try not to get involved in these long heated arguments but I feel that this comes to the heart of a lot of the incidents that I read about and hear about. People need to take responsibility for their actions. There is no point in debating road design or mirrors or seperating cyclists from cars. these are all great things that are not going to be implemented everywhere at once. However in this instance there is a clear action that can be taken, in future take the corner slower so you are safe and other road users are safe.

Right I am going to put nmy soap box away and go and get a beer!

 

[G2EWS]

I have enjoyed this debate, but it is sad that some people just don't want to read the complete thread and then comment. Assuming what I have said is not the way to go Dan, sorry mate you are talking a lot of Bollocks yourself. Good idea to get of a wobbly soapbox!

Regards

Chris

 

[Dan_h]

I have enjoyed this debate, but it is sad that some people just don't want to read the complete thread and then comment. Assuming what I have said is not the way to go Dan, sorry mate you are talking a lot of Bollocks yourself. Good idea to get of a wobbly soapbox!

Regards

Chris

I will be much wobblier after a beer! However my point stil stands - You made a mistake, you got away with it. We all make mistakes, the thing to do is accept that you did and next time slow down.

 

[G2EWS]

OK. I think you are saying that in normal circumstances you can negotiate the bend at 40, and still stop in the road you can see. Is that right?

Therefore in the original incident you were going to fast for those specific circumstances, would you agree?

Hi Ben,

I will point out the most important bit of my statement:

I believe that the biggest problem was probably that I was not as alert as I should have been, which the lights would have got over. But that does not excuse the fact that I, very likely similar to others was just not thinking properly or quickly. It is too easy to become involved with a drive and be contemplating the end result of that journey, rather than being alert to EVERY danger.

So as I have stated, the bend is a 40 mph one, but I now realise I was just not alert and concentrating enough to deal with every potential danger, including a cyclist.

It has definitely made me think again about my driving and the end result is I will concentrate more as I go round a bend or just drive in general.

As I have also stated, I am pleased I put this up on the forum. By questioning my own actions I have hopefully made others question theirs. We may believe we do the right thing all the time but I just wonder how many of us really do?

A friend called in this morning and I explained what happened. He promptly told me that he thinks about every bend and what danger lurks around it. I replied, 'You know, if you had told me the same had happened to you, I would have told you I think about the danger around every bend'!

The fact is, I have now proved to myself that I did not and I wonder how many of us don't do what we say? I bet a lot of you who have posted on this thread, have concentrated more when driving! So the thread has been a good one if we have this as a result I think you will agree?

Best regards

Chris

 

[G2EWS]

I will be much wobblier after a beer! However my point stil stands - You made a mistake, you got away with it. We all make mistakes, the thing to do is accept that you did and next time slow down.

I just don't get why you cannot read the whole thread?

Regards

Chris

 

[fossyant]

Very sorry to hear the officer died.

On a lighter note, he probably read this thread and lost the will to live. 7 pages.....?

 

[Dan_h]

I just don't get why you cannot read the whole thread?

Regards

Chris

Read it, obviously missed the part where you said "Oh yes, perhaps I was travelling too fast".

 

[G2EWS]

Read it, obviously missed the part where you said "Oh yes, perhaps I was travelling too fast".

Sure did Dan, because it is not there.

Oh well, you can lead a horse to water!

Guess you can't be bothered eh?

Best regards

Chris

 

[G2EWS]

Very sorry to hear the officer died.

On a lighter note, he probably read this thread and lost the will to live. 7 pages.....?

I should have pointed out that he was our neighbour.

Best regards

Chris